View: The way to crush live nitfests nowadays games is being a good LAG or maniac
There is a player at my local casino who’s been nicknamed the Phil Ivey of our hometown. He is not a pro. He has his own business and a massive bankroll but I believe he is the biggest winner here. He doesn’t study solvers. He’s a really good “feel” player who is fearless and goes off his reads and punishes all the nit TAG pros who rely on solvers. None of the pros know what to input for his range for their solvers so they don’t know how to play against him. They tend to fold and let him take down pot after pot. Sure, occasionally they’ll lay a trap for Phil to walk into but the amount of pots Phil takes down uncontested and the times he gets paid off on an over bet shove more than makes up for it.
Some regs like playing with Phil when they can short stack and think he is a spewtard. But they always run once they chip up because they know Phil will put them to the test.
I would advocate aspiring pro poker players to learn to be like Phil instead of being a nit who relies on solvers. Study people, grow a bankroll and some balls.
Do you have a Phil in your home casino too?
always funny when I hear people saying pros rely too much on solver so they get run over
let’s see how your phil guy would fare against players like linus who “rely on solvers”
The problem most likely is that players misinterpret the information they get from solvers. Studying is one thing, studying and applying the principles CORRECTLY is much tougher
Lol maybe the solver nerds at my casino are all wannabes then. I don’t use solvers, I’m just a rec but these guys are always talking about solvers but they are all nits and Phil owns their souls
Just because they talk about solvers, that doesn’t mean they study hard or study effectively. It’s just tough guy talk from wannabes.
I think it’s more likely they are insecure than it is that they are super serious about the game. I’d be more concerned with an opponent that doesn’t say much.
LOL. As per usual, most have no idea what they are saying when they use the words solver, theory, and GTO.
Get all your poker buddies at a game and then let one guy sit there with GTOW open on latop.
You guys play your normal game and bring “Phil” to play his “aggressive” game.
You’ll soon find out how savage the solver really is.
This is interesting, just curious how would solver play on such table vs those players and what would be end result after the session
This is interesting, just curious how would solver play on such table vs those players and what would be end result after the session
Solver would crush weak nits.
Btw I kinda know one live reg that reminded me of OPs story "good LAG".
So he won like +40k from small 2/2 live with 0.5k buyins. But in the next 2 years he lost it all and was in the end -70k. He was just a bad reg on a heater.
Solver would crush weak nits.
Btw I kinda know one live reg that reminded me of OPs story "good LAG".
So he won like +40k from small 2/2 live with 0.5k buyins. But in the next 2 years he lost it all and was in the end -70k. He was just a bad reg on a heater.
It's really really hard to be a good lag.
It's also a really fine line so unless you've played with someone a ton it can be hard to tell a good lag from a spew tard. Now throw in card distribution and how slow live is and someone can look a lot better than they are for a while.
I can see hometown Phil causing these guys problems. Solver guy with tight pants and a Fanny pack squirming around not knowing how to deal with bigger bets
I've never played in a tight live game. Everybody is eager to show off their incredible poker playing abilities.
My experience playing online poker and looking at hands in Hold Em Manager is you get punished when you try to receive more than you're equity share off the pot.
So for example, in hold em manager if you you experiment with opening the 96 of clubs under the gun, because you think you are Phil Ivey and everybody else is useless, is you just run into a hand too often, get 3 bet and it just isn't profitable.
The best course of action if playing at a tight table, is just to find a better table.
It's really really hard to be a good lag.
It's also a really fine line so unless you've played with someone a ton it can be hard to tell a good lag from a spew tard. Now throw in card distribution and how slow live is and someone can look a lot better than they are for a while.
I think this is spot on.
In the lowest level levels (think Wynn $1/$3 or Horseshoe $1/$3 or $2/$3) the best players are going to be really good LAG players. They will play lots of hands and play enough of them aggressively (either correctly bluffing or aggressively building the pot when best). That said, there will also be enough spewtards on a heater who will win occasionally enough to confuse the issue. A really good LAG is the most profitable in these games, but it is also the hardest to play and even a great player who is off (maybe tired or drunk) can turn into a spewtard.
