KK 3 bet on OTF 4/8
4/8 passive not too loose table
3 limpers+ SB complete, I am BB look at KK raise, 3 calls, SB folds. 4 BB
Flop is J84 with 2 ♦. I bet, call. older V who is perfectly able to raise with his FD or 2p does, BTN tighter TAG who is one of the few 4/8 players I respect 3 bets.
I don't recall but I don't think I had a diamond.
So I talk myself into a call as I put V1 on his FD and V2 on AJ or maybe QQ. Fold. call. call. 8.5 BB
Turn is a non diamond 2, I decide to bet out, V1 calls, V2 raise, I fold. V1 calls.
11 Replies
check the turn and try to showdown.
if you give a free card to a FD so be it. thats the price of being OOP. i really dislike b/f overpairs in a pot like this.
i know because if theres anything im guilty of its overfolding. and that costs you more than anything in LHE.
Don't respect a player who limps QQ.
If you’re thinking about folding KK on this kind of flop your thinking is fuzzy.
Checking the turn seems like the best play. You went from almost folding the flop to leading the turn which seems illogical. There’s nothing wrong with checking the turn when you’re OOP. Some players will raise the turn with relatively strong hands hoping you will fold and then check the river if they don’t improve.
Turn is closer to a check/raise than a bet/fold. I think once you lead the turn you absolutely have to call the raise and evaluate the river.
I was expected this comment, and its part of why I posted. I posted in a hurry and I also should have posted my thinking, which in real time is still not where it should be.
Bottom line, I had showdown value and should have gone to the river.
When I called the flop 3!, my thought was V2 had 44/88/AJ or possibly QQ. After I called and had more time to think, I ruled out QQ as he would have raised pre with it.
So I had him down to 3 likely hands and instead of just c/c to the river I decided wrongly to see how smart I was and bet out planning to fold to a raise as it would narrow his hand to 44/88.
When V2 raised the turn, I paused for a couple seconds, he made eye contact with me "you have aces?" he asks. Poor etiquette, but he said it.
The turn bet was a poor decision.
River was a non flush low card, V1 checked, V2 bet out. V1 folded what I assume was FD or bad jack.
V1 flashed his 88 to me and nodded.
He out flopped you. You lost the minimum but misplayed the hand.
I wasn’t there and have no history with villain but when he asked if you have Aces I would interpret that as him having flopped a set or him having Aces.
In limit holdem making big folds is not a good strategy. In general with an overpair and the above runout they’re going to have to show me a better hand. A villain could have a Jack, pocket Queens, pocket Kings, or a stone cold bluff.
I'd consider check and see on this very dynamic (draw heavy; turn brings new hand classes more frequently) flop vs four opponents, no diamond in hand. Pot's big enough that we should target 4 and 5 out hands with kr when given the opportunity. Seemingly low prob that everyone misses and checks.
What flops would you bet then? J84 two diamonds not a bad flop. And just because they hit a piece doesn’t mean they’ll bet these are passive 4/8 players.
Take The same shape and slide it down, like 962dd, for example. More rainbow boards. Less connected boards. ddd boards. AQJ. 55x-22x.
Not claiming that I've got it all figured out. Just that we should consider it.
4/8 passive not too loose table
3 limpers+ SB complete, I am BB look at KK raise, 3 calls, SB folds. 4 BB
Flop is J84 with 2 ♦. I bet, call. older V who is perfectly able to raise with his FD or 2p does, BTN tighter TAG who is one of the few 4/8 players I respect 3 bets.
I don't recall but I don't think I had a diamond.
So I talk myself into a call as I put V1 on his FD and V2 on AJ or maybe QQ. Fold. call. call. 8.5 BB
Turn is a non diamond 2, I decide to bet out, V1 calls, V2 raise, I fold. V1
You played the flop well. Now check/call down and pray.
