Ongoing VP TR, PART 2!
Hi all, apparently my previous thread may have gotten so long that it's causing issues for the website. So, here is a new thread to keep this going, and it also gives me an opportunity to provide a quick recap of how I've gotten to that point.
Background-
- former poker player; got in pre-2003 boom, printed money online until about 2007 when games got harder/I started making decent money
- took poker roll and transitioned to straight casino degen. Went thru a blackjack and craps phase
- Dad played progressively bigger and more at various Vegas casinos starting around 2005, settled on Wynn and gave them all of his action. Massive comps and Chairman's club status for Dad resulted
- I started playing VP around 2013, 2014? knowing it was one of the best casino games on offer; slagged off of parent's comp for years
- as I played more and bigger, Dad's host became my host
- Circa 2019-2021, went on the most massive sun run, +500k over that time period; basically played bigger, kept winning, played bigger, kept winning, etc
- 2022-now- basically have run cold and am trying to sustain my VP for the long term
Game of choice-
- Triple double bonus, preferring multiline and ultimate X
- will play craps, more often with buddies
- despise blackjack
Typical TR features stays at the Wynn, good food, gambling, +/- other stuff (shows, family coming with, etc)
That's probably a decent synopsis!
oh wow, super interesting, went into the WA rabbit hole
this also explains the lack of slots that are popular everywhere else, especially progressive state slots
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/gambling...
it appears that i blundered my draw, should have kept a low card and the "match card" randomly gave me an extra 1200 credits to make up the gap for my failure lol
Interesting. I'm pretty sure AA is correctly discarding the kicker at DDB. And today I learned you don't have to sweat strategy with VP in WA.
Quick update- good day at the local yesterday. Got dealt premiums, always nice when I don't have sweat the kicker draw!
Played big afterwards for quite a while. Woulda been an amazing day if I could have hit huge again, but alas, not to be. Still a +25k day. Drew really well with the pic below, held a single ace and converted twice.
When I learned about those class II machines I immediately figured I wouldn't like them. Who wants to play on a machine where the outcome is predetermined? Then I realized that predetermined by RNG (assuming the RNG is "choosing" at the true odds) vs determined in the moment by RNG might as well be exactly the same thing 😉
Would still feel weird though, "knowing" my decisions were meaningless.
When I learned about those class II machines I immediately figured I wouldn't like them. Who wants to play on a machine where the outcome is predetermined? Then I realized that predetermined by RNG (assuming the RNG is "choosing" at the true odds) vs determined in the moment by RNG might as well be exactly the same thing 😉
Would still feel weird though, "knowing" my decisions were meaningless.
Can't wrap my head around it. So, I flop premium quads (44344) and I hold nothing, and redraw gives me say, 33334? F*cked up.
Can't wrap my head around it. So, I flop premium quads (44344) and I hold nothing, and redraw gives me say, 33334? F*cked up.
Yeah how about this? You get dealt 33334 and decide to go for the royal, so you toss all the cards. Class II machine "fixes" your mistake for you. "You WILL accept this money!"
I can actually see some people's results being BETTER than if they were allowed to make decisions for themselves.
Yeah how about this? You get dealt 33334 and decide to go for the royal, so you toss all the cards. Class II machine "fixes" your mistake for you. "You WILL accept this money!"
I can actually see some people's results being BETTER than if they were allowed to make decisions for themselves.
Did you ever play any of those machines (Game King, I think) that had the auto-hold feature? IIRC they were all single line, but perhaps also those early 3-play and 5-play machines.
After the deal the machine auto-held cards for the draw but the player had the option to change any/all cards. Sometimes it was the optimal hold, but often it was not (but usually reasonable). It really slowed good players down because it took longer to think about what changes to make than it did simply to hold the correct ones on a regular machine. At least it did for me. The player could not disable the auto-hold, but a slot attendant could. Sometimes a casino would refuse to disable it.
Many vp players would have been better off to stick to those machines and simply accept the machine's selection before the draw.
Did you ever play any of those machines (Game King, I think) that had the auto-hold feature? IIRC they were all single line, but perhaps also those early 3-play and 5-play machines.
