2024 ELECTION THREAD
The next presidential race will be here soon! Please see current Bovada odds. Thoughts?
I mean, ****ing what?
WOW. That's great news.
One thing that needs to be considered is people like me make the distinction between left, center, and right. I absolutely cannot stand many policies of the left, but there is no way in hell I will let myself be associated with the current crop of conservative lunacy and the orange-headed scammer that leads them. It makes the comparison between left and right nonlinear.
which actual right-wing politicians elsewhere outside the USA do you like if any? people who are fully against leftist policies, not pseudo-leftists.
is there anyone worldwide which is against the push toward net 0 as a politician that you think is respectable and which you could vote if he was a candidate where you vote?
“They are fighting so hard to steal this damn thing,” Trump said without evidence. “They're talking about extending hours ... Whoever heard of this stuff?”
A judge in Pennsylvania last week extended the deadline for voters in Bucks County to request a mail-in ballot. The ruling was in response to a Trump campaign lawsuit alleging that long lines had prevented some of the former president’s supporters from getting their ballot.
This ****ing idiot can’t even be bothered to realize he’s attacking things he wants
trump is just completely confused where he is at the NC rally..
said he just left a great place in North Carolina. but he's currently in north carolina..
said "you've got a great guy here David McCormick" "where you at david?" again, he's in north carolina... mccormick is running in PA.
dude legit needs to an aid to tell him where he is. if he was your grandpa you'd start thinking he needs a caretaker.
One thing that needs to be considered is people like me make the distinction between left, center, and right. I absolutely cannot stand many policies of the left, but there is no way in hell I will let myself be associated with the current crop of conservative lunacy and the orange-headed scammer that leads them. It makes the comparison between left and right nonlinear.
It really should be this simple, no matter what policies you prefer on healthcare, taxes, etc.
tariffs and anti free trade is LEFTISM YES, not radical right-wing lol.
it's no-global Seattle riots.
Clinton signed the Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act.
it was basically unamerican and fully incompatible with both main parties to not be fully against illegal immigration back then, to not consider that one of the biggest threats to the nation.
normies were all against illegal immigration like MAGA people are today, it was uncontroversial.
and any mention of "trans rights"
luciom, what does the pre-9/11 US have to do with changes in the political spectrum from 2012-2024?
it can be both true that the right moved right from 2012 to 2024 and that the left moved left from 1996-2012.
and those anti-WTO people hated global capitalism, they didn’t hate globalism in general. if they could have a one world socialist government they would have. same as the occupy movement didn’t hate globalism because they were protesting wall street.
and Bernie for instance was anti-illegal immigration because he thought it was a plot by the bourgeoisie to bring down prices or some other crazy lefty ****.
people on different sides of the aisle can agree on random political issues but have completely different approaches.
trump is just completely confused where he is at the NC rally..
said he just left a great place in North Carolina. but he's currently in north carolina..
said "you've got a great guy here David McCormick" "where you at david?" again, he's in north carolina... mccormick is running in PA.
dude legit needs to an aid to tell him where he is. if he was your grandpa you'd start thinking he needs a caretaker.
donald is the oldest presidential candidate ever. can he do the job? will he be up to the job 5 years from now? seems too old and senile
sleepy donald at it again? smdh
luciom, what does the pre-9/11 US have to do with changes in the political spectrum from 2012-2024?
it can be both true that the right moved right from 2012 to 2024 and that the left moved left from 1996-2012.
and those anti-WTO people hated global capitalism, they didn’t hate globalism in general. if they could have a one world socialist government they would have. same as the occupy movement didn’t hate globalism because they were protesting wall street.
and Bernie for instance was anti-illegal i
interesting that you don't even touch trans issues.
Anyway on the economy we moved from "balanced budgets" (B. Clinton bragging about reaching one after decades) to both parties loving deficits.
that's a radical leftist shift objectively.
tariffs are leftism 101, especially when motivated by "protection of workers".
there was a timid attempt to move right on economics (tea party) but trumpism destroyed it. Musk and associates spend a word or two toward that at times but chances they will get anything done about that even if they win are slim.
the right now accepts homosexuals, that's a radical move to the left vs the past. radical, life changing both for homosexuals themselves and for the concept of society being righteon entails.
for a long while being right-wing meant first and foremost thinking there was a moral supremacy in normalcy. ethnical, cultural, sexual normalcy was considered morally virtuous and everything else was considered trash.
that disappeared almost completely, and that's a move radically to the left.
society today is more accepting of unusual sexual behavior, culture, religion (or lack thereof) than progressives were in 1980.
cannabis is legal in many places in the USA, another move to the radical left.
do you realize some of those moves to the left are stuff I like yes? that doesn't make them right-wing lol
A Pres who's permanently asleep sounds a great idea.
As I mentioned previously, it's odd that you favor a candidate who filled the judiciary with judges who take an expansive view of presidential power.
I don't think that's what federal society judges do, and removing the Chevron doctrine nonsense is a drastical reduction in executive (agency) actual power for example.
which cases do you have in mind that expansively increased the scope of presidential powers?
btw I want Harris to win if the Senate gets republican, even if I love right-wing judges, not sure where you got that I favour Trump.
i actually favor a divided government
That was a really bad interception. Game over, IMO.
interesting that you don't even touch trans issues.
