LeBron > Jordan GOAT Super AIDS Containment, solved #22999 post by Matt R. (addendum #23174)
Very impressed with the minute sequence where LeBron clearly lost the ball headed to the rim, heat got the ball anyway and scored, then he elbows his defender in the chin, drawing a defensive foul and stern talking to from the official and hitting a 3.
It's these ref assisted 5 point swings in close games that truly bring out the best in great players.
Link to post of why Elon Musk is the true GOAT: https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showp...
The thread that will go on for years..........
vs.
Didn't realize Lebron was your hero but I also wouldn't want to switch places with Lebron. I don't expect you to understand because you're deeply unhappy and a generally envious and shallow person, but a lot of people are happy and can acknowledge that another person is better off objectively, without wanting to live that other person's life. I'm sure Lebron's life is in many ways objectively better than mine, but I personally prefer mine.
Wow, this is great stuff, seems like I might have been completely on-point with your mom comment. Female approval is really important to you huh? Did your mom not praise you enough? Was another child her favorite? Did she cheat on your dad? Tell me more.
no need for approval if no one is paying attention - there's a correlation
Didn't realize Lebron was your hero but I also wouldn't want to switch places with Lebron. I don't expect you to understand because you're deeply unhappy and a generally envious and shallow person, but a lot of people are happy and can acknowledge that another person is better off objectively, without wanting to live that other person's life. I'm sure Lebron's life is in many ways objectively better than mine, but I personally prefer mine.
No response to the attrition battle thing, which I assumed you referenced so that I would comment on it.
The reason why I know about the attrition battle thing and came up with it is because I remembered how much harder it was going from HS ball to D1 college - the difference was the brand of ball - the game played so much faster because everyone was a HS star that could really push the ball (if they were a ballhandler) or get out on the wing (if they were a wing).
This faster pace caused me to do layups in a lot of spots that were dunks in HS, and my shooting efficiency suffered as well due to the greater strain on my legs - it turns out that I wasn't much of a jumpshooter after all and my form/mechanics were exposed as my body got worn down more and more.. This attrition factor occurs for teams in games too - it isn't necessarily shown in any 1 given game - there's a ton of variance in 1 game.. But over the course of a series or a career, patterns emerge that demonstrate an attrition factor.. This is the case with Lebron where his brand of ball consistently loses the attrition battle and massive blowout losses are seen throughout his prime.
So here we see a situation where actual experience playing against NBA players combined with an analytical ability that companies paid big money for (professional analyst) leads to greater insight into the game of basketball than you will hear nearly anywhere.
No response to the attrition battle thing, which I assumed you referenced so that I would comment on it.
The reason why I know about the attrition battle thing and came up with it is because I remembered how much harder it was going from HS ball to D1 college - the difference was the brand of ball - the game played so much faster because everyone was a HS star that could really push the ball (if they were a ballhandler) or get out on the wing (if they were a wing).
This faster pace caused me to d
Your struggles as a low-level college player, especially given your lack of self-awareness have little relevance to analyzing the professional game. Either way, Lebron (and his teams) have historically excelled late in the series, you can just this up.
It's still Jordan. /thread.
Nothing comes close to peak Jordan. Dude was an alien. Still never seen anything like him. LeBron's a great player obv and one can argue he's had a better career than Jordan, but better player? No way.
People can say what they wanna say. It's the internet. But if you're the GM of your team starting from scratch and you wanna maximize your championship(s) equity everyone is picking Jordan first and those who claim otherwise are either lying or never actually saw Jordan play during his career.
Super Prime LeBron was unreal. This goes often overlooked.
If you look at it in terms of who you would pick first if you had to win the title for your life instead of who produced the greatest overall stats, I think that gets to one key way to rank them. Nobody compares to 20 All-Star games and all the numbers, of course, but several are on this short list of who you would pick.
For instance we could say Kobe had horrendous offensive efficiency in the 2010 NBA Finals, was lousy statistically ... or we could say he spearheaded the title offensively and defensively.
And you'd be ignoring that he couldn't have won it without Pau.