After the deal the machine auto-held cards for the draw but the player had the option to change any/all cards. Sometimes it was the optimal hold, but often it was not (but usually reasonable). It really slowed good players down because it took longer to think about what changes to make than it did simply to hold the
vp on a pph had this, it was the correct hold about 80% of the time but a bunch of times the wizard of odds chart disagreed - was never sure if it were due to ignorance or malice
Barona had some machines with the autohold feature before. They've gotten rid of 99% of them. The old all-star IIs played TDB PERFECTLY- couple that with true turbo mode and I spent many a night literally just blasting through hands- dealdrawdealdrawdealdrawdealdraw as fast as I could, with the occasional surprise jackpot thrown in. You can't feed bills in fast enough on one of those machines when it was cold. That's actually where I got one of my first dealt 4AWAK autoholds also- everything happened so fast and then the machine just locked up and flashed "10,000" at me. I actually stopped playing as fast soon after that- what's the point in playing if I can't even appreciate what's happening when it's good?
After they got rid of those, they still had an extra draw frenzy machine with autohold enabled- that one was really annoying. It would automatically dump the kicker when you got a premium trip draw. Anyone who's played EDF knows when you get dealt trips, it automatically goes into bonus game mode and you can't make any hold decisions. I played that game a few times before I got too annoyed at the EV I was forced to give up. So there's an example of autohold NOT doing the right thing, AND the player not being able to overcome it.
I still think Barona moved away from autohold (they're on a few machines still but not many) bc it was making most players play BETTER, mistakes and all.
Barona had some machines with the autohold feature before. They've gotten rid of 99% of them. The old all-star IIs played TDB PERFECTLY- couple that with true turbo mode and I spent many a night literally just blasting through hands- dealdrawdealdrawdealdrawdealdraw as fast as I could, with the occasional surprise jackpot thrown in. You can't feed bills in fast enough on one of those machines when it was cold. That's actually where I got one of my first dealt 4AWAK autoholds also- everything hap
Are those 100% accurate? The only place I've seen a player selection for auto-hold was this U1 video poker machine at El Cortez, where it explicitly tells you it will offer a poorer pay schedule if you select computer play.
Are those 100% accurate? The only place I've seen a player selection for auto-hold was this U1 video poker machine at El Cortez, where it explicitly tells you it will offer a poorer pay schedule if you select computer play.
The ones I've played on looked exactly like all the other cabinets, they just had "autohold" feature enabled. There are even some machines that have a plaque attached that says "no autohold available". I think it's actually a standard feature that individual casinos can choose to turn on or not. When I checked, they seemed accurate (exception- the EDF which refused to hold a kicker) but once I verified the machines were "good enough for me", I would just play and blast through hands. So, I suppose there were situations that I didn't check that came up and I wouldn't even know the machine was mis-holding bc I wouldn't be looking at that point. The point is moot now bc I don't play on any of those machines anymore.
In other news, got a good streak going at the local...
Played small again, rough start then got nearly even with an amazing dealt royal... 6 values off.
Won, lost, won, lost, almost felted then hit dealt premiums WITH a kicker again!
Gave almost 7k back to finish with a 20k win.
Nice run good. I've played approximately 15,000 hands on the hundred machines this year, and ZERO flopped quads. Kinda getting frustrated. Of course, I flopped a Royal in August (first time ever), so I guess I'm due for a bad streak. That's how VP works, right? 😉
the chainsaw uploaded this a month ago
Went to a casino to sports bet. They gave me $10 in slot freeplay and I went to the only video poker machine they had (most casinos have none here) it's an interesting variant but it seems i hit yahtzee and binked this on like the 4th spin
Where is this sportsbook that gives away free play instead of drink vouchers?
Feb TR
It's been a while. Backstory here is D and I both got an invite to a 5k buy in/1.5k rebuy slot tournament. We're definitely showing up for that, esp since our results in the 10k and 2.5k last year were decent. Obv not the bink we were looking for, but we won a little money each time. We figure we're due.
D's wife who hates Vegas is joining, her friend who loves Vegas convinced her to go and hang out. So it'll be the 4 of us plus my friend J who's been on a few March Madness trips and has featured in some previous TRs. J's much more of a low roller and craps is his main game.