Anyway on the economy we moved from "balanced budgets" (B. Clinton bragging about reaching one after decades) to both parties loving deficits.
that's a radical leftist shift objectively.
tariffs are leftism 101, especially when motivated by "protection of workers".
there was a timid attempt to move right on economics (tea party) but trumpism destroyed it. Musk and associates spend a word or two toward that at times but chances they will get anythin
How are tariffs left-wing? lmao Are you saying that when the founding fathers imposed tariffs they were being leftist? that’s utterly stupid.
the idea of protecting your nation’s resources in order to not get effed over has two conceits: there is a capitalist national class and that capitalist national class should be protected for the development of the nation. that’s the type of tariffs we’re talking about here.
as far as trans and gay stuff, even when gay marriage was illegal there were “log cabin republicans” basically gays that were still republican. and gays as well as trans are being attacked for sexual degeneracy. states are also cracking down on porn by making people show ID. abortion is no longer a national right and under the same logic they might take away gay marriage as well.
you cherry picking certain policies and declaring them left without backup is not very convincing. even the social issues are kind of stupid because plenty of republicans are moving right on social issues from toleration to outright banning of certain books because they touch on certain topics. and even centrist republicans like tim pool are pushing conspiracies about schools trying to make people gay/trans.
I’m way prettier than he is. And more of a winner.
As I’ve explained, I’ve read nate silver, realclearpolitics, betting markets extensively, other sources. Most of them show the same boring stuff about Kamala being up 2-3 points nationally and very very tight in the swing states. So if the polls are off by 2-3 points in either direction then trump or Kamala could win all the swing states.
I’m pretty confident Kamala will win the swing states for a variety of reasons. The important point in some
With outliers, ignoring them is often a mistake, but so is post selecting ones to build a narrative around. If the race is close, you expect individuals polls pointing to a comfortable Harris win (Seltzer showing Harris leading in IA) and a comfortable Trump win (Susquehanna showing Trump up 6 in NV). Seems like that's what we have.
This is a respectable response, thank you, but it addresses a very narrow point that was part of a broader point I have been making, and is mostly incorrect.
Nate pointed this out today a day after I did. Not one, but many outliers from serious pollsters in non battleground states that tell a consistent story are a good place to look at and provide a LOT of value. One poll that could be considered an outlier for Trump in an overpolled state doesn’t say the same thing.
tariffs are heavy handed government regulation/taxation of economic activity predicated on "common good" reasons, so under the most basic axis of left to right (statism), they are very leftists.
real right-wing thought process denies the state has any role in dealing with economic activity full stop.
center right thought process allows some regulations to smooth trade and production and sale but never for non economic "common good" considerations.
if it decreases the size of the economic pie it's unthinkable, for the center right.
centrism allows some more regulation and taxation so retaliatory tariffs for outrageous behavior are acceptable in centrism but again not just for some non economic "common good" consideration.
when you start mentioning worker protection as one of the reasons, or the main reasons, for tariffs, you are in Sanders land yes.
right-wing people routinely considered men with long hairs, or women with very short hairs, toxic perverts inimical to society 40-50 years ago.
being an atheist was a kind of treason of basic values that made you a pariah in many groups.
that's the kind of comparison you ought to make.
but no matter how much radically, without precedent in speed, society moved to the left culturally it's never enough for some reason
Luciom here is a simple example of what I’m talking about
Someone could say “I hate all brown people so I want to eliminate illegal immigration”
Another can say “I don’t want to have american businesses take advantage of illegal immigrants, so I want to ban that. but I want to open up legal immigration and institute a temp worker program”
both of them are advocating against illegal immigration, but one of them is because of racism the other is being progressive.
that’s why your way of looking at things is silly. people can advocate for the same things for vastly different reasons.
in fact marijuana legalization can be a right-wing libertarian policy because they don’t like big government telling them what to do. while others might be motivated by calling the drug war racist, which would be more left wing.
tariffs are heavy handed government regulation/taxation of economic activity predicated on "common good" reasons, so under the most basic axis of left to right (statism), they are very leftists.
real right-wing thought process denies the state has any role in dealing with economic activity full stop.
center right thought process allows some regulations to smooth trade and production and sale but never for non economic "common good" considerations.
if it decreases the size of the economic pie it's
political policies don’t have a stance-independent left or right positions except in some system where it is assumed as such and usually for the purposes of some kind of political propaganda, leftist, libertarian, centrist, right-wing or otherwise.
that’s the entire conceit of the meme in the first place.
saying that tariffs are automatically left-wing because of government interference is so weird because mercantilism and monarchy is a much older, more state-involved system.
edit: I should expand on the first paragraph. I don’t think the creators of the political compass get to decide what is or isn’t considered a right/left position.
wait everything related with trade when the gold standard existed has no bearing on tariffs in a Fiat money system.
with gold standard your country has to ship gold overseas undermining the national currency and stability if the shipments are too big, whenever there is a trade deficit.
so trade immediately becomes a matter of state security and stability and other considerations can take place.
wait everything related with trade when the gold standard existed has no bearing on tariffs in a Fiat money system.
with gold standard your country has to ship gold overseas undermining the national currency and stability if the shipments are too big, whenever there is a trade deficit.
so trade immediately becomes a matter of state security and stability and other considerations can take place.
is fiat currency a left wing policy then?
