2 Weird Combo Draw Spots from Live 2/5
Live FL 2/5. Played at three tables, mostly decent players on all, didn't feel I had much edge but wanted to play since I hadn't in a long time.
Had questions about 2 combo draw hands. The first one is mostly a turn bet/check question. Second one I thought I played fine, but it was the biggest hand of the night so worth posting.
#1:
J9hh in BB. MP (very nitty guy) raises to 20, folds to me, I defend. (40) Flop T79hh. I check, he bets 20, I raise to 75. He doesn't look happy but calls. (190) Turn Jx. I decide to check since JJ and 88 are both in his range and a raise would be a disaster for our hand. There aren't that many bad cards for me and I decide to look weak by mixing a check in rather than check raising and firing twice. I immediately regret this when he checks back and the Tx is put out on the river. I see no point in bluffing, could still beat Axhh, check check, he shows AA and wins.
#2:
85dd in BB. 5 handed. No one seems to be using proper short handed ranges, and V here has the lowest PFR at the table (15% or less I'd say). He opens to 20 from CO, aggro SB calls, I call. (60) Flop T54dd. Check check, opener bets 25, fold, I go to 75 (should have gone 100 probably), he calls. (210) Turn 7x. 125 he calls. (460). River 8x. I jam for 250-300 he asks for a count (???) then calls with T6 (not diamonds). I feel like this is a great hand to balance our flop check raise bet bet strong range with. I was planning on 3 barreling all but the worst rivers (A/K). River was weird since I am in a weird spot between bluff and value. Xf river feels awful but maybe I should have? Can't put him on a 6, or even a set really, and I thought I might get paid off with JJ-AA/a sticky T if he thinks I have busted diamonds.
5 Replies
H1 - Pre seems fine. Prefer just check-calling flop, and either donking out or going for the x/r on the turn. Our flop x/r is repping exactly J8, 2P, a set, or what we have, a big combo draw. We can get more value by check-calling flop and letting him barrel a brick turn.
If we check-raise the flop, it somewhat commits us to barreling the turn, unless we're just giving up with some draws that miss. Check-raising flop, checking turn, and then checking when the board pairs on the river is kind of a disaster.
H2 - Raise or fold pre when the SB flats. Don't love flat-calling with a middling suited 2-gapper like 85. It makes a better 3B bluff candidate than a flat call.
Again, prefer just flat calling flop to a check-raise. Probably check-call turn, too. Just not much reason to take such an aggro line with our hand when we're OOP against a nitty PFR. If he's not adjusting his pre-flop opening range correctly when short-handed, this board isn't going to connect with his range much, so we don't want to scare off his over-pairs and AK.
Jamming the river with 2P when there's four-to-a-straight and a busted flush draw on board seems pretty bad. What are we targeting for value here that can actually call a jam? Why not play our hand as a bluff-catcher, and check-call?
The fact that he showed T6 should make us question our read that he's nitty, and that he's not adjusting his PF opening ranges correctly. I don't know if T6s is an open from the CO when we're 5 handed, but it certainly doesn't seem nitty at all.
Thanks doc.
Wondering why no one else responded - is it because I broke the rules by divulging results?
I dunno.
Maybe they don't like you.
Actually, I don't think that's the reason. Some of them seem to hate me, and a lot of those seem to LOVE commenting on the hands I post.
Maybe it's just that you posted mid-day on a Sunday, and it's only Monday.
I'd say your HH are difficult to read. People generally aren't going to bother in the way you have laid it out. And especially when you have 2 of the paragraph style HHs it's even worse.
Anyways I trudged through the first hand.
Your logic is off. A nitty guy opens 88 and then calls a flop CR w/ a gut shot?
Doesn't add up. And how does he have JJ when you have a J? This should be one of his least likely hands.
Anyways bet the turn 3/4 -pot for value. Most of his range is going to be strong heart draws and over pairs.
Second hand I only read up until the flop, you should check call this hand. You are likely over valuing and raising combo draws way too often.
I'll take a stab here.
First hand I think is perfectly fine. I think I would bet small on the turn. You didn't post the effective stack size but we can easily call a raise with two pair and a straight flush draw. Checking river makes sense to me as well.
Second hand I would think is a pure fold pre-flop. Post-flop I think the best line here would be to size up a little on your flop check-raise and then overbet jam the turn. Once you bet turn small, the river is a pretty weird spot. You might be able to get called by a worse hand by jamming and you might be able to induce a bluff by checking. Neither option seems great.