Agenda-
Thurs- get in, try Caramella at Planet Hollywood, craps at Bellagio afterwards
Fri- reg for tourney, dinner at Mizumi, see David Blaine
Sat- bink slot tourney, dinner at Casa Playa
Sun- head home
Other stuff with the agenda- why craps at the Bellagio, you say? Well, D has been trying to figure out what other property to maintain status at. He currently has highest at Caesars and whatever is below Noir at MGM. He's been able to do Caesar's on his own, but MGM is due to me putting in action on his card when he played at Cosmo, meaning he wouldn't be there without me and is probably going to lose it soon. I've got Wynn taken care of, obv.
So we've been debating this- initially we thought the play was Caesars but the properties are just such shtholes and the restaurants/other perks are better at MGM. Also, both of us love the Bellagio from our poker days. I could see us staying there on a future comped trip if we ever get sick of the Wynn. So, we're going to give them some action Thurs night, double sized buy in on his card. We'll have to see how much earn we get from our play, but I'm ok giving the Bellagio some action if we can maintain status there. Don't want to do too much obv and reduce my primary benefit from the Wynn, of course.
Looking forward to David Blaine- I've never seen him, and have always heard so much hype around him. I'm the type to automatically assume the hype is just that, so I await to be impressed.
I'm also planning on sweating our own TonySoprano9 and hopefully seeing him bink a mixed game tourney or two. We'll definitely meet up at some point on this trip.
J and D are planning on buying 5% and 10% of my VP action, respectively. And, we're all still on somewhat limited/downright short bankrolls. I'm personally bringing...
Bankroll- 40k
Let's get this started!
Day 1
Before the trip even starts, I make a smart? play and avoid extra Vegas. I was always scheduled to work the day before we left, but otherwise had the earlier part of the week off. Turns out the staff at the hospital have decided to strike on Wed, looks like I won't be needed, yadayada. So what was a 4-day weekend in Vegas could have actually been 9 DAYS :shocked: had I known about the strike.
So I find this out on Monday. Hmm. I could literally go to Vegas RIGHT NOW. Or, at a minimum I can come in a day early. HMMMMWHATTODODEGENSOSTRONGINME
Finally make the right call and keep everything as is- come in Thurs, leave Sun. I know I could have easily come in one day early, but I already did that in Aug 2024 with Fontainebleau and found a way to get stuck 20k a day early, and spent the rest of the trip on life support. Who knows though...
D's wife takes a bad beat- before we leave we find out her friend she was going to hang out with had-
- arrived in Vegas early as planned
- as soon as she arrived, found out step dad just died
- is currently boarding a plane to Chicago and will not be with us in Vegas
Well that sucks. Add on a standard SW delay and we're off to a bad start. Finally, finally, finally, we're off to the promised land.
Never gets old.
The one upside with the delay is J, who was going to join us at the Wynn due to later flight, now can grab a ride with us to the hotel! So we elect to wait. He gets in. Has no checked bag. And we wait. And wait... OMG between the flight delay and now this I am itching with impatience. Gotta learn to just chill... finally J shows up and we're on our way!
We get in, get settled and I decide to head to hi limit first. This multiline machine has never been great the first day and I figure it's due. Actually, semi-seriously I'd like to coast, the best way to do that is multiline/no carnival games, and I'm planning on playing more lines and short buying. If we catch heat right away we're poised for a great trip. If it's no good, I'll just step back down. Only way I can screw myself is to play bigger for longer than intended. Not going to happen.
We open very quickly!
After that hit, I really thought this was going to be the outstanding opening session I've been looking for. Alas, not to be and I give all that back + what I was ok losing, so I'm 3k in the hole before we move to UX.
This was just outstanding. After all the times we only get one ace on the deal, finally some lightning comes from it.
We step to 10 lines.
BOOM!
I play at 10 lines for a long time. Gave back more than I should, probably, but at the end I still lock up a huge ticket in the safe and we're up 13k for the trip now. We all head to dice at Encore, then we've got a ride to Caramella for dinner.
The session starts off choppy. I get the dice and I have a nice roll. I'm betting the inside numbers and have them pressed up a decent amount. I also hit half of the bonus feature, for which D and I are very superstitious. It sure seems like very often when half gets hit (happens quite often), the next roll is automatic 7 out. F, so now we're here, we're in the middle of a hot roll, BUT...
