In other news

In other news

In the current news climate we see that some figures and events tend to dominate the front-pages heavily. Still, there a

12 October 2020 at 08:13 AM
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by jalfrezi

Most of the people lapping up the frog poison (metaphorically) also lapped up the WMDs. It's like they're so entrenched in their position that West Is Best, East Is Bad, that they're incapable of updating their world view in the light of more information.

The Russian regime at this point has a fairly well known and over two decades long history of murdering political opposition, dissidents and journalists, including poisoning them. Which is also a continuance of the Soviet Union's love of doing the same. There are plenty of stories from defectors and insiders of these regime's history and fascination with poison. From the Soviet era they told us of poison research and manufacture at the infamous Scientific Research Institute No 2, founded at the behest of Lenin. In modern times, they tell us about how the work continued after the collapse of the Soviet Union, today as part of the poorly named FSB Criminalistics Institute

Now, people are certainly free to believe that all these stories are fabricated, that Navalny just coincidentally happened to be poisoned by Novichok in 2020, that by some completely random unrelated chance he would later die in Russian prison in 2024, that Litvinenko just magically died from polonium poisoning, that Sergei and Yulia Skripal just stumbled into a naturally formed mist of Novichok, or that Yuri Shchekochikhin just became ill and died from natural causes when he was investigating the regime's assassination of journalist Anna Politkovskaya.

And of course, people can also ignore that these events fall into a pattern of journalists, opposition and dissidents being shot, bombed, beaten to death and thrown out of windows.

Still, when these events stack up, that position becomes increasingly absurd. Russia has taken a dive to the near bottom of rankings of free speech and free press for a reason. It seems evident that the point is, and always has been, terror. These operations are not meant to be completely clandestine. You send or pay some idiots to do the dirty work, and the outcome will be obvious enough to instill fear, but secretive enough to be deniable. It is an effective warning to others: Do not dissent, do not oppose, do not tell.

As for your claim about others "lapping it up": It is you who immediately jump into a point about sides, and immediately frame this as a debate of Russia vs "the west" and invent a caricature to argue against.


No one's denying that Russia assassinates some dissidents and others who fall foul of the regime. But some like to deny that the West also does, and are happy to go along with whatever information MI6/CIA are supposed to have found, released by governments who have already been caught inventing fiction about their foreign enemies' activities.

It's impossible to say from where we stand what happened with various poisonings, especially with the Skripals, a case that becomes ever more confusing the deeper you delve into it, though you appear to have absolute certainty again.


Both sides, guys.


I think we found someone who swallowed the WMDs line.


by jalfrezi

No one's denying that Russia assassinates some dissidents and others who fall foul of the regime. But some like to deny that the West also does, and are happy to go along with whatever information MI6/CIA are supposed to have found, released by governments who have already been caught inventing fiction about their foreign enemies' activities.It's impossible to say from where w

I'm no fan of lack of oversight over secret services. We know both from the cold war and from the war on terror that unchecked growth led to illegal, immoral and questionable operations, especially in the realm of espionage and monitoring of citizens, journalist and politicians across the western world.

Abuses, crimes and errors are then hidden through keeping records sealed long enough for involved parties to be long since retired or even dead when their activities come to light. Need for secrecy can be genuine, but must take into the account that secrecy can only be trusted when oversight a) actually happens b) does so in a timeframe that can actually punish abuse and transgression. And it should be punished severely: If you give someone power, it has to come with accountability. Anything else is to invite in corruption and incompetence.

We also know both from the Panama papers of 2016 and now the Epstein revelations that this corruption and incompetence is genuine and reaches echelons of both political power, wealth and intelligence services. There is no reason to be naive about corrupt and rot also in western nations. If we want a cure, we need to drag it to the media, the courts and let the guilty rot like they deserve.

And the answer this can't be "but Russia". However, the reverse is also true.


by Rococo

I'm not even going to ask how you ended up at a strip club with Mike Tyson.

She lived in Vegas. Probably a thousand different ways that happens.


by Rococo

I'm not even going to ask how you ended up at a strip club with Mike Tyson.

Musicians often need part-time work between gigs.


by Rococo

I'm not even going to ask how you ended up at a strip club with Mike Tyson.

