5/10/25/50 AA82ddd on 9d7c6d 4 ways spr 3

Nut flush draw and blocking straight I might just pot/gii at this spr on flop/turn

Youre playing PLO. The best strategy imo is to push your ev when available and put the pressure on non made hands. Especially when theres multiple ppl in the pot. If you didnt have fd of course just check. But you have equity vs hands youre behind but dont want to just be x/c and youre not folding.. So gii hopefully they either all fold or all call lol and reload if needed.

In theory I think we check here ALOT and protect that with hands like bare straights and redraw straights with no diamonds. We can bet very lil with hands like straights with diamonds and diamond blockers and hands like 2 pair with diamond draws. 3 diamonds and a blocker to the str8 is nice tho. A bet cannot be that bad at all. I’d much rather have a pair and str8 blocker with the 3 diamonds to bet multi-way. We have to be super selective in theory. Again tho it really can’t be that bad and a lot of times the EV between a check and bet with hands that take a bet line aren’t too massive.

All my study has bets multi-way at 40-50% at these SPRs.

Personally I would check here. I don’t think we have enough equity vs baked straights or 2 pair/sets to blast off at this SPR. I’d blast off with more blocking stackers like 2pair, SD blocker and flush draw. Hands like AT9 with a FD or A876 with FD.

Turns depends on how my hand interact with the board and the cards that come along with range interaction so we can’t just give blanket advice for all turns and rivers.

I x, HJ x,CO thinks it over a bit, cuts out 1.2k, slides forward. BB Folds, I tank call, HJ Folds.

Turn 3,675 9d7c6d3d 2.7k behind. Hero?

Jam

Nuts change and you have 1SPR on the turn

While you are blocking the straight, a naked straight will never bet here and you are unblocking all lower diamonds like KQJ flushes and unblocking all sets and 2 pairs who may call of a jam based on equity.

No other option.

I would check 4 way, bet HU, and possibly 3 way. I'd be curious to hear what you think CO pots with.

I am not raising our option pre. Our aces are pretty junky and we are not going to realize equity well. It’s nice to have a hand we shouldn’t on an ace high flop, and it’s bad to have the hand they’re going to put us on when that’s really the main part of our hand, top set.

As played having the 8 is nice but our equity is really bad when called or jammed on. I think check evaluating a flop that’s bad for our range is fine. We are not capped when we check. I would call a small bet and fold to a big one.

On turn we are more likely to have nuts due to preflop action and we can donk. Checking is ok too, especially against a lag or maniac.

So I jam and get a long tank fold from villain. He asks to see runout. River us a 3 pairing the board and he looks pretty disappointed.

At the time I was definitely thinking straights. In retrospect when he gets checked to on the flop, I suppose he could have a set, especially top set.

My conflict with this hand is I called pot on the flop, but I probably don't get to see a river too often if the turn isn't a diamond.
I guess maybe I can get a crying call from a smaller flush on the turn, but my hand is so face up. I guess you could argue I could call flop with a set or 2p and AA with NFD blocker and turn thst into a bluff on the turn, but that is pretty unbelievable. I don't know if we get enough extra money when we hit the turn to make flop call + EV. We may even get range folds when we turn the nuts?

This is why we protect our checking range. This is only a problem if you aren’t checking straights as well.

The problem is that I might not have the odds to profitably call my nut flush draw on the flop. Even if I can check straights on the flop, how does that address the problem?

Yeh if he's potting 4 way and has a nutty range I think you should fold the flop - most likely we only see the turn unless we make a flush of course, and I don't think when you hit the flush you get paid since it's the most obvious draw.

Because if you are properly protected your opponent can’t just pot. He actually doesn’t have a strong enough range to do so and can’t have a strong enough hand to do so. He is relying on you to fold enough equity in order for his pot to be profitable.

As for raw equity, you need 33% to call pot size bets. Against exactly QJT8 with diamonds you have approximately 30%. Vs all other straights you have more. Throw a few 2 pairs, worse flush draws, and sets in his range along with a bluff or two and you have plenty. Live ranges aren’t as crispy as they should be. He has way more hands than a solver would in this spot and potting way worse hands than a solver would.

Interesting dynamic on turn as well. You have less than a pot size bet and on turns you can lead, he will actually have better odds to call off his sets. It’s still losing as he needs more than 30% and will only have around at best 25ish but this is where you make money in live poker. Live players making -EV bets and calls.

Think it's more so we're 4 way and someone will have something on a texture like this. The problem with the raw equity is you're right we have 33% roughly against a reasonable potting range OTF, but if he's potting the flop he's probably jamming the turn so we won't see a free river. Furthermore if we hit a flush we're not getting paid as it's the most obvious draw, and he has very few if any inferior flush draws.

This is why we check call nut straights with no redraws. So he can’t just pot the turn with nonsense. He has to be worried you have the nuts too on non nut changing turns. That protects your hands like this and allows turns to go check check.

If you aren’t doing that, then absolutely you have to fold hands like he has on the flop, because your range isn’t strong enough to see a river.

I don't have many hours with villain and this is assuming that villain is going to adjust to my range strategy. I think the exploitative strategy would be to be worried about what the highest EV strategy for my exact hand vs his range is, and not be concerned about what I'm doing with other parts of my range and whether he is exploiting me (spoiler: he isn't).

You’re misunderstanding and maybe that’s cuz I’m not explaining well enough or my concept in a proper way. I may be misunderstanding your point as well. So let’s reframe.

If you never check call with nut straights on this board, you can never just check call with this hand as you don’t have a strong enough range on blank turns. Therefore you force your range, and subsequently your strategy, to either check fold NFDs on flop or XR all in when faced with pot size bets. This would fall into a check fold, as you don’t have the required equity to rip, unless you feel you have substantial fold equity vs a player who pots.

To your point, you are just looking at the basic equity calculation. Do you have enough to call a pot size bet? Well in that case you do. You need 33% and vs his range you do. But then your argument goes to, well if it’s a brick turn I never see a river, and that’s true but that’s now how you calculate raw equity. You either have it or you don’t. You don’t really take future street playability into account.

I think what you are really getting at is do I have enough equity realization and that requires a more nuanced answer. You do if you protect your range, since turns will go check check sometimes, and you don’t if you don’t protect your range, since it will never go check check on turns. Therefore, if you want to maximize your realization, you get it all in on flop but you don’t have the required equity to do so mathematically.

Maybe I’m still missing your point though lol.

We want to check some of our nut straights, sometimes calling and sometimes crai.

I think it’s very important we put at least a little bit of the nuts in every bucket, especially if we are playing thousands of hours with the V.

I have a simple point.

"You do if you protect your range."

This is assuming that my opponent knows that I check call straights sometimes on the flop and adjusts his strategy accordingly. He doesn't know and he is not adjusting. That is a basic truth for exploiting recs in a lot of spots. He probably just assumes I don't have a straight. Most of the time he either has a straight or set and is happy to GII on the flop after he pots flop.

There are other options for playing this hand though. I could bet smaller on turn or check turn. I also could have lead flop either potting or betting smaller. So the question doesn't always reduce to whether I have the raw equity to GII on the flop.