Begginer's question about this hand with AA
Begginer's question about this hand with AA

Begginer's question about this hand with AA

Low stakes live in local card room, I sit on 350 BB on the BTN, villan has 300 BB in SB. He is a TAG recreational, looked to me that he tends to play more ABC than fancy. We are 8 handed.

Preflop:
UTG makes it 5BB, one MP calls, I make it 32.5 with AhAs, Villan calls, UTG calls.

Flop: 104.5 BB
Kc10c7h

Villan bets 55BB, UTG folds, I go into the thank and Villan who was otherwise friendly to me says: "I could have re-raised preflop if that helps." I have a bad feelings about the whole situation. I call.

Turn: 214.5 BB

Turn is the 6c.

Villan makes it 60BB.

Hero???

06 March 2025 at 12:54 AM
Reply...

8 Replies



Even without the speech, I'm really tempted to fold the turn, based mostly on:

1. What is an ABC TAG calling 3-bets cold with from the sb? 66-KK, AKs, AKo/AQs/KQs(?)
2. Which of these hands donks this flop into two players? KK/TT/77...AcQc/AcKx(?)
3. Which of these remaining hands severely downbets the turn? AcQc/AcKx...or sets that are forgetting that Hero could easily have AcAx/AcKx.

I'm finding it difficult to see any worse hands for this ABC TAG other than AcKx, which in combination with the other hands and his easy speech play would seem to make this a fold on the turn.


Our 3B size seems a tad large if we're on the BTN. I'd probably just make it 4x, or maybe 5x if the game is splashy, not 6.5x.

V is in the SB? And he says he could have re-raised pre, after he just cold called our 3B over the UTG open? Not sure I buy that he's just flatting with KK. Maybe he takes this line with TT or 77, but I would mostly expect a lot of Kx here. I'd be very tempted to raise his flop donk.

The 6c brings in all his flush draws. Maybe he donks flop with AXcc. But if he donks flop with a draw, is he really going to give us a little speech, trying to make us fold TPTK+, and then bet so small on the turn when he makes his hand? Still seems like Kx, maybe AcKx.

I dunno. It smells fishy to me. We're getting such a good price. I don't think I could fold yet. Think I just call and hope he checks river on a brick.


Not sure I can fold yet. He could easily have AK, KQ. Call/evaluate.


by Javanewt m

Not sure I can fold yet. He could easily have AK, KQ. Call/evaluate.

I don't imagine that many ABC rec TAGs are calling 3-bets cold in the sb with KQ, and I also don't think many would donk the flop here multi-way with a naked AK.


by Javanewt m

Not sure I can fold yet. He could easily have AK, KQ. Call/evaluate.

KK is nearly always a 4 bet even at low stakes. AK can be, but often a call of 3b at low, and KQ I don't think is speech worthy, especially not saying he could 4 bet, which your average TAG rec is never doing.

I think I call turn here, especially given price, I think his range is mainly AK, with discounted odds of KK, KT, KQ, TT.

oh and plus one for smaller pre. I think I'm going 22-25 BB.


by Always Fondling m

I don't imagine that many ABC rec TAGs are calling 3-bets cold in the sb with KQ, and I also don't think many would donk the flop here multi-way with a naked AK.

We're assuming OP's read is correct. By his own admission, he's a beginner, and tanked on the flop. His read could be wrong. V might be getting out of line, or over-playing something, because hero tanked.

It's possible V donked flop with a strong hand that shriveled up when the FDFD comes in on the turn, or that V was semi-bluffing, and made his hand, and is now milking OP for value with his preposterously small turn bet size. It's also possible V cold-called pre with AK or KQ, thought he was value-betting the best hand, and now isn't so sure.

It's hard to think V cold-flatted pre with KK. Maybe TT / 77. But is he going to cold-flat those hands, and donk flop for a small size, rather than go for a x/r, and give his little speech, and then continue to barrel turn, for this super-small size, when the FDFD comes in on the turn? Maybe, but that seems like a lot of unlikely things happening in sequence.

When someone donks flop in a multi-way pot, I'm generally going to give them credit for having something more than just a draw or a weak top pair, but sometimes, that's all it is.

He could have 2P+, or some sort of combo-draw, but everything that makes sense for value could also be a check-raise. Every semi-bluff on the flop could also be a check-raise, and would probably barrel the turn for a larger size.

His turn bet looks weak. I think we need to call, and see what he does on the river. If he's nutted, he'll probably make a big bet, at which point, we can fold.


by docvail m

We're assuming OP's read is correct. By his own admission, he's a beginner, and tanked on the flop. His read could be wrong. V might be getting out of line, or over-playing something, because hero tanked.

I should have realized this sooner, since there are few-to-no hands that an ABC rec TAG would play this way.

Maybe calling the small turn bet was better than folding, although I hate doing so knowing that I'm paying 60BB to see a river card in the hopes that we get to showdown and we'll be good.


by Always Fondling m

I should have realized this sooner, since there are few-to-no hands that an ABC rec TAG would play this way.

Maybe calling the small turn bet was better than folding, although I hate doing so knowing that I'm paying 60BB to see a river card in the hopes that we get to showdown and we'll be good.

It's not fun. I'll give you that.

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