Do I have a bet-call otr on a 1-3 NL game?
Posted a hand some weeks ago and got trashed on how poor my hand selection was on an invite game, and apparently I forgot the advise I got on how that extra vpip needed for invite games need to be only in position and only as an overlimp and not as a call. Anyways, table is loose and villain is the host of the game and it's a 1-3 NL and I play 500 usd on the bb and villain covers .
HJ opens to 12, villian on the CO calls and btn calls too. Hero calls A8o on the bb
48 Flop A87 rainbow, it gets checked around
Turn Ad87 2d, it gets checked to the V and he bets 36, btn folds and H makes it 96 and villain calls
240 River Ad87 2d 9o H bets 190, V thinks like for 20 secs and goes all in for 392, H? (it's 200 for H to call)
Pre it's just hard to follow a theoretically good preflop strat when playing live mainly for fun, maybe I'm doomed to lose on the bb since I think i continue on the bb and 2 callers as wide as this:
Flop even tho it is a 4 way pot and I think HJ won´t cbet as wide, I don´t think it's unlikely CO or Btn want to do something once HJ checks, or maybe we can make a case for donking? if so, very confused about which sizing could be better
Turn, pretty much a blank for the most part, but what's better between just start extracting value from any pairs or draws myselfr, or go for the xr expecting bets from Ax's, 2nd pairs and draws?, as played should I increase the sizing to targe only non believer Ax's and little combodraws they might have or fine with the one I chose to let them call open enders and fd's?
River in my eyes this was not that bad of a river and felt safe, can I be more greedy and just pot it or slight overbet?
As played, it's hard for me to believe he's got a value hand that I beat (A7 and 87 I feel start betting otf for the most part, and probly not very likely he continues ott with his 97 and 98 after I xr ott, and I don't think they'll raise me with A2s or A9)
But as for value hands that beat me I think there are only the 3 combos of JdTd, Td6d, 6d5d cuz I think the sets would just 3bs ott.
Given that I'm getting around 4 to 1 odds, do you think they'll show often enough A2s or a very sticky T9 that creatively turns it into a bluff otr? Think I lean towards the fold, what u think?
4 Replies
Just fold A8o from the BB for a raise. I don't care what game it is. The only way to play it is if winning w/ A8o is a special hand bonus.
Bet the turn!!! As played, raise turn to $100 - $125. As played, call the shove. Not much else you can do. You shouldn't be here.
FWIW, if I don't think anyone is going to bet the flop, I donk away.
That's the thing about home games. The players especially matter as well as your relationship and history with this guy. You said it's playing loose? Like guys are showing down 35o in raised pots for big pots loose? Everybody drinking? If it's loose like this I'm calling especially if you and villain have any history.
With the info given, first reply is pretty much spot on. I don't think calling A8o from bb is horrible if the game is anything like as mentioned above (you could raise) .
But I think the most important thing is leading the turn here. This is why over the years I've learned how bad check raising can be and what trouble it can get you into vs. aggressive players. I'd raise turn to 150 if it's a fast game and as played you're fucked. You have to pay him off.
If this is a 8-9 handed game, you absolutely don't need to be over-over-calling A8o in the BB. Playing 52% of hands 4 ways for 4bb a pop you are going to get destroyed in pretty much any game.
SB knew what to do.
As said, the turn x/r is way too small. Also generally don't love x/r A high flops/turns as a caller.
Assuming V is decent then 22 most likely for V, maybe A9 or possible weirdly played 65/77. But without more reads on V that he doesn't have A7/87 or even 97 or some weird bluff then it's a pretty dicey/exploitable fold.
Fold pre. You shouldn't feel any self-imposed pressure to call, because "home game", when there are already 2 callers involved.
FLOP - Check, with the intention of check-raising seems pretty standard. If HJ is any good, I might just donk-lead here.
TURN - I'm potting it. Maybe even over-potting it, like 1.3x-1.5x pot, after the flop checks through. If we're going to go for a check-raise, we should make it massive, like over 5x. I'd probably make it $200, not $96.
RIVER - I think I'd either check-evaluate, or just jam from up front, not bet 80% pot, pot-committing ourselves to call off the rest.
As played, we're being laid over 4 to 1. Don't see how we can fold now, but it seems at least somewhat unlikely we're winning, when V should know his jam has next to no fold equity.
Aside from straights, he could have also rivered a set with 99. The turn raise size allows him to call down pretty wide, with all his PP's over 88 and his draws. But that's part of why I think we have to call - he just has too many worse hands in his river landing range for me to fold getting over 4:1.