There is a player at my local casino who’s been nicknamed the Phil Ivey of our hometown. He is not a pro. He has his own business and a massive bankroll but I believe he is the biggest winner here. He doesn’t study solvers. He’s a really good “feel” player who is fearless and goes off his reads and punishes all the nit TAG pros who rely on solvers. None of the pros know what to input for his range for their solvers so they don’t know how to play against him. They tend to fold and let him take do
Yes effectively infinite money beats scared money most of the time. How well does he do against others with effectively infinite money? BTW a real solver pro as opposed to amateur loves "being put to the test" so long as they can afford to lose.
There are no good LAGs or players of any variety at 1/3 let alone really good ones. The best 1/3 players are simply ones who actually have studied preflop and don't play like an idiot post
You are never going to encounter "gto kids" in a 1/3 game, only 5/10+ has actually has some well studied players pretty much
There are no good LAGs or players of any variety at 1/3 let alone really good ones. The best 1/3 players are simply ones who actually have studied preflop and don't play like an idiot post
You are never going to encounter "gto kids" in a 1/3 game, only 5/10+ has actually has some well studied players pretty much
You sure about that? Is your reasoning anyone who is a good LAG could quickly move up and not play 1/3?
What if it’s a deep 1/3 game and the table is full of fish. A game like that is arguably more profitable than a nit infested 5/10 in terms of hourly rate.
The way to absolutely mop up an entire live table has always been to playa good lag style
You sure about that? Is your reasoning anyone who is a good LAG could quickly move up and not play 1/3?
Yes. I've never seen even a player I'd consider good at a 1/3 table ever. Not sure I've even ever seen someone who could play just preflop well at a 1/3 table, let alone postflop
Also "LAG" is a term like 8 years outdated at this point and good players don't use it
There are no good LAGs or players of any variety at 1/3 let alone really good ones. The best 1/3 players are simply ones who actually have studied preflop and don't play like an idiot post
You are never going to encounter "gto kids" in a 1/3 game, only 5/10+ has actually has some well studied players pretty much
I haven't played 1/3 nl in almost 20 years but I doubt this is true. Surely there are some good young kids working their way up playing 1/3 nl.
Now is anyone actually good who has been playing 1/3 nl for a long time? Hell no.
There are no good LAGs or players of any variety at 1/3 let alone really good ones. The best 1/3 players are simply ones who actually have studied preflop and don't play like an idiot post
You are never going to encounter "gto kids" in a 1/3 game, only 5/10+ has actually has some well studied players pretty much
This is funny.
Yes. I've never seen even a player I'd consider good at a 1/3 table ever. Not sure I've even ever seen someone who could play just preflop well at a 1/3 table, let alone postflop
Also "LAG" is a term like 8 years outdated at this point and good players don't use it
You either don't play a lot of $1/$3 or you aren't good enough to evaluate other players skill.
Which is it?
Not every player plays poker to earn enough to move up in level (even if they could). People play poker for other reasons.
There are no good LAGs or players of any variety at 1/3 let alone really good ones. The best 1/3 players are simply ones who actually have studied preflop and don't play like an idiot post
You are never going to encounter "gto kids" in a 1/3 game, only 5/10+ has actually has some well studied players pretty much
Since I am feeling helpful i will give you a serious response.
Do you ever think it is ever worth limping or making a small raise with 89 suited UTG? Under what conditions would you ever do this?
Before you go there, I want you to know that I fully recognize that there are plenty of players who are decently tight pre-flop and not terrible post flop enough that they regularly win at low levels. Meager amounts in the long run, but they win. Good for them. However, they are not the best player at the table.
Also, if you haven't encountered someone talking GTO at a low level table, you haven't played enough. Play more.
I haven't played 1/3 nl in almost 20 years but I doubt this is true. Surely there are some good young kids working their way up playing 1/3 nl.
Now is anyone actually good who has been playing 1/3 nl for a long time? Hell no.
I think you are making the mistake of thinking the only reason to play low level poker is to move up to higher limits.
People play poker for all sorts of reasons, including entertainment. Including some very smart, experienced players.
Every single day I work I deal to some players in low limit games that could easily play in higher limit games and still win.
Why don't they?
Because they are playing poker for fun. They want to collect their time for casino rewards. Chat with friends. And maybe make a little bit of money in the long run.
To even play $2/$5 (with a $1000 max buy in) requires a person to carry (or have easy access to) $3-$5000 dollars. As stange as it seems to many here, a lot of people don't want that. It is easy to bring a few hundred dollars to the casino and play $1/$3. If you run bad you can go to an ATM and take out $500 and you are back in the game. This is only $2/$5, higher limits require even more.
