SB vs BB w/ Good TAG line check

Not sure J5s is a defend here. As played probably check back river.

He has so much Ax we can get value from on the river. Also KK QQ maybe even smaller pairs might look us up in this wide configuration of BvB.

Preflop is a pretty light call to 4x against a good player. Online, sure, fill your boots.

River what would your plan be facing a check-raise? This guy sounds capable of trying to get you off your exact hand. Of you feel like you would fold (or if you didn't want to make an uncomfortable decision), then I'd probably check back.

What hands are you raising turn with that aren't trips+ or a heart draw? When the heart draw comes in, I can see a decent player folding an Ace here (unless he thinks you are going to have a load of bluffs) or even turning the Ace into a bluff himself. If he shows down an Ace here you'll feel deflated but there's no guarantee a bet would have been called

J5s is definitely a defend here. BVB, the big blind defends almost all suited hands in GTO, only folding the pure trash like 72s and 83s. Crush Live Poker has pre-flop charts that are specifically designed for live play (deeper stacks, different rake, bigger opens) and their charts even defend 83s pre.

In this hand, I think I would XB flop, call turn, and then evaluate river (call or raise). On this particular river, I would call any size bet or bet if checked to.

Is chopping the blinds not a thing here? Cuz that's what I would do.

Otherwise I would just fold preflop. Our money in this game is coming from the guy crushing at 10+ bb/hr holding J high with no dead money in a raked game (albeit in position)? Mine ain't.

I'm fine with the flop check back.

I would just call the turn which let's him barrel worse, limits the damage when behind, plus doesn't blow him off weaker hands that we want him to continue with (admittedly I have a super nitty image to deal with).

Think I'm ok with the river checkback against this guy. Against moran calling stations who will pay off with Ax we have an easy value bet, but I doubt he's that guy. So if he calls a bet I'm not sure how we're ahead.

GcluelessNLnoobG

Yeah, as gobbledygeek pointed out what was the situation when it was folded to the blinds? I don't think this was a time game, and in 1/3 most players usually chop. Does he never chop? Did he just wanna play it this time (if that's the case I woulda auto-folded)?

Pre could go either way and I would most likely flat the turn to keep him in the hand and let him barrel the river (if he checks we can bet pot), but after he called the raise I think checking back is fine.

Assuming you can't chop, seems correctly played. River must be a bet for value say quarter to third pot. Why is everyone so scared here?!

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dont raise the turn and b/f 1/3 pot on the river.

i doubt pre is profitable assuming the pot is raked. if there is a timed rake instead seems standard.

I'm not scared, just being cautious.

When hero raised the turn after the jack paired the board and he called, what hands would he call with? Does he call Ax? (maybe). FD? (yes). Jx? (yes).

I would bet the river if I'm comfortable with bet/calling so if I don't like calling a river raise I would just check it back, but that's just me.

I would hate to give the best player at the table who's been crushing the game and 3betting hero relentlessly lately an opportunity to bluff us out otr so if I bet I'm pretty much bet/calling. If anyone at the table has river bluffs in them (or turn Ax into a bluff) it would probably be him.

I'll add the caveat that earlier in the session he opened the BTN cold to 12 and I woke up with AKo from SB and 3-bet to 45 and he snap folded so I know his range is position based.

And to answer the rake question, this game has a 10% rake to a max of 7$. People usually chop but this guy is from somewhere far away and takes his game very seriously. (tops up regularly, stays in the zone, doesn't engage in table talk, chooses tables and seats carefully).

Yes I assume there is a bunch of Ax here. Obviously we might be behind but value betting thin is ok. And yeah might call river raise. If he is tricky and can raise as bluff you can randomise by shuffling your cards to sometimes call.

I also don't like the idea of trying to get out of the way of a good player etc. I prefer the mentality of playing each hand as best as possible.

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i understand where you're coming from, but again i defer to how good players play on stream. they will 3b pre liberally, c/r flops with a fairly wide range, but basically never raise the river with a bluff. especially not when you've shown strength on the turn.

ive probably watched over 100 hours on youtube live streams, including very aggro games like on triton. ive seen one river bluff raise that i can remember, and it did not occur after a turn raise. it occurred vs a river bet on a card that was bad for the PFR's range.

and if good high stakes players dont do this, i dont see how good 1/3 players will. live players dont like to bluff turns and rivers in general. they especially dont like to bluff guys who are repping strong hands like trips. remember the bb could easily have a set with this action, and you could easily be river bluff raising into a boat.

so he never chops then?

Are you value bet/calling, or folding then?

I'm not trying to get away from him. Those types of players are like my bread and butter they're (for me at least) the easiet players to range and play against. If this wasn't a b vs b, it would be different but his range is almost ATC, so he would have practically all the FD's and all the other jacks in his range (I'm not discounting a jack too much just bc we block it). However don't miss understand me the decision is based on a couple sentences regarding his read, if I was in the game and knew him alil better who know's maybe I would bet/call for value then.

But in the streams, was there a player who has a lot of history with one of the villains and he's been 3betting him often and light trying to step all over him? There's a dynamic here beteen the OP and the guy who's tryna outplay him so it's gonna be different than people playing on a stream (I wouldn't really use streams to get better at poker since players, when they know everyone see's their cards, can play different than in a dynamic such as this one).

turn raise is quite bad vs 3/4 imo, im not even sure you can valuebet a brick

dunno lots of bad assumptions in this thread which seems to happen whenever hands get posted vs anyone that isnt entirely incompetent. like the guy is a 1/3 reg lol probably hes ok but hes a 1/3 reg. you dont need to worry about him running these sick turn b/c to xr bluff the river and all this other stuff, just play your hands. here its pretty obvious J is a good card for ip and oop is using a polarized sizing and you have near the worst trips u can have (he 4xs pre at high rake), so if you want to raise your trips here you want to do it linearly. this isnt a random whale thats going to check the flop with like top pair good kicker and bet large on the turn and call a raise and then pay off the river. play your range normally and youll be fine. i think him opening the button and folding to a 3b is not nearly enough evidence to decide "he plays positionally" (he may in fact do that but lol).

you have this weird polarized view of your opponents where they are either terrible or the best player ever and going to do all kinds of crazy stuff vs you. most of the hands you play vs people you think fall into the best player ever category you end up blowing up somewhere because you're so afraid of getting outplayed. just play your normal game and for the most part look at what's right in the solver and you will be fine. you are playing low stakes live no limit. i dont want to be mean but absolute sickos dont decide to go to the casino to grind out 20$ an hour.

I don’t think we should treat 15 as a 0.75 bet because pot is so small.

as the defender, unless you have node lock level reads, his size (and your range i suppose) is the only thing that matters. it should be pretty obvious to almost everyone let alone tag reg that studies that he can't really valuebet many / any ax (and be a favorite vs a calldown) for a large size on this turn and then any non ace river vs anyone that isn't absurd. i guess if op is raising every single trips combo ott he may qualify

if you want to tell yourself the pot is small so guy that studies is betting QQ/ KK / Ax and calling a raise and calling a river bet i think you're wrong but you're welcome to approach the situation like that

can see an argument to not approaching the 15 at as .75 bet because the open is 12 and he may not be factoring rake into his bet sizing but think its whatever and still too big to be this extremely depolarized sizing.

Ok I guess I bet fold here the river as I have better trips and flushes in my line. Probably boats I over bet pot then flushes and trips I take a smaller size and fold linearly if raised.

I think it's ok to have some bet fold here for a small size and this hand is at bottom of my bet range and unblocks the flush so I can fold.

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I think the hand was played fine on every street.

Result: