Playing a draw in multiway pot.
live 1-2 nl 400 max. Playing in a casino on a Friday night with regs, recs, and drunks all with varying stack sizes.
UTG + 1 straddles to five. Three players call the straddle. Hero ($400 stack) on Button looks at KsJd. Hero doesn't like KJo no matter how many different ways it could be said and be funny. Hero takes it to $25.
Small blind calls. BB, straddle, and one limper fold. Two limpers call. 4 ways to the flop with with about $100 after rake.
Flop comes Qc10c3d. Field checks to KJo who insists that he is not royalty.
I don't think I can get the whole table to fold so I choose to take a free card and check.
Turn comes the safe 2h. Board Qc10c3d2h. First two players check. cutoff (has Hero covered)bets $47.
I'm calling $47 to win $147. If I'm correct I need to be able to win $250 to get odds to call. I don't think I can get another $100 from the cutoff. The other two players are short stacked and I risk having one of these players shove. There is still two clubs out there. Two of my outs could play into another's hand. Also since I have a K and no one raised I could have the best hand right now. Is a King on the river that's not a club a live out?
What should Hero (JKoff) do? I've been divorced for 5 years I have an excuse.
7 Replies
As played, call and evaluate on the river, your king outs are probably good as well which helps justifying the call
I’ll often not cbet on a flop when multiway, but on the button with two broadway cards showing and being open ended is one where I definitely would
Even if called you can double barrel the brick turn and usually get any callers folded there
If you're going to raise with cheese on the BTN, at least raise enough so that you're not left in a bloated, multiway pot.
Any reads on CO?
Raise bigger pre. I'd still c-bet the flop, for a small size, like 20%-25% pot. Not folding turn to such a small bet size.
I might occasionally raise, if I think V is just stabbing at it with weak 1P hands that will fold, or J9. Doubtful CO would have checked flop with 2P+ on such a wet board, and then taken this small sizing when the flop checks through and action checks to him again.
Just fold. You have $25 invested. You are vulnerable to a back shove that might re-open the action. Your club straight outs may be counterfeited by FDFD.
Bigger pre. I might just go $40 or $50. I'd rather fold KJo than go $25. I would bet the flop once they all check, but some reads would be nice.
Call the turn, evaluate river. Not sure about a K's being good, but there is a good chance it is.
I’ll definitely be raising larger pre from here on out.
A lot of people are asking about reads on players. This is not something I’m good at at the tables. And I tend to forget to look for players stack sizes when in The hand.
But here it goes. Main Villain who bet the turn is a MAWG. I think he is better than the average reg. His VPIP is high. He limps frequently. He raises pre more often than most players and I noticed that he is wide with his preflop raises. SB has $93 remaining, last player in hand has about $60 in his stack
I'll definitely be raising larger pre from here on out.
A lot of people are asking about reads on players. This is not something I'm good at at the tables. And I tend to forget to look for players stack sizes when in The hand.
But here it goes. Main Villain who bet the turn is a MAWG. I think he is better than the average reg. His VPIP is high. He limps frequently. He raises pre more often than most players and I noticed that he is wide with his preflop raises. SB has $93 remaining, last player in
So...if his VPIP is high, and he limps frequently, and he's wide with his raises pre, I'd be hesitant to categorize him as a better than average reg, unless A) the average regs in your pool are pretty bad, B) his VPIP isn't really all that high (is it?), C) he's over-limping from the BTN or BB, not really open-limping very often, if ever, or D) he's opening wide from late position when action folds to him, not opening wide from early position.
These things can change our read on an opponent.
It's important to use all the information available to us when playing live, inasmuch as we won't have access to player histories with huge amounts of data to go on.
Some things I look for when observing opponents:
Buy-in size - lower buy-ins generally indicate weaker players (though not always).
Chip denominations - does he appear comfortable having bigger chip denominations in his stack? Newer players will generally just buy in with $5 chips, not ask for larger chip denominations.
Buying in / rebuying - does he know where and how to buy chips, or is he clueless about the room's policy? Does he have a wad of $100's in his pocket, or a bag of $100 chips?
Stack configuration - does it look like V is used to playing in live games, in casinos, where the norm is stacks of 20 chips, arranged in a way that makes it easy for others to see how much the player has, or does his chip stack look like he has no clue? Is he spending time aligning the sides of the chips to be uniform (generally an indication of a more conservative, risk-averse player)? Is he building huge chip towers to the sky, or lining the rail with short stacks?
Bet sizing - is he opening the same size all the time, or different sizes? Does the variation in bet sizes correlate to his position, hand strength, or number of players already involved?
Appearance - young or old, neat or slovenly, male or female, sober or drinking, etc.
Attention - is he paying attention to the action, or constantly asking the dealer how much the bet is, when it's his turn to act? Does he act out of turn? Does he reach for his chips before it's his turn to act? Does he protect his cards, sometimes, or always?
Limping / raising - does he frequently open-limp or over-limp from EP/MP? Does he ever open raise? How often? Does he ever 3B? What sort of hands does he showdown when he open-limps, over-limps, open-raises, or 3B's?
C-betting - does he usually c-bet as the PFR? Does he only c-bet heads-up, or also multi-way? Does his position matter?
Folding frequency - does he over-fold to c-bets, or big bets? Does he chase his draws and stay in pots too long? Does he get sticky with weak value?
Bluffing frequency - does he ever bluff? What sort of hands does he bluff? Is there some rhyme or reason to the way he structures his bluffs? Does he start his bluffs early, or late?
Stabbing frequency - does he frequently stab when action checks to him, or check back? What sorts of hands does he showdown after stabbing?
Tipping - Does he tip more when he wins a bigger pot, or the same amount regardless (same tip size will often indicate he's playing tighter, bigger tips will usually mean he's looser).
Straddle - does he put the straddle on without anyone prompting him, or does he refuse to straddle (no straddling generally means tighter, more conservative, more risk averse).
Donking - does he like to donk bet, heads up or multi-way? On what sort of boards, and with what sort of hands? Does he barrel off or check when his donks get called?
I use all these observations to build a mental profile of every opponent at the table, with the aim of figuring out how they can be exploited.