Probably there to fight the patriarchy and to support women's rights


by formula72

I dont really get the why dont you move there take. Im pretty sure vic would sacrifice his life if Iran was able to magically build and drop a nuke big enough to wipe out all of the US. It has nothing to do with which place has the best amenities.

by jalfrezi

It's a very lazy stance taken by people whose patriotism is offended by one of their own not being patriotic.

Just to clarify once again, I wasn't actually criticizing Victor for living in the US. I was pointing the needle at his hypocrisy and notion of nuance.

He blames every US citizen (except himself) for supporting the war machine by living here. He allows room for his own nuance, but doesn't afford the same grace to others. In reality of course, there are plenty of people living in America who do not support the genocidal actions of its government.


by whatthejish

Just to clarify once again, I wasn't actually criticizing Victor for living in the US. I was pointing the needle at his hypocrisy and notion of nuance. He blames every US citizen (except himself) for supporting the war machine by living here. He allows room for his own nuance, but doesn't afford the same grace to others. In reality of course, there are plenty of people living i

I think he just blames the voters.


by whatthejish

In reality of course, there are plenty of people living in America who do not support the genocidal actions of its government.

This can't be true.:p



by coordi

It just keeps getting worse.


by coordi

Maybe they should request they ban them from the platforms like Biden did with Covid #whataboutism


You mean this case? Supreme Court doesn't seem to agree with you.

"they presented no proof to back up their claims that the government had pressured social media companies like Twitter and Facebook into restricting their speech. "Unfortunately," she said, the Fifth Circuit court of appeals "relied on factual findings that are "clearly erroneous.""

Of course that's also ignoring the fact that covid disinformation was getting people killed and harming society generally.


by coordi

I hope those companies tell Homeland Security to take a long walk on a short pier.


by Rococo

I'm not even going to ask how you ended up at a strip club with Mike Tyson.

The same way I ended up in a strip club with Floyd Mayweather


by formula72

I dont really get the why dont you move there take. Im pretty sure vic would sacrifice his life if Iran was able to magically build and drop a nuke big enough to wipe out all of the US. It has nothing to do with which place has the best amenities.

Low tier reply. No one ever told him he needs to sacrifice his life for anything. Strawman, dog barking at passing cars style argument.

by jalfrezi

It's a very lazy stance taken by people whose patriotism is offended by one of their own not being patriotic.

Oh really? So why don’t you quote someone instead of just speaking in generalities? Because you’re taking a lazy stance, that’s why.


by jalfrezi

It's a very lazy stance taken by people whose patriotism is offended by one of their own not being patriotic.

Nah. If Victor truly believed any of the things he says he wouldn’t stay in the US giving his taxes to the genocidal war machine. He’s just a fraud, sorry if that offends you.


by Luckbox Inc

I think he just blames the voters.

Victor effectively voted for Trump so he can blame himself. Ofc this has just caused him to schizopost more.


by coordi

If you haven't done anything wrong then you don't have anything to worry about 😉


by tame_deuces

I'm no fan of lack of oversight over secret services. We know both from the cold war and from the war on terror that unchecked growth led to illegal, immoral and questionable operations, especially in the realm of espionage and monitoring of citizens, journalist and politicians across the western world. Abuses, crimes and errors are then hidden through keeping records sealed lo

three journalists who reported on the panama papers in europe were assassinated

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daphne_Car...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_M...

first two are outright assassinations - third one is a bit more unclear, appears to be a random rape & murder but the timing of a few days after her big expose was released was deeply suspect and many believe it was a well disguised hit


by DoyleBrunsonFan

Nah. If Victor truly believed any of the things he says he wouldn’t stay in the US giving his taxes to the genocidal war machine. He’s just a fraud, sorry if that offends you.

idk about Vic's personal circumstances but most people have familial ties that are hard to cut and are faced with a tough choice between morality and matters of the heart.

Also, don't be such a dickhead if you can possibly help it.


by jalfrezi

Also, don't be such a dickhead if you can possibly help it.

Maybe you should give Victor the same advice.


by jalfrezi

It's impossible to say from where we stand what happened with various poisonings, especially with the Skripals, a case that becomes ever more confusing the deeper you delve into it, though you appear to have absolute certainty again.

No, it's very easy to say what happened with the Skripals. (And Dawn Sturgess.) The perpetrators are known.

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