I quickly tell D and J to turn their bets off. We have to explain why to J. Whatever, it's still the first day and we've got to make this money last. Theoretically, the best way to do that is NOT play, and turning our bets off, even for a roll, is precisely that. Obv we know it's doesn't actually matter. We've got dealer bets working and they're pretty good too. OK, everybody off. My next roll...
Spoiler
Yep. 7 OUT!
God we feel like geniuses. I mean, we're positively giddy from saving our money. The dealers start fist bumping us bc we saved their money too. So they pass the dice to the next guy, D starts taking down his bets!? I say to him that the next roll is just the next roll, I'm literally leaving all of mine exactly as is, etc. He and J decide to chop their bets down a bit. I stay put and fasten my seatbelt.
The next shooter also has a good roll! Actually, in some respects it was mediocre because he didn't hit many numbers. In another respect though, it was OUTSTANDING bc all he hit was 9. Over and over. Keep in mind my bet on 9 was already big from the previous roll. So we hit 9 at 1000, go to 1500, hit go to 2k, hit go to 3k!! hit go to... meh YOLO. Go to 5k, table max. Another table max number at the Wynn, achieved.
On the way there. I'm either at 2 or 3k currently on the 9.
Boom! I'm at the 5 yellow chip spot, obv. 9 was so good even low roller J has 1k on it!
God, please let me hit a table max number once. Just once... pleasepleasepleaseplease
They exchange my 5 yellow for a flag. Just like in 2022 when I hit table max on 6 or 8. Send the dice...
Spoiler
7 out!!!!!! FFFFFFFFFFFFFF
God that was disappointing. ARGH. Still an amazing sequence, obv, esp with us turning off the bets at the perfect time. I swear, the next time I hit table max (if there is a next time), we're a) telling them not to change it out for a flag, and b) turning our bets off for one roll again. Shouldn't matter, but let's see if it does.
OK, that was fun. We bet big two more rolls and they're both terrible. We leave, still got time for more VP before dinner.
In for 2, out for 14k.
Cannot complain about this session. Nothing major, but plenty of little hits, and we're now up 27k for the trip!
Head to the room to get changed, drop off ticket, and grab cash for the Bellagio...
Waiting for our ride to Planet Hollywood.
I literally know nothing about this place except it's relatively new.
We get a ton of food to share.
The salads were just ok, meatballs were outstanding. Wagyu tartar fine but nothing special. I got the spicy chicken (6/10), the seabass was well cooked and fork tender (8/10). Pasta 9/10, Pork tenderloin 6/10. They ordered creme brulee when I stepped away from the table, I was beyond full and never would have ordered it. Only 5/10.
Overall, I'd give the place a 7/10. Definitely a solid meal and not super expensive. After we're done my ass is dragging. I could fall asleep, right now, IF we were at the Wynn. But Bellagio is across the street... ok let's stick to the plan. I swear though, god's honest truth had I been at the Wynn I would have gone to bed at 8:30pm, first night in Vegas, and just lock in a huge day 1 win, no regrets. I was that tired.
I grab a decaf and get my second wind somewhere on the way to...
I just love this place. It's the poker history.
We find the only open dice table and it's 50 min. That's ok, we're doubling our buy in and our stakes. AND... we get crushed. Never a good roll. Loseloseloselose as fast as we can bet. Well, that sucked. The only upside is none of us are any worse than if we were playing on our own. I lose 2k and we're back at +25k for the trip. We head back to Wynn... I've got my second wind now plus I'm awake being pissed at Bellagio... ok more VP. I set a stop loss of 4k for the evening, obv blow right past it and lose 8k total. ARGHARGAHGATRHGHGHGH why didn't I just go to bed? Why didn't I skip the Bellagio, or save it for another day?
Oh well. We'll never know now. Still a great first day, but there was no need to hurt myself like that to finish the night. I'm exhausted and upset at myself.
Day 1 result- +17k
5 digit hits- 1
Day 2 coming soon...
Helluva result though, even if it starts to feel like a loss with that dip at the end
The last dish at dinner made me think of Groucho.
