USA Goes to War Against Iran
Time for a dedicated thread to the war.
How long will it last and what will be the probable outcome?
there have been leaks that Trump has been asking for talks since the first day of the war.
apparently this guy is fairly reputable as far as Israeli journos go.
All of this is explained once you realize that Trump is an Israel-loving boomer who tried to start war with Iran in his first term by assassinating their top general. Anyone with a brain that can just look at who his “Secretary of War” and Secretary of State are would know he was going to start all kinds of wars.Like maybe at some point people should just listen to
They would have had the same blackmail in the first term, wouldn't they? It didn't make sense to do a big grass-mowing operation back then, though, with Trump needing to get reelected.
Is it really worth it for him to alienate a large % percentage of his voter base and give his opponents all sorts of tough-to-laugh-off talking points, adding to his troubles with the Epstein and affordability issues? He really loves Israel that much?
just addicted to blood
Is it really worth it for him to alienate a large % percentage of his voter base and give his opponents all sorts of tough-to-laugh-off talking points, adding to his troubles with the Epstein and affordability issues?
I'm not sure why you think Trump cares much about this stuff at this point.
Because he doesn't expect to run in another election. The possibility of having to run for reelection was the only constraint on Trump's behavior.
Trump doesn't care about these things, especially the Republican party.
But why is a guy who is famously non-ideological or amoral suddenly making hardline ideological and moral decisions? Is that consistent with his MO?
I read the same thing, and if this is accurate, then the timing was particularly idiotic.
Insufficient interceptors means more Iranian missiles get through, which increases the risk that the conflict will escalate and broaden.
Iran only has a finite amount of missiles and drones and interceptor missiles are far from perfect so yes it may hurt, but Iran is also going to blow their load at some point and maybe this is as good a ratio they're going to get. I put my faith more in Satanyahu over anyone in the Trump administration to make this call as their country is going to take the brunt of it and they're actually intelligent.
Is fatso some new fangled antisemitic slur?
Israel can holocaust Palestine, invade Iran, go on the nelk boys to propagandize us citizens, spend untold billions on bipartisan political lobbying, but the second someone is radicalized by these actions we are supposed to protect Israel from criticism
I’m honestly not following
Maybe Israel should stop overplaying its hand
Iran only has a finite amount of missiles and drones and interceptor missiles are far from perfect so yes it may hurt, but Iran is also going to blow their load at some point and maybe this is as good a ratio they're going to get. I put my faith more in Satanyahu over anyone in the Trump administration to make this call as their country is going to take the brunt of it and they
Yeah, presumably the US and Israel did the math ahead of time and wouldn't have started this if they didn't think the ratios were in their favor.
Could be going for a scenario similar the 1972 Christmas bombings where Hanoi ran out of SAMs and then agreed to end the war.
apparently Kuwait has done more damage to the us military then Iran has so far. LMAO
Even if I concede the point about Trump not caring about legacy (which is odd, given that every egotistical president has), he seemed to like the lighthearted days of joking about wokeness, dunking on world leaders with rhetoric, and triggering people who took his provocations too seriously. Why make things serious in such unnecessary fashion, especially when you've never done it in your entire career? (...other than the Khamenei assassination, which is consistent with the blackmail narrative.)
He loves Israel that much? I would expect him to keep the pro-Israel policies humming beneath the surface, but I never would have expected him to make this level of sacrifice for Zionist principles.
Is fatso some new fangled antisemitic slur?
Israel can holocaust Palestine, invade Iran, go on the nelk boys to propagandize us citizens, spend untold billions on bipartisan political lobbying, but the second someone is radicalized by these actions we are supposed to protect Israel from criticism
I’m honestly not following
Maybe Israel should stop overplaying its hand
Maybe I missed something (certainly not the first time), but who specifically is arguing that Israel should be 'protected from criticism?' Thanks.
Is fatso some new fangled antisemitic slur?
Israel can holocaust Palestine, invade Iran, go on the nelk boys to propagandize us citizens, spend untold billions on bipartisan political lobbying, but the second someone is radicalized by these actions we are supposed to protect Israel from criticism
I’m honestly not following
Maybe Israel should stop overplaying its hand
No one said anyone should stop criticizing the Israeli government or supporters of that government. I am a critic of the Israeli government.
fatso of course isn't a traditional antisemitic slur. It was just a slur directed at an ethnic/religious community as opposed to a government or a state.
My comment was not motivated by personal sensitivity. I'm not religious. I'm not ethnically Jewish. I have no particular connection to Israel. I was just giving my opinion that Deuces crossed the line from perfectly acceptable criticism of the Israeli government, Netanyahu, etc., into antisemitism. I wasn't surprised that his comment was left up because that's consistent with things being a general free-for-all now. I was surprised that your response was (and I'm paraphrasing and exaggerating a bit), "maybe it's a trope that the Jews control everything, but tropes exist for a reason, and it seems like the Jews control the U.S. government."
I also at annoyed at the implication that we really should be blaming Jewish people, or even the Israeli government, for U.S. foreign policy (or at least blaming them more than we blame the U.S. government) when it is blindingly obvious that the U.S. has vastly more resources than Israel and has always been far more of a shot caller than Israel could ever hope to be.
Is fatso some new fangled antisemitic slur?
