2/3 Fold, Call, or Raise?

2/3 Fold, Call, or Raise?

Feels like all 3 options sucked in this spot. Fold pre?

Orientation: 8 handed, saturday night, 2/3, hero is on the button ~620, CO has ~450, and BB covers hero with around ~650

Preflop: folds to CO who opens to 12 (CO had been opening to 15 or 20 w/ better hands), hero 3b! To 36 on button with 65dd, BB MAIN VILLAIN cold calls the 36 (big man, around age 40, drinking beers, just sat down 15-20 mins prior and is tagged aggro as in his first hand at table (300 behind) i was in SB with A5cc and made it 20, villain limp called, flop (43) AQ3 rainbow, hero check, villain 40, hero call, turn 9ss, hero check l, villain 100, hero fold) villain was also snap betting every decision within 5 seconds. CO calls

Flop (~108)

Ac9d7d

Checks to hero who bets 50, BB check raises quickly to 140, CO folds, hero??

Feels like all 3 options are terrible. Check back flop in the first place? Fold pre? Just call CO open preflop?

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13 January 2025 at 06:08 PM
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11 Replies



When I was reading the results I was hoping you checked, but you can't really classify someone as aggro after only one hand so he's basically a total unknown anyway so betting was fine.

Pre is a loose 3bet, for that price I would of called and expected the blinds to come along unless we knew either one of them to be 3betting in these spots and I would fold.

I can't see us 3beting 56s pre and flopping a combo draw only to fold to a 2.8x raise, I would call but you might be drawing dead to a flush. If we don't improve and he bets big I would just fold the turn (or you can fold now too since we don't have too much info on him).

Was this heads up? Pot should be 73 otf.


3 way to flop BB, CO, hero on button

by Playbig2000 k

When I was reading the results I was hoping you checked, but you can't really classify someone as aggro after only one hand so he's basically a total unknown anyway so betting was fine.

Pre is a loose 3bet, for that price I would of called and expected the blinds to come along unless we knew either one of them to be 3betting in these spots and I would fold.

I can't see us 3beting 56s pre and flopping a combo draw only to fold to a 2.8x raise, I would call but you might be drawing dead to a flush


I'm OK w/ 3betting that hand sometimes, but not normally against someone who is raising with good hands and with an aggro still to act. I don't hate it, though.

I'm fine with the bet on the flop, too. Not sure what to do now. Has he been raising other people over the past 20 minutes? Betting a lot, etc.? We are a bit deep to gii, but I don't mind a call to see a turn -- mainly because he seems the type to keep betting, and if we bink we get paid.

FWIW, not sure why you checked in the A5 hand? He probably sees you as weak, but who knows?


by Gor24do k

3 way to flop BB, CO, hero on button

ok disregard when I said it was ok to bet the flop, I would check it back then but that's just me. We have equity and it would suck if someone raised if we bet (or raised a lot more ; ) )


I can't unsee the action, but I don't like the flop bet, for although Ax hits your range and you have a great draw, this flop similarly smacks the range for someone calling a 3-bet in the BB as well as for the raise-caller.

I first wrote to call the c/r, but I'm changing my vote to fold. You have 6-high and could easily be up against AdXd, since Villain's range obviously contains AdQd, AdJd, AdTd, etc. Even if we robotically refer to MDF, it's difficult to see this hand making the cut, when we're going to have a lot of AA/AK/AQ/AdXd/99.

I don't like chasing draws where we could be drawing dead. Some people would consider getting stacked here on a flush to be a cooler, although to me it would just be the consequences of being reckless.


Flop bet is a bit big for multiway, esp on an ace high board. Probably go more like 1/4 pot or just check. We have a ton of equity so we can call a turn bet if we check flop and we will have a very disguised hand if it hits. TT-QQ is going to have a hard time calling 25 anyways and a pair on the board or draw isn't folding to 50.

It is pretty concerning that all the top pair nut flush draw and higher flush draws are possible.