For a lot of winning players, the money is only the icing on the cake. They play for other reasons.
Plo live it seems to be that just be even more nittier than others and money flows to you.
I think you are making the mistake of thinking the only reason to play low level poker is to move up to higher limits.
People play poker for all sorts of reasons, including entertainment. Including some very smart, experienced players.
Every single day I work I deal to some players in low limit games that could easily play in higher limit games and still win.
Why don't they?
Because they are playing poker for fun. They want to collect their time for casino rewards. Chat with friends. And maybe make
Id agree there are some exceptions out there.
Hell I've been a bank roll nit at times myself out there by not playing games I could afford to play that's are really big and not might run again for six months and I don't want to get crushed in the game that could ruin my year.
But the combination of someone who
1) puts in a lot of work to get really good at poker
2)is only playing for fun but can be a crusher
3) thinks getting access to 3000-5000 dollars is difficult
Is almost non existent. Are they out there? Sure. But they're extremely rare.
I mean yea a guy happens to be in a city for a night or two for something else and he has trouble/doesn't wanna deal with the hassle of getting say 5,000 dollars sure to play bigger than 1/3 nl if he's gonna play poker for a few hours? Sure.
But someone who plays regularly, can shred a 2/5 game but thinks getting 3-5k cash is difficult in their home casino? Nah not buying it.
I do agree for a lot of people who win the money is icing on the cake. There are definitely some winning 1/3 players that primarily play for fun. I just don't think many of them are putting in a lot of work to get really good.
They enjoy playing,making some money is nice in the process but they aren't crushers.
there are absolutely 0 exceptions. every player who has ever played 1/3 live has sucked at the time of playing that table
You either don't play a lot of $1/$3 or you aren't good enough to evaluate other players skill.
Which is it?
Not every player plays poker to earn enough to move up in level (even if they could). People play poker for other reasons.
You're right I don't play 1/3, I',m a pro whose main game is 10/20+, or if not available I play 5/10. But I still play 1/3 if a seat is open while I'm on the wait list so I probably end up playing 15 mins of it a week on average as a result
1. Just because someone talks about "GTO" at a 1/3 table doesn't mean they understand it, all someone needs to do is to watch a Doug Polk video to start using the word "GTO"
2. Anyone actually good prints an absurd amount of money at 1/3 and will easily accumulate enough money to play higher in a short amount of time. Even if they don't, this doesn't negate the fact I've never seen a good 1/3 player. The whole table sucks literally every single time I've ever played 1/3, and as I said I've never seen anyone who even can play preflop well
3. The most profitable way to play 98s utg in Live low stakes is to fold.
To be clear, the reason why every player at 1/3 sucks is because they can't play theoretically well "GTO", not because they are incapable of being shitty "LAGs" incapable of moving up from the smallest game in the room
You're right I don't play 1/3, I',m a pro whose main game is 10/20+, or if not available I play 5/10. But I still play 1/3 if a seat is open while I'm on the wait list so I probably end up playing 15 mins of it a week on average as a result
1. Just because someone talks about "GTO" at a 1/3 table doesn't mean they understand it, all someone needs to do is to watch a Doug Polk video to start using the word "GTO"
2. Anyone actually good prints an absurd amount of money at 1/3 and will easily accumul
Perhaps at the 1/3 games they don’t need to play “theoretically well GTO” because they can play exploitatively against all the fish unlike 5/10 and higher which is full of pros like you who has to play GTO against other pros
Perhaps at the 1/3 games they don’t need to play “theoretically well GTO” because they can play exploitatively against all the fish unlike 5/10 and higher which is full of pros like you who has to play GTO against other pros
Their exploits suck or are basic. These **** "LAGs" can't exploit better than me. If they could exploit that well they would win 25bb/hr. How long do you think a player would stay at 1/3 if they made that much?
Their exploits suck or are basic. These **** "LAGs" can't exploit better than me. If they could exploit that well they would win 25bb/hr. How long do you think a player would stay at 1/3 if they made that much?
25bb an hour is $75 an hour at 1/3. Can a 5/10 grinder make that in their nitty gto wizard games and find a game to sit in consistently? Can they do it without much bigger monetary swings?