Kobe never won anything without an elite center. Maybe better to say that Elite centers needed a chucker like Kobe to open the game for them.
is someone really claiming that Lebron was more of a ball hog than Jordan?
It's also interesting that MJ's accomplishments and attributes over the years are kind of combined even though he never really had them altogether. Early career MJ was an athletic marvel, but also wasn't quite as skilled as his later self, was a bit small and easily bothered by physical defense and, of course, a huge ball hog. Later MJ was bigger, far more well-rounded and evolved into a great team player, but was no longer the gravity defying Air Jordan with unreal first step.
So you're saying you didn't receive enough attention from your mom growing up and that explains your attention-seeking behavior?
don't quit your day job
and maybe get a different hobby outside of following hoops.. you're bad at it and lack self-awareness of your shallow understanding of the game
Your struggles as a low-level college player, especially given your lack of self-awareness have little relevance to analyzing the professional game.
I'm fully self-aware that you guys think "oh wow, this guy's a loser and a kook"... that's what insight always looks like to the ignorant.
Your misperception of my bold brain stems from your ignorance of the subject matter, so you lash out when being taught something new (like a child) and I must respond in a sometimes cringeworthy way (like a teacher) - the truth is cringeworthy sometimes.
Accordingly, my D1 experience playing on a daily basis against many NBA players coupled with a professional analytical ability is infact unique and allows for superior insight.. I've experienced the shift to a higher brand of ball where you're suddenly working harder for everything - faster transition defense, faster rotations required in the half court and more energy required on the glass or defensive end in general, which zaps your offense.. there's no way you're "getting hot" when you're on your heels defensively and facing more pressure than you're applying - jumpshots get exposed bigtime.. You don't understand this because you've never played at any level where brand of ball becomes a factor.
This applies to Lebron's game because his frontcourt ball-domination has a pattern of getting blown away - it's almost like it's a vastly inferior brand of ball.. So you're saying that Lebron-ball isn't inferior but it sure gets demolished like it is... And prime Lebron was destroyed by many opponents like the Magic, Mavs, Spurs, Warriors or Nuggets - catastrophic losses in his prime such as sweeps, record losses, and upset losses by many opponents - prime Lebron was everyone's b****.... Ultimately, Lebron-ball turns favored rosters (preseason favorites) into underdogs that barely meet the underdog expectation (4/10) - multiple teammate bailouts required.. you can't make this stuff up - he's a fraud - it's a fake debate
It's literally the opposite.
Lebron lost 3 straight games to lose the 2010 ECSF, 2011 Finals, 2014 Finals, 2015 Finals, 2018 Finals, 2021 1st Round, and 2023 WCF - he had a 2-1 lead in four of these series but lost 3 straight games to lose each series.. So there's a massive trend (many examples) of LeBall-Domination losing the attrition battle as the series goes on.
He also faded in the 2009 ECF and 2017 Finals (Kyrie's 40-ball prevented the sweep)..
And people forget Lebron's original choke - he had 7 turnovers in the 4th and OT of the critical Game 4 that swung the 2009 ECF.. So the factors that caused the historic upset loss was the aforementioned "original" choke in Game 4 along with his decision to defend Courtney Lee instead of Hedo for the series, and also his overall ball-dominance at 38 ppg - this kind of high-volume is too ball-dominant to beat top teams, so he can't carry scoring load, aka he never beat a top 5 SRS team with weak scoring & efficiency from sidekick (zero carry-jobs vs top teams in 2 decades).. He can't beat top teams with 18 on 38% from Mo, whereas MJ won with that crap from Pippen all the time - Pippen averaged that for entire 3-peats or his Finals career.
^^^ smart rankings because any top 10 rankings should show similar player-types grouped together
Your rankings show guys with low hold-times (Mj, Jokic, Curry) grouped together and ahead of the higher hold-time guys, aka ball-dominators (Lebron, Luka)
My rankings are somewhat similar and ranked in order of the player-types that required the least help to win.
The expert jumpshooters like MJ and Curry can drop 40 while the ball moves, so they can effectively carry the scoring load and win with non-franchise guys like Klay, Pau or Pippen.. Otoh, centers have historically required more help, followed by ball-dominators, who require franchise players and all-time scorers at sidekick like Kareem, AD or Wade.
