Multiway action - flat or reraise?
Hi all,
I have a multiway question specifically on how to play it pre. Pretty loose game, a lot of fish.
Am in the SB with 150bb holding AsAcKdQc6s.
CO straddles to 2bb, Button clicks it to 4bb, i just call since the straddler is really bad and am hoping he raises to isolate him (he covers everyone).
BB then pots to 18bb, fold, fold, straddler calls the 18bb and so does the Button.
Back to me: should I repot or just call?
I decide to repot to 90bb, everyone calls. SPR is at this point 0.2 or sth so i kind of have to get it in on any board. The other two players were shorter, so there was 124bb in the main pot, 80 in one side pot and 57 in the side between me and the straddler. I have 60bb behind, so just the smallest side pot is a small win if i get the rest of the chips in and take it.
Spoiler
Flop comes 987 rainbow, pretty bad, but given the SPR. no chance of folding. I lost, was almost drawing dead although no one had any A, but the straddler had 99873ss and the button had QTT66ds. The other player had super bad single suited KK, so all in all complete trash. Heads up against any of them i am definitely over 60%, but no one folds ever.
People at these stakes are really really bad, I usually wait to take it postflop and let them make mistakes, but I play too passively anyway, so if I don't reraise this, what am I reraising?
It does feel however that this is just spinning the wheel, because in case they are not blocking each other somehow, any 3 set of 5 decent cards will have plenty of equity and am probably over 25%, but never over 30%.
6 Replies
You realized all your equity preflop and played perfectly.
Shitty result.
Dont be results oriented be process oriented. Double suited Aces in 5 card is still a print jam.
Thanks, I think that accepting variance is a big part of it. Need to work on that.
But considering people make more mistakes post, is it possible that flatting here the 18bb with a resulting SPR of almost 2 leads to a higher profit? In PLO25 to PLO50 (cents, not dollars, haha), there are many people that just like to gamble and not let go of hands. Preflop, their mistake is -1% to -5%. Postflop it could be huge once the texture and nuts and draws get defined.
I am sure at higher stakes there is no need to do anything differently, just exploiting spewy people at lower stakes.
Thanks, I think that accepting variance is a big part of it. Need to work on that.
But considering people make more mistakes post, is it possible that flatting here the 18bb with a resulting SPR of almost 2 leads to a higher profit? In PLO25 to PLO50 (cents, not dollars, haha), there are many people that just like to gamble and not let go of hands. Preflop, their mistake is -1% to -5%. Postflop it could be huge once the texture and nuts and draws get defined.
I am sure at higher stakes there is no
So the concept of taking lower variance routes in the gametree to both reduce risk of ruin and increase opportunities to capitalize on bigger mistakes is ok but you take those paths with hands where the EV of either option is extremely similar.
For example, let’s say we just call with the category “pair + flush draw” instead of raising. The EV between the two may be only a half BB per 100 so either route is fine in the overall grand picture of your gametree.
What we absolutely do NOT want to do is take a massively lower EV spot for the sake of reduced variance. For example, just calling double suited aces instead of 4betting. Here, just calling possibly nets us -50bb/100 as opposed to 4betting and it is borderline impossible to make up this EV in the call line of the gametree.
It’s up to you to study and find the spots you can deviate from “optimal” because to a computer, optimal is max EV lines, even if that like is only 0.01 bb/100 over another, whereas for us humans, the difference is so minimal, we actually become indifferent to either path, and can decide based on flow or in game properties.
TLDR, just calling this hand pre instead of 4betting is most likely too massive a loss of EV that you can’t possibly make up for it post. Take the hands that have pretty much the same EV between calling/raising and use those to take that “less variance” route.
I think you can fold this flop even with only 60 back. With 2 bdfd it’s probably close.
I would always jam this spot pre it’s a huge print.
Looks fine. Hero is able to realize a lot of his equity postflop with 4 premium broadway cards, weaker aaxxx benefit more from raising in some ways.
Xf flop may be ok, but if Hero has two backdoor flush draws maybe not. Would need to check some numbers.
Cramming without thinking in 4c but I suspect in 5c it might be closer. 2x bdfd and I probably cram.
You don't get AAKQxds very often, and even if you were significantly deeper, this is an auto 5b. Would guess that Kelly Criterion has you popping this even if your stack represented ~20% of your roll. Embrace the variance.
I can't tell if this is live or online.
