3v3 Codenames

tales - unlimited

Repeat clue. Watch is off the board and neutral, Witch is off the board and ours.

Is there any reading but " You were right, go get it team?"

so it was bed/knight/giant/witch...watch wasn't ours

so unlimited for 2nd on list and knight/witch/giant

I guess he didn't make the connection that fairytales are read as bedtime stories to do tales - 4 to get us off watch

yeah, at this point recluing it means top 3 of list and bottles

bed
knight
giant
bottles

go for it, since you had it right last turn

bump

bed knight giant bottles

Of course I made the connection that fairytales are read as bedtime stories. What I am apparently incapable of is knowing all the ****ing “rules” that exist in the endgame.

n-1 = first on the list is good
unlimited = first is bad, 2nd is good OR guess the obv and run the list
n = both are bad

Now, I can appreciate unlimited = guess the obv and run the list, but not when the decision behind it is “he could’ve double clued for 2nd on the list and didnt, so IT’S NEVER just 2nd on the list.”

Anyway, gg

There aren’t rules, just deduction based on the limited options you had and what you chose to clue

If you clue 4 then you deny next word on list because logically you would have clued 3 if next word was ours

If you clue unlimited then we know it’s not just the next word or you woulda done 3 so it’s either both or just the second

So with unlimited we have to guess which you meant; in this case, the 2nd word on list hits the clue so therefore can conclude it’s both because you didn’t just do a 4 clue

It’s just logic around why did you clue a certain number. If 4 words hit your clue and they are out last 4 words, then just clue 4 as it’s much more clear than unlimited. The only caveat to that is if first on list is ours because then you would have clued 3 if first is ours or unlimited if both were ours.

Unlimited is an ambiguous clue so when you chose to do that, we deduced it’s because you could not clue 3 or 4

Gg and good clues; we were sailing until hiccup at the end

So what happens when I clue 4 because it’s neither of the top two on the list? What happens when there are five that hit the clue and one happens the be 2nd on the list? That’s my point. Whatever this convention or logic is you’re asserting is flawed. Just because it would’ve worked this time doesn’t mean it works.

The meta stuff definitely can be frustrating. One reason the no list game is refreshing in a way. 😀

Good game!

I do think we FPSed it a bit, Nich and I, this time.

This is what me and erv have been trying to change. Using unlimited to sometimes mean run the list or sometimes mean skip a word and choose the next one is dumb and counterintuitive. Unlimited should ALWAYS mean your next word/s are good.

when you clue 4 with 4 left we know to remove next on list and then we figure out best 4 for that clue

it's a game of communication and spymaster should choose the most direct and clear method of communicating

n-1 = find n-1 words for clue and top of list
n = find that many words, but it can't be top of list, so remove top of list before looking at words
n-2+ = find n-2+ words for clue
unlimited = next 2+ on your list are good

the only 'unclear' one is when we use unlimited for 2nd on list...there is NO way to let people know that 2nd on list is good without re-cluing 2nd on list, so we use unlimited for that because it's available and there is a logical way to deduce when this is being used (not a rule)

I could consider getting on board with only doing that when 2-3 words left because then it's more clear if unlimited is next 2 on list or 2nd on list, but I like the flexibility of being able to use it with 4 words left like here but with a dozen different people playing across 5+ threads, perhaps simpler to just say unlimited is next 2+ on list if there are 4+ words left and we only use it for 2nd on list when 2-3 words left

3 words left - unlimited clue:
either you clued hard at one word and it's next 2
or you clued for 2 words and so it's those 2 + 2nd on list
so pretty easy to tell and low error rate

2 words left - unlimited clue:
it's 2nd on list unless you reclued a prior clue to let us know it's both words on list
pretty easy to tell and low error rate

so pretty clear

with 4 words left - unlimited clue:
either you clued 1-2 words and it's next 2-3 on list
or you clued 3 words and it's 2nd on list

telling the difference between which of these it is can be hard

this game, if the last word and 2nd on list wasn't bed but was blue then we would have had harder decision because you couldn't go 4 and you couldn't combine giant/knight/witch/blue so you'd have to go unlimited, and this is the scenario when unlimited being for 2nd means winning the game vs losing the game

but you also could have meant watch/blue + giant/knight and that's a standard unlimited play

so this is where it's not clear
BUT it's also the place where the ONLY way to win here this turn is to use unlimited for 2nd on list

and our 2nd on list is very often correct so it's a very useful clue

I personally prefer to keep the ability to win in this case when 2nd on list is correct...and it would have worked this time IF bed didn't hit tale

I think it's a shame to make a rule that we can't use for 2nd on list when 4 words left and cut off this winning line

and I'll reiterate one last time that I don't think how I clue and propose we clue contains a SINGLE rule; I think it's all just deductive logic

if 3 words left:
if you clue 2, then top of list must be good or we couldn't win here, so guess 2 words + top of list
if you clue 3, top of list is bad or you would have clued 2, therefore don't guess top of list and guess 3 other words that hit the clue
if you clue talon - unlimited and the only word on board that hits talon is hawk then it's hawk + top 2 on list; if you instead of cluing talon clue animals - unlimited and there is hawk and dog on the list, then you must want both of those guessed but then we can't win, so must guess another; and it's not 3 animal words or you would have clued 3, and can't be top of list because you would have clued 2; therefore, 2nd on list is the next best option for guessing

so just standard logic like used in a variety of logic puzzles

and then with 4 words left, we just extend same logic, but now have to decide between 1+3, 2+2 or 3+1 because there are more combinations with more words, but logic remains the same

anyway, we've been having this discussion for 4 years now; most games we all figure out what spymaster is trying to communicate and we play this game well

every once in awhile we have a hiccup and then this discussion happens again but we don't really get anywhere, so prolly best to just move on and enjoy the games and know we'll never play optimally and all be 100% on the same page with the clues

I mostly post them so people know better how I'm thinking when I'm spymaster just like d1 and ervin post about using unlimited instead of n-1 so we know how they think when they are spymaster

bump

bump for Nich and eb

Atlantis
Bell
Buffalo
Cat
Cross
Czech
Duck
Fall
Fly
Gold
Helicopter
Loch ness
Maple
Microscope
Pan
Plane
Plate
Screen
Scuba diver
Skyscraper
Spike
Spy
Temple
Wall
Whip

I'll be red if this is odd.

Disney - 5

Atlantis - pretty sure there's a Disney film about Atlantis
Bell - Tinkerbell
Buffalo
Cat - Aristocats
Cross
Czech
Duck - Donald Duck
Fall
Fly
Gold
Helicopter
Loch ness
Maple
Microscope
Pan - Peter Pan
Plane
Plate
Screen - TV screen
Scuba diver
Skyscraper
Spike
Spy
Temple
Wall
Whip

There's my favourite 6 but I'm sure there are good arguments for other words too.

Screen
Pan
Duck
Bell
Cat
Pass

Atlantis
Fly

Is Spy Kids Disney? I don't think it is

I'm sure Spy is a good backup word. Don't know about spy kids.

I'm fine woth your order. Bold unless you want to discuss more.

Screen
Pan
Duck
Bell
Cat
Pass

Atlantis
Fly