Accordingly, my top 10 has the best expert jumpshooters at the top because they required the least to win (MJ, Kobe, Bird, Curry), followed by the best centers (Russell, Wilt, Kareem, Duncan, Shaq), followed by the best ball-dominators (Magic, Lebron, Oscar)..
KD would've normally fit in the rankings somewhere but his career was hijacked by the "decision", which constituted a 6-year headstart in the colluding space for Lebron - this headstart afforded all the fresh pickings' and luck that a first-mover enjoys.. Durant's only mistake was waiting 6 years to respond and appearing late/desperate as a result, while also getting the scraps (older/injured guys like Harden/Kyrie).. The "decision" makes it hard to rank today's players since it constituted a 6-year collusion advantage before someone finally responded (KD).
Accordingly, my D1 experience playing on a daily basis against many NBA players coupled with a professional analytical ability is infact unique
Yup, you were literally the only person to have played D1 basketball, how could I forget? And your "professional analytical ability" combined with D1 experience is so unique that you must be a sought-after candidate for all kinds of front-office roles? Right?
This is like a random burger flipper arguing that his experience gives him insight into how the fast food industry operates. Sure, all else equal, personal experience can add a layer of insight, but we already have lots of evidence that all else is not equal.
What does your "professional analytical ability" say about Lebron's record in Game 6 or Game 7? Or does it completely fail you when it comes to information that you're uncomfortable with? Like how it works fine when you're trying to cash SSDI checks but not when you're trying to actually land a job?
Yup, you were literally the only person to have played D1 basketball, how could I forget? And your "professional analytical ability" combined with D1 experience is so unique that you must be a sought-after candidate for all kinds of front-office roles? Right?
This is like a random burger flipper arguing that his experience gives him insight into how the fast food industry operates. Sure, all else equal, personal experience can add a layer of insight, but we already have lots of evidence that a
There probably isn't anyone in the front office of NBA teams that played D1 basketball and was a senior analyst in M&A. Requires an MBA or MS in Finance. It's a rare combination
What does your "professional analytical ability" say about Lebron's record in Game 6 or Game 7? Or does it completely fail you when it comes to information that you're uncomfortable with? Like how it works fine when you're trying to cash SSDI checks but not when you're trying to actually land a job?
You claimed that Lebron's teams did better down the stretch of series but when we compare Lebron and MJ, only Lebron has a significant track record (many examples) of his team losing series going away, such as losing 2-1 leads four times and losing the last 3 games of the series in the 2007 Finals, 2010 ECSF, 2011 Finals, 2014 Finals, 2015 Finals, 2018 Finals, 2021 1st Round, and 2023 WCF - opponents got stronger as the series wore on and Lebron's team got weaker and even gave up a few times.. His team also wilted in the 2009 ECF or 2017 Finals..
So this track record of losing many series by sweep, record amount, upset loss, or going away (last 3 games) shows that LeBallDominate is susceptible to getting ragdolled by superior brands of ball and therefore losing the attrition battle as the series wears on - the historical record confirms this with Lebron's teams weakening and getting blown away in the latter parts of many series, as listed above.
Again, prime Lebron was everyone's b**** because prime Lebron was destroyed by so many teams via upset, sweep or record loss like the Magic, Mavs, Spurs, Warriors or Nuggets - the hand-picked, preseason favorite, super-teams of prime Lebron were destroyed by many different opponents
There probably isn't anyone in the front office of NBA teams that played D1 basketball and was a senior analyst in M&A. Requires an MBA or MS in Finance. It's a rare combination
Assuming actual IB / Wall Street type of job (which you are implying, but there are tons of lower-level positions that are similar-sounding, but a long way from proper wall street front office), "senior analyst" is an entry-level position. If you have an MBA from a top school, you would go straight to become an associate, which is a level above. I've met tons of D1 athletes that did very well in that world - if that was valuable, I'm sure teams would have no trouble finding people with that background.
Also, the way you're talking, you must be like 50+? You're talking about a job you had when you were, what, like 25? That's your highest level of qualification? Is this around the time your symptoms started?
