MGM poker rooms raising rake to $6

When do we raise the stakes? Could make an argument it’s time to abolish 1/3 games and the new low stake standard should be 2/5 $200-$500

While this sounds logical it would create a huge gap. A lot of new players and fish are afraid to play 2/5, despite the Bellagio 2/5 playing exactly as big as Aria 1/3.

Someone in the Bellagio thread posted that it's going up there as well.

It's an MGM casino.

this is a completely dumb idea that ignores the reasons why 98% of the field plays poker. yes, people using poker as their only source of income and play to earn/win a living shouldn't rely on 1/3 but most people play for social fun and to give themselves a chance of winning some money after a few hours without putting $500-$1000 at risk in any one hand. people play craps, blackjack, slots and other gambling games for fun, not because there is a mathematical financial advantage.

you can win money at 1/3, even with a high rake. the vast majority of 1/3 players don't care about rake.

do I need to go on?

Yes, I know that - I was confirming that it was going up in another MGM room, as OP wasn't certain.

It's not a crazy argument. When I started playing LHE in a casino it was 1/2 (with a 50 cent SB) in Atlantic City. That stake died a long time ago. Then 2/4 was the smallest, and I don't know of anywhere in the country that still goes. I haven't seen 3/6 in a long time either; if it goes anywhere, it's certainly very rare.
Even for NL, there used to be a 1/1 game on the strip, but it's gone. 1/2 in most places has been changing to 1/3.

I don't really know if the smaller LHE games naturally died out, or if management euthanized them. The shift to 1/3 definitely seems to be due to the decisions of management.

That’s a great way to really kill live cash games.

40 years ago, the cheapest exacta bet at most racetracks in the US was $5. Today, the cheapest exacta bet at most racetracks in the US is 50 cents..

What's your point? Horse racing is dead compared to 40 years ago.

Not disagreeing with that point, but without lowering the cost of wagers there would BE no horse racing today, as we know it.

One can argue live poker is dead compared to 20 years ago. Making the price of live poker more expensive will only hurt the game and hasten its death.

How many Las Vegas poker rooms have closed in the past 20 years? 10? 15? 20? I’m pretty sure the actual number is over 20..

I’ve always thought inflation will eventually kill off Low live stakes poker, the rake will just keep going up as does minimal wage.

It actually took longer than I thought. I think only 3 rooms in Vegas don’t take a jackpot drop now.

Now I wonder how long it will take to get to $7. Probably not as long as it took to get $6.

It’s really not that radical when you look at inflation the past few years. There are some non US cities that only offer 2/5+ and those games are fine

This has been happening over the years anyways. Everything use to be 1/2 $60-200. Now it’s mostly 1/3 $100-300 with some rooms shifting up the max buy in to 4-500 as of late. We’re almost there at this point

1-2 and 1-3 are the stakes players want to play though. Just look at the lists. The rake could be $10 and that would still be the game people choose. Especially if there is a bad beat jackpot.

And fish know they are an underdog whether it’s slots, triple zero roulette, 6/5 blackjack or 1-3 NL with $6 rake. They don’t care about “beating the game.”

$1/3 with a $100 - $500 buyin should be the entry level game.

Yup, if all 1/3 disappeared in Vegas, I would quit going. Except maybe for the WSOP.

I would probably limit my trips too as 1/3 has made me the most money (over 30k in like 5 years) and I absolutely love the action. Sure 2/5 and even 5/10 can be incredibly fishy, but you rarely get the level of degeneracy as in 1/3.

Surely it would make more sense to first make 2/3 the minimum as a bridge to an eventual 2/5 min. Having to put in an extra dollar as SB doesn't sound too scary.

Agree.

At Oceans 11 casino in San Diego county where I normally play, 1/3 buy in is $30 minimum, $150 max buy in lol..

Just buy lottery tickets at that point.

But if the 1/3 did not exist, some of degens would be in the 2/5 if that is lowest stakes. But I would not rec this as ideal.

2/5NL, even 200-500 buyin is too big for lowest stakes. At one time this was our lowest stake NL but we had LHE to allow begginers to learn. In fact that is how I got started…3/6, then 4/8, 8/16. Then I moved to 15/30 @nd 2/5. When 1/3 match stacks came along, both the 15/30 and later the local 2/5 dried up. So I moved to NL.

Personally if we had mid stakes+ LHE I would likely still be a limit player but that is not viable. Heck, recently even the 4/8 limit games have died. Since we are match stack games (or no max) even 1/3 is a tough entry game for beginners. They have to really nit up and learn very quick to survive. I think it is one of the issues with this local market for poker. Make the lowest stakes 2/5 and the fish will be gone

Actually 2-2 and 2-4 LHE still runs in SFla. 3-6 is not hard to find in many places that have LHE including some in LV

Even MGM Borgata has 2-4-6-12. Not a 2-4 game but it is a game where max preflop price is $8. So I expect pre and flop it is a no foldem holdem game.

But yes limit is suffering and many if not most the lowest stakes are 4-8. Without low stakes limit games for people to start in, growth of live poker will be hindered.

Kind of a moot convo - no sane card room manager is going to make the executive decision to stop spreading 1/3. The game will continue as long as there is interest in playing it. Over a long time horizon, inflation, rake increases, and an aging poker demographic may kill the game, but we're talking at least a decade from now, probably longer.

Maybe true, but even that game will seem intimidating to some of the newer players.