PLO 5-5 Live: Can i ever fold here???

Should we even be raising preflop here if we assume we have little to no fold equity from the open limpers? The value in this type of combo comes from suits and smooth board coverage which holds weight heads up and even 3 ways but less the more players that come along. We're not pushing equity even vs 20% ranges. Curious on other's thoughts.

Almost wondering if we can check to check raise this turn given river's will be a bit gross and this is a turn villain can heavily attack. We can also x/r and get a healthy eq push vs face rivers where equities can heavily shift in our opponent's favor. If villain is more passive on turns and would rather try to "make their hand" before putting more in pot prob best but if they have any reasonable aggression on turns I might slip a check in.

Fold river and **** the mdf. Villain's range won't contain enough, or nearly any bluffs here.

River seems pretty close to me, given odds. The question is whether or how often he's got a hand like QJ97 or KQ95 or whatever and be turning it into a bluff. Doesn't sound like he's that likely but some will auto bluff these big pots when they're so short.

Seems okay to raise this pre but only as a mix it up play, maybe 20% of the time at most. Definitely not pushing any strong edges with this hand. Would be fun if 3 players all have AKJ5 or something.

Not too sure about checking turn here. If he has just the wrap and no flush draw he may call again but we don't want to give him a free card. If he has a wrap and a flush draw and bets we've got to fade a bajillion outs, potentially an underdog. Too many hands are going to take a free card for us to give a cheap one.

I would mostly call this vs rec, who may incorrectly value-bet worse hands or make desperation bluffs with missed flush draw.

Vs a rec player who could easily have worse, I sigh call given odds.

Preflop is good. Really surprised to even see people suggest anything else.

Flop I just lead or check call. While the check raise isn’t the worst, we have a great hand to lead with that can withstand pressure on a multitude of runouts. We are very deep from an SPR standpoint and check raising this hand is awkward as it’s not quite strong enough to play for stacks. While we block sets, we still run into hands that crush us or we hate if we check raise like AKQJ, KQQJ, etc etc. when we are deep and OOP with a non nutted hand we play passively and keep the pot manageable. Top sets and full wraps with pair blockers should be looking to XR. This hand is too inbetween.

This is a good hand to throw in our 20-30% leading range due to the properties it stacks, especially if we have BDFDs and also is a good one to protect our checking range.

Turn in theory is a bad card for you. You are repping top sets and top wraps. This brings in the lower straight and doesn’t really hit your range. As played I would check or bet small. Turns that change the nuts but don’t hit the raisers perceived range need to be played passively and you need to protect your range. Interesting thing tho is for the reasons this hand was to inbetween on the flop, those same properties now stack to allow a bet on the turn when the nuts change. You can get value from a set now and wrap. Interesting dynamic at play. I’d still check.

If you check called flop you could either lead or XR this turn tho and I like that line better than the one you took in game.

River is read based. Bet is too small to fold so the exploit is to overfold to someone who has no bluffs or under bluffs even slightly. In theory I’m sure we see JJ and KK hands with a pair blocker as a bluff alot. QJJx, hands like QJTx and maybe even KKQ9 but is the opponent even capable? Don’t mind the fold.

I’d look to play the hand differently tho OOP. The hand just isn’t strong enough to XR in my opinion at this SPR. Too middle of the road

[QUOTE=Echemondo;58974067]Preflop is good. Really surprised to even see people suggest anything else.

Funny how poker lines can be perceived so differently for many. I'm actually complete opposite and surprised this many think it's standard. Fish don't limp to limp fold and we're not pushing equity preflop as well as can easily have suit domination as well as oop to flop lol. I don't think enough really understand where the value comes from with combos like this.

Why would we not raise to allow 3bs and also push equity? You think this hand isn’t pushing equity against a 60%+ limp range?

It’s DS and well connected which allow for clear and easy postflop play. When OOP and deep we care more about playability over multiple streets as opposed to raw equity.

This is either an open or a fold. We don’t limp along