20NL - good hero call? or mega punt?

Do you trust your read? If he bluffs way too often you need to call far more often than against a player that does not bluff too often.

Not sure if it's call otf.
River is pure fold.

Would rather call here with AJhh then clubs.

If you have a strong read then sure call all your bluff-catchers, But you also have to be sure he does not bluff better hands like 56s or 55 A6s.

For that last reason I would fold this.

We print vs aggro whales by having it > hero calling, which is usually close, high variance and ultimately a guess like this spot.

Personally I just wait for better BCs and wouldn't waste much time on these 50/50s

This hand isn’t even a bluff catcher.

Well it is now! And technically profitable i guess

I've played whales where this kind of thing is callable and c'est la vie. Trouble is OP only mentions some over 3betting/4betting which is not good enough to make a positive ID.

i think AhighMK is going to be ok vs the correctly identified ATC type in certain scenarios and this is one tbf, but those dynamics are rare given a) super whales either go bust in 10 mins or b) spectacularly own everyone all night, as appears to be the case here.

Not a clue what you're trying to say but it's a terrible call.

I'm confused. Wouldn't you rather than clubs, spades, or diamonds than hearts because it's then more likely Villain missed a heart draw?

I think, OTF he is range betting, so he has all the suits and OTR his less likely to bluff with hearts then other suits(I think its common logic not to bluffed missed fd). Small diffrence but wanted to point it out.

As per the advice to boost activity in this thread, I would advise you to fold the flop in reality. It may not seem like it with the pot odds but OOP 4bet ranges consist of too many holdings that hit A and K high textures. In GTO you see more mixes with low pairs etc which does make a bit of a difference. Even in GTO you should be folding textures that favour the other range more often.

Usually if you do call here, your EV comes from betting the turn once they x looking to apply pressure for stacks (or what some might call a float bet). By doing this, you attack most player's inability to protect their checking ranges correctly and to call down with the correct frequency by the river deep.

I'd like to simplify to roughly a b30 OTT into a jam river. This allows you to stab hands like QQ maybe a weaker Kxs if required as you can assume that they wont be xring close to GTO in this node given the low SPR. By doing this, you tend to gain EV over two streets worth of overfolds rather than one street of potential overbluffing.

I would argue, however, that your hand strength is a bad bluffcatcher as one could assume that OOP will construct 4bets in a more blocker heavy fashion than GTO. This would mean that they likely have more AQo / AQs than a solver would so they might actually bluff with a better hand.

Appreciate the advice everyone. Thought it was a fun hand to post because I agree that this should be a fold in theory.
I think, given how aggressive the player was, their 4bet range is probably closer to the solver's 4bet range than most people's predictably narrow 4bet ranges. Solver says my line up until the river is standard, assuming the actual ranges are more or less correct.

I think the flop float is fine, I doubt it makes much money but I think it's criminal to fold all of our backdoors on this fairly dry board. They're supposed to bet 100% of range here. I think stabbing turn with missed backdoors in this 4bet pot is a mistake because (a) we have too many of them so it's easy to overbluff (b) small stabs won't generate much fold equity in this spot and I get x/r'd a decent amount so the usefulness of the move goes down (c) our river improves are A/J and we're not even necessarily excited by them when we get called and see them on the river.

I was pretty sure most of the river play on my opponent's end should be a check according to the solver, because they have 100% of range here. Once they bet all-in, I had to think. Most of my range will consist of pairs, draws/backdoors that bricked out, and maybe some slowplayed Kx. For them to bet all-in with a pair and not Kx against my range seems to be torching money, because it's very easy to run into a trap or a bigger pair, so I think a lot of pairs check and try to take their equity to showdown. I thought my opponent would also show down AQ because it's the nut non-made hand and wins against non-made hands I decide to give up on the river. So the real question is what are they going to do with most of their non-made hands on the river? I thought they'd deviate from the solver (which gives up most of their air) and incorrectly blast a ton. AJ is the worst combo I think I want to call with here because it will dominate the air in their all-in range without running into a better non-made hand (AQ).

Trying to figure out if I'm the right side or the left side.

Folding flop is actually pretty fine. If you look at a solver, it's going to 1) 4-bet very aggressively. I doubt even an aggressive 4-better is likely to 4-bet more than a solver would. and 2) range bet the flop.

Facing a cbet the solver is indifferent with a call and a fold, but does fold most of the time to this flop bet. So there really isn't an exploit available, where you could say that villain is so aggro so therefore you can expect to make money from a flop call. So if you think villain is 4-betting even wider (hands like KTo, K9o, A3s, A2s) stuff like that, then yeah this flop becomes a much clearer call. But I doubt this is the case.

The river depends on your read. This is a clear as day fold against almost everyone you're gonna come across. But if you think villain is overbluffing this node, they could be clearly overdoing it. Villain is ranging flop, and probably giving up a lot of bluffs on the turn, so they are relatively unfiltered on the river. The problem is there still aren't that many bluffs to choose from. A5s, A4s, which you block, and probably an aggro player is going to keep betting flushdraws on the turn quite often. So that's only 2 combos. Then there's QJs and maybe QTs? Also, if villain is aggro, they might be taking this line with AQ, which should be abundant to get to this river. So all in all, it's not a great spot even if you think villain is super aggro and is going to bluff often. Would prefer a pocket pair here, which is for sure good against all villain's bluffs and doesn't block them.

I like the image hehe, sometimes it's a fine line between the two polar opposites.

Absolutely minute and doesn't matter.