I would not 3b flop to try to get drunk guy to fold AQo or whatever.

Only course of action is to call at this point and hope we aren't facing a better flush draw.

Preflop is neither printing nor torching. I probably wouldn't make this play if I wasn't sure CO would have a decent amount of folds. 3b is usually or fold is usually the play pre, if there is rake, but we can mix in some calls without rake.

One thing I would say about v is I wouldn't tag him as agro. He limp calls pre, so he us a rec. And he is drunk. You definitely want to target him. So that makes calling a little better than it would be otherwise pre, but our hand doesn't perform great multiway. It's always a plus to be able to get the hand heads up and potentially take it down on the flop with a cbet. I would much rather flat with a mid to low pocket pair on the button than flat with 65s.


My man put a whole hand history in a parenthetical aside in the preflop action for the actual hand history. That's almost as bad as putting your hole cards in the reads sec....

Pre is a bit suss for a Saturday night game with people drinking in the blinds.

Flop is fine pretty much regardless of range strat. This hand is strong enough to use as one of your top bluffs even when hyper-polarizing for this size.

Ain't no way am I folding 12 outs getting over 3:1. I'm not raising cold callers who raise postflop in these games as a standard, but it can be fine here as an exploit of the fact that he's clearly making polarity mistakes and to patch up the weakness of us basically having the nut low. Stacks are a little awkward (shove is ~1.25 PSR and obviously small 3b doesn't make sense), so it's probably pretty close between flat and shove.


What're we ranging V on? Does V even know?

My guess on V's range is that it's made up of a lot of 'pretty' broadway, assorted PP

I like knowing they can fold before I start trying to semi-bluff them off an ace or lower PP.

Call, see if V slows down on turn, then x-back turn if nothing changes? Or call, then shove turn? Running out of room here and a drinking V may not be keeping close track of where their stack versus pot are. I.e., bets turn, doesn't realize they're committed, H bluff shoves, V counts and does the, "Guess I'm priced in," thing.


by RaiseAnnounced k

Flop is fine pretty much regardless of range strat. This hand is strong enough to use as one of your top bluffs even when hyper-polarizing for this size.

Ain't no way am I folding 12 outs getting over 3:1. I'm not raising cold callers who raise postflop in these games as a standard, but it can be fine here as an exploit of the fact that he's clearly making polarity mistakes and to patch up the weakness of us basically having the nut low. .

OK, but how do you see this affecting his range? Once he checkraises here, his value hands would seem to be sets, big unsuited aces, many/most suited aces, and maybe some other suited Bdwys...against which Hero is approx. a 60-40 dog.

Unfortunately, I'm too old and too hungry at the moment to do the math, but at these stack sizes it doesn't seem that the pot is large enough for Hero to continue, unless you strongly disagree with the range I'm giving Villain.


I think raising feels wrong because it's a big ask to get a loose Saturday night rec to fold any of the likely hands that we would range him on.

Shoving as an exploit relies on him having some range that defies our usual hand reading logic, like black JT or A3s or TT or something. I don't "expect" to see any of these hands as I'm assigning a pretty low probability to each of them individually, but like 10% of all pairs and 4-out+ draws collectively add up to a sizable folding range.

I also think it's fine to put cold call pre / x/r flop in its own bucket of aggression and assume he's not doing this light until we get a better read on him. I'm used to seeing more whackadoodle stuff here because I use much smaller sizes here.

In any case, if you're second paragraph is talking about having the odds to continue with a call, your hungry ass needs to eat a sandwich and come back because we only need 23% equity to have direct odds on a call :'D


I like the 3b pre. You don’t want to go multiway with this hand and a tight player can be outplayed if you have position on them.

I think flop can be a check or a bet, but in a 3bet pot multiway you might want to check here as I don’t see you getting too many folds anyway and I’d find a slightly “worse” hand to bluff (one with less equity).

As played, i think it’s a call, but there will be times you hit your draw and still lose

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