Israel can holocaust Palestine, invade Iran, go on the nelk boys to propagandize us citizens, spend untold billions on bipartisan political lobbying, but the second someone is radicalized by these actions we are supposed to protect Israel from criticism
I’m honestly not following
Maybe Israel should stop overplaying its hand
Maybe I missed something (certainly not the first time), but who specifically is arguing that Israel should be 'protected from criticism?' about anything? Thanks.
No one said anyone should stop criticizing the Israeli government or supporters of that government. I am a critic of the Israeli government.fatso of course isn't a traditional antisemitic slur. It was just a slur directed at an ethnic/religious community as opposed to a government or a state.My comment was not motivated by personal sensitivity. I'm not religious. I'm not et
Unfortunately, antisemitism is acceptable in this forum. DK and Victor being two clear examples imo.
n.b. Of course, I'm not a mod and I'm just a guest here anyway, so if the mods are kewl with antisemitism that's their choice.
Unfortunately, antisemitism is acceptable in this forum. DK and Victor being two clear examples imo.
It isn't singularly permitted. You can say similar stuff about Muslims, black people, women, etc. Again, a near free-for-all was what the majority wanted, so there is no reason to get mad at the mods.
It isn't singularly permitted. You can say similar stuff about Muslims, black people, women, etc. Again, a near free-for-all was what the majority wanted, so there is no reason get mad at the mods.
I'm not mad at the mods. I'm just a guest here like everyone else, so whatever the mods want to do is their business.
By the way, saying anything even remotely negative about women will get a quick temp-ban from Crossnerd. (I should know.)
The idea that the US got into the war because Israel did a Leeeeeeeeroy Jenkins is frankly, the most implausible lie that any administration has tried to sell since “Iraq has WMDs so we have to invade”.
That’s why I think this is mostly a neocon project and not because of Israel, because if that’s the reasoning they are using something else must be going on.
I’m almost surprised Victor would believe a word of that, but it does play into the ZOG narrative so maybe that’s why he believes it.
Think there is a decent case to be made that this is more for Israel's safety than America's. Everyone focuses on the nuclear thing but another big point in the negotiations was to stop funding proxies. People saying Iran is the largest state funding terrorism globally. Look at the wiki of terrorist attacks linked to Iran. The vast, vast majority of them are targeting Israelis
The worry with nuclear weapons isn’t just purely about the security of Israel, and I don’t think it was necessarily ever about ICBMs on the US, which we have no idea if they would even be effective or not. The real issue with any country developing nukes that are hostile to American interest is that it upsets the regional balance of power and makes it that much harder and trickier to combat them militarily.
And yes, their proxies have been disruptive for many American interests and regional allies.
The issue I would have with your comparison to Canada is that Canada is in the Western Hemisphere which brings the Monroe Doctrine into play. Any incursions on the Western hemisphere in general are taken quite seriously due to our proximity and longstanding historical precedent.
Anyway, I think I saw Rococo mention logistical issues at play here, which is another reason why a foreign entity attacking Canada would be a much easier sell for most Americans. Right now, we are essentially shifting our military into a position of needing to project power in a situation where the military opponent is going to be decentralized and experienced in the context of fighting a war that is distributed across hundreds of different outposts and targets. It’s one thing to rain down missiles on Tehran, it’s quite another to fight against groups that are not only trained in asymmetrical warfare but have trained other groups to do the same.
I don’t really think that the US under Trump just “stands up for our allies”. He is literally throwing Zelinski under the bus for our underperformance in the first few days of war. They were considered an ally to both Republicans and Democrats before Trump. And he shits on and threatens our closest allies in Europe all the time. Frankly this post is a bit juvenile with how you’re portraying our relationship with our allies, as it is never just about how we can protect them but also how protecting them benefits us. Certainly we wouldn’t follow our allies into any old war, or else the Saudis would have a tremendous argument for us supporting them against the Houthis, an Iran proxy that has been giving them hell for a decade now.
The idea that the US got into the war because Israel did a Leeeeeeeeroy Jenkins is frankly, the most implausible lie that any administration has tried to sell since “Iraq has WMDs so we have to invade”.That’s why I think this is mostly a neocon project and not because of Israel, because if that’s the reasoning they are using something else must be going on.I’m almost surprised
this is literally what I said about it
The idea that the US got into the war because Israel did a Leeeeeeeeroy Jenkins is frankly, the most implausible lie that any administration has tried to sell since “Iraq has WMDs so we have to invade”.That’s why I think this is mostly a neocon project and not because of Israel, because if that’s the reasoning they are using something else must be going
you mean the months of deployments around iran by the us military was not caused by the jews? gee wiz. Yall need to stop blaming minority's and own it. There's nothing wrong with what your doing
Yeah, presumably the US and Israel did the math ahead of time and wouldn't have started this if they didn't think the ratios were in their favor.
Could be going for a scenario similar the 1972 Christmas bombings where Hanoi ran out of SAMs and then agreed to end the war.
Iran had to retaliate for Khameini. But after all this they haven't even declared war. Think about that as it relates to their objectives. And this isn't at all like Israel basically demanding unconditional surrender from the Palestians.
If what they were saying about being close to agreeing to our terms a week or so ago is true, I don't see them escalating even further and losing even more. Not that they won't cause a lot of disruption in the short term but that's what they do to strengthen their position with negotiations, not to actually win. They just need to frame it like we're the ones suing for peace.