I feel your pain when stop loss becomes just a suggestion. Been there, done that.
TY for trying a new restaurant. This should be mandatory for all future trips, for us.
Day 2
I wake up pretty early as is typical. Start off in hi limit, just waiting for this machine to actually be amazing for once. Turns out I'm going to keep waiting, I lose 3k and am about to get up when I finally get my first dealt quads of the trip.
Spoiler
Obv we'll take it, but it's not a knockout punch,
After that the machine turns to ice and I donk all that back. Shockingly fast, actually. Head over to UX with some trepidation.
Thankfully, I pick up dealt quads number 2 soon after!
Spoiler
PREMIUM!
Kicker draw result-
Spoiler
The idea of dealt premiums on UX is almost always better than the actual result.
At least I got to play that AM. Totally even for the day, meaning I got back the 3k I dumped at hi limit. We head to Tableau for breakfast. I forgot to take pics. After breakfast J and I hit the machines while D gets his wife settled in the spa. We're also planning on playing dice we he's done.
J and I walk right into a buzzsaw awful session and I'm down 5k again in no time flat. We then hit dice and it's awful too, I lose another 2k. I'm thoroughly pissed now. I just don't understand why Friday ALWAYS sucks. I know that's not true, but it sure seems like it these days.
On another note, I contacted my host at FB on a whim just to see what kind of free credit I could get. I was very honest, told her I was staying at the Wynn but wanted to see how much FC she'd give me to get me in the door. She responded this AM- 6K!!! Well, that's worth it. So we've got a limo to take us to Fontainebleau, leaving at 12. To kill time, we head back to UX and I slow play but it's still awful and I lose ANOTHER 2k. I'm down 9k for the day so far. Tired of losing real money, I decide to zap the free credit from the Wynn.
Start and end, basically 100% payback.
At Fontainebleau, I head to their multiline machine. They have added TDB which I requested from before, and also added another machine. I kind of want to play DSTP but given my results were so bad in Aug I figure I'll wash the FC through the multiline machine first and see what happens.
Only hit of note on that machine.
I swear, in my small sample size I just cannot win at FB. D and J head to play craps while I get dealt absolutely nothing. We've been here less than an hr and I'm almost felted. I previously planned on taking at least 1k net from FB, but I literally have barely played and wanted to give them at least a little play so I don't totally burn them. So I switch over to DSTP before I run out of money from the free credit, continue to run like dogsht and soon have felted the whole 6k.
HMMM. HMMM. Still haven't been here even an hr! I dig for more money, put 1k in the DSTP machine. Felted. Rage join D at craps. Play with their terrible ass plastic POS chips, buy in for 1.5k... felted.
FFFFFFFFF I HATE THIS CASINO!!!!!!!
So let's recap- I only came over here bc of the 6k free credit. I managed to get stuck an additional 2.5k and barely have played. I HATE this casino. I just get such a bad vibe. D of course has 1k free play- he washes it playing 40 lines at quarters, somehow manages to convert trip aces to 4AWAK 3 times and books a 3k winner. FFFFF. I'm happy for him, obv, but my lord I'm running badly right now.
Head back to the Wynn stuck 11.5k for the day. Can't get out of here fast enough. I can't say I'll never be back to FB to gamble, but right now that's how I feel. I'll give it to them- they know what they're doing. They got me in and playing, and that's enough to give them a shot at my money.
I do the smart thing and try and take a nap. We're supposed to register for the tourney at 5, we have dinner at 6 at Mizumi and then David Blaine afterwards. I toss and turn for 1/2 hr before I finally give up and head back down. Mentally, I feel better at least. I'm still up, technically. Not much more play is going to happen today. Still have the slot tourney and some minimal guaranteed prize... it's better than being stuck right now.
UX hits me with dealt quads number 3!
Spoiler
Premium again!
Kicker draw-
Spoiler
Again, the idea of dealt premiums seems a lot better than the reality at 5 line UX. There's just not enough shots, or multipliers most of the time.
Manage to book a small win (2k that session). Still 9.5k in the hole. We head over to register for the slot tourney. Crazy day so far- dealt quads 3 times, twice premium, and yet today SUCKS!
Rest of Day 2 coming soon...
sigh
