10,9 suited - an amateur's question
Hi All!
Let me start by stating that regardless of more than a decade of playing as a recreational, I am clearly a loosing player. I did a lot of learning, but I lack both discipline and skill. I still love to play and want to get better so I would love to know your opinion on a hand I played. I tihink it is clearly a bad play, but I am curious about your thoughts, because I am not sure where I should play differently next time if I find myself in a similar situation.
Here is the hand:
I am playing low stakes no limit holdem live in the local card room, game is nothing crazy and we are nine handed. I am the big blind, pretty deep, sitting on 750BB, and I have 10h,9h.
Preflop:
Utg (solid reg, 600BB), makes it 2.5, 3 callers in the middle, SB makes it 20BB (195BB), I call, UTG calls, rest folds. We go three way to the flop.
Pot: 67.5BB
Flop:
Ad,9d,10s
SB, goes all in with the remaining 175BB.
I call.
UTG goes all in with the remaining 580BB.
Pot is ~ 1000BB, I have to call 405BB.
My thoughts are that he is unlikely to have AA (preflop game), and I am blocking 99 and 1010. A10 and A9 are possible hands but I convince myself that he is some kind of a combo draw of QJd, J8d or 78d, maybe some unlikely semi-bluff.
Hero??
Please share your thoughts on this hand.
(There may be some minor differences in the stacks and bets, but this was the hand more or less.)
10 Replies
I would have folded preflop to the SB raise.
I'd folded preflop too, no way cold calling 3bets in bb w/9ts
If you really want to play put in a 4bet.
Flop calling the first shove is ok, but calling the 2nd shove is crazy. Clearly he has better than 2ps shoving this deep.
Never go broke w/2ps this deep unless opponents are huge fishes who overvalue their hands.
I might even fold 99 to the back jam tbh. I only beat AT which I dunno if they ship on top unless I got a fishy image.
If he had combo draw he aint shipping with no side pot, there were literally no bluffs or semi bluffs in his range.
I fold pre but if I play here I raise to try to isolate the SB, then on that flop I roll with it and call. If UTG calls my re-raise I fold to the action described.
TT would be a std. fold when SB 3bets, at least without reads that SB is raising super wide (like ATo).
Flop sucks even the first time, does SB really shove 3x pot into two people with AK here?
When UTG then reshoves into a dry side pot you are pretty much praying that he hates money and has QJ ... or somehow has decided that you have a draw and he needs to reshove AK. You beat no value hands.
Looks like everyone is terrible, and/or gambling, and if you play with them a bunch you might be "learning" their bad habits ... look at some preflop charts and lean way more towards being the person who puts more money in rather than the person who calls.
tl;dr fold everywhere.
Thank you all for the replies, I agree with all and especially Illiterate, that there's a lot of gambling going on many players (not just me) making huge mistakes and I learn these bad patterns. Lesson to myself is that I should put in more off table work here and in other trustful sources to develop a solid strategy.
fold pre
Thank you all for the replies, I agree with all and especially Illiterate, that there's a lot of gambling going on many players (not just me) making huge mistakes and I learn these bad patterns. Lesson to myself is that I should put in more off table work here and in other trustful sources to develop a solid strategy.
Try playing online and put in good amounts of volume. Just 2NL-5NL is good enough. That's where you can play/practice the most basic abc poker. Once you get the hang of it, you should have a "solid" strategy. Also, you get alot more hands online from multitabling.
Imho, grinding live is just mainly for profits, you can learn some here and there but not as much as from online, well you can also have fun that's all that matters right? Also most live players are horrible(compared to the same stakes online), so you'll learn alot of bad habits from them.
Think in terms of ranges, whether it be your ranges or your opponents ranges. Why did he play the way he did? And think how to play your ranges instead of your specific hand.
Ie. we all mention not to cold call 3bet. Why? Because we usually don't have a cold call 3bet range. Most of the time it's cold 4bet or fold. By cold calling the 3bet, we are opened to get a 4bet from initial raiser, we are also saying we have something we want to see a flop with but not strong enough to put in a 4bet, if initial raisers range is strong, more often than not, they'll put in a 4bet. You on the other hand are sandwiched in between them. Sure you say you see some high stakes pro play like this and etc. but they might have a reason for it. While we low stakes live players suck so much that we aren't profitable to cold call any 3 bets period.
Ok, enough of the nonsense, anyhow, hope to see you at the tables, and wish you luck!
I can see the rationale when you cold call a 3! with T9s not to want to fold when you make 2 pair.
I don't play online at all now, but I agree playing online microstakes is good for learning how to play. It is cheaper than learning by playing a live 5/10 game.
This is in BBs, not $s. The play here seems worse than a typical 1/2 NL game. It seems like a low stakes private game or in a country where the money is not worth much for much less than 1/2 in USD.
Welcome to the forum, OP. Please don't include results, including your last action, when posting a hand. They bias people's advice. I edited them out. Please wait at least 24 hours after posting (longer if the discussion is still going strong) to post last action and results.
Welcome to the forum, OP. Please don't include results, including your last action, when posting a hand. They bias people's advice. I edited them out. Please wait at least 24 hours after posting (longer if the discussion is still going strong) to post last action and results.
Yes and thanks (sadly I only found the thread opening "manual" after I posted this)
