Question about c-betting medium strength hands
Last year I transitioned from NLHE to PLO and have watched the Crushing Small Stakes PLO Course from PLO Mastermind a couple of times but I'm a bit confused when to bet medium strong hands on the flop.
One video mentions that you should consider betting the medium strength hands for several reasons and two of those being, "You have additional equity," "Runouts are generally bad for your hand."
Are these two things not fairly contradictory? If you have additional equity, then runouts can be generally improve your hand so you want to bet, but if runouts can't improve your hand you also want to bet?
That leaves me in a weird no man's land when trying to figure out which medium strong hands to put into my check back range.
3 Replies
Well the book I was reading was only cbetting nuts/nut draws/bluffs. Because it can withstand a check/raise.
The forums here doesn't advocate cbetting much pure bluffs, only nuts/nut draws. Makes sense since most opponents are very very sticky.
As for medium strength hands, they suck when pot becomes bloated. I guess it's ok vs very passive whales?? Vs aggro opponents, they suck even more when you get check/raised.
Didnt they include examples in the video?
I think the additional equity-thing should be clear.
Bad runouts: I guess this refers to medium strength hands which prefer to bet/fold over playing a checkback-line. The reason for this is, we have to fold a lot on later streets. Often these hands have some kine of blocker to villains continuing range.
It is highly dependant on the situation and the specific flop.
This is way too nuanced to answer in a single comment but IP we bet polar and require backup, OOP we bet merged and donβt need much backup, we just want to reduce our positional disadvantage as much as possible.
Thatβs the main heuristic to remember.
So think like Top 2 with AJ86 on J83 two tone.
IP we should check a lot if we donβt have the FD or FDBlocker as there are a bajillion bad turns that bring in a flush, straight, higher two pair etc.
OOP we can check raise this hand tho so if we get a clean turn we can jam our stack such as any card below a 7 basically.
If we have a hand like AQJ9 with the flush draw, now IP we can bet as we have a lot of turns we can play very well and can call a XR if we face it and OOP we can lead or just call because we have clear visibility on turns and can play them even OOP very profitably. This is a weaker overall hand strength than top 2 in showdown value though.
So IP we generally ask ourselves, what happens if I bet and I get check raised. If your answer is very easily snap call or snap fold, we bet. If your answer is ehhhhh idk Iβm not really too comfortable calling and itβs way too strong to fold, then we check.
OOP we ask, is my hand strong enough to play OOP with clear visibility on multiple turns or do I have a leading range and if so does my hand have the right hand properties to generate value or folds if we bet? if so we can lead.
If the answer is no then we ask, is my hand strong enough to get all the money in now, and if so, will be opponent stab enough so I can check raise.
OOP is a bit more nuanced so we generally start by learning to check our entire range OOp and just XR and then eventually learn what boards vs what ranges we develop leads on.
Fun game once you get there tho
Thanks for the thoughtful response. When we check back hands like naked top two and then a straightening card comes on the turn, are we always just folding to a turn lead from the opponent? I feel like in the pool I play, you see alot of aggression following flop checks and then I have a hard time deciding when to call down with my two pair.
(I play mostly online btw. 100 and 200PLO on US Geo-Fenced sites)
Thanks for the thoughtful response. When we check back hands like naked top two and then a straightening card comes on the turn, are we always just folding to a turn lead from the opponent? I feel like in the pool I play, you see alot of aggression following flop checks and then I have a hard time deciding when to call down with my two pair. (I play mostly online btw. 100 and 2
It depends on your cards and the board. If you have top 2 with the FDblocker like an A, K or Q you can call with intentions of hitting the FH or bluffing the flush coming in. If you just have naked 2 pair and they pot and you unblock the nuts then u generally fold. If they bet small/medium and you have nut blockers like AJT8 on a T837 board you can call as u block the nuts with ur J and have equity vs naked straights. Can even bluff on the river repping the straight.
A lot of nuance