In other news

In other news

In the current news climate we see that some figures and events tend to dominate the front-pages heavily. Still, there a

12 October 2020 at 08:13 AM
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Earlier posts are available on our legacy forum HERE

To try to make my point about "least worst" a bit clearer:

Because Labour's general thinking is that they can take most of the left wing vote for granted (because when it comes to it we will be scared of the tories or reform), they moved their policies closer to reforms. That maximises their spectrum of support.

Labour are having to readjust back towards the left a bit because they are facing the fact they cannot simply take our votes for granted.

That's a small part of the necessary shift but it's a start.

by checkraisdraw

Approval rating isn’t the same as the reasons people voted for him, but it could be similar.

Sure. Even his palty 34% including people on the left who convinced themselves that Starmer was actually left wing. He did serve under Corbyn and he did get to be Labour leader by claiming to be left wing. No doubt others as well.


I don’t know enough about politics there to comment, but it doesn’t intrinsically seem like that’s a case of “least worsters” but more a case of voters that have a proven track record of being loyal to labor but not being motivated to come out by Starmer. I mean obviously not every election is going to bring out the voters that vote consistently.

I feel like there’s a bit of an asymmetry between the left and the center, because the center may legitimately feel represented by both parties whereas the left has basically one choice.


Loyalty to parties has gone. There is no longer any great volume of voters who vote X because they always have. Damn good thing too because loyalty to parties that have abandoned us is a disaster.

In the UK we're now seeing the main parties not even come 2nd in elections*. The center is dying. People are desperate for change and if we can't get our act together it's coming fast from the more extreme right.

* we've just had an election in Caerphilly which Labour have held for 100 years or so. They have never lost there. They came 3rd with 11%. There some freakishness to the result but like climate change the freakish events are becoming more extreme and more common.


by chezlaw

The center is dying. People are desperate for change and if we can't get our act together it's coming fast from the more extreme right.

The far right are not just the most likely but the only likely beneficiaries of such a trend.


Currently I very much tend to agree. We are being trounced. The only thing we win at is mocking them as they trounce us.

We've allowed the center to let everything important to decay while entrenching right wing systems and structures. It's really ****ed up now. We still have a small chance so we may as well try.


by chezlaw

The center is dying..

As is your spelling.


Na thats fyne




by Victor

Snip.

It is pretty novel to be so far to to the left that concentration camps and slavery is okay.

But sure, it is all good. You support the Uighur genocide because it is done by communists, Rickroll supports it because it is done by the Chinese and Dunyian supports it because the majority of victims are Muslims.

Outside this predictable political response, which is also representative of both far left and reactionary responses in general, the vast of majority of people don't care, because to do so would mean a couple of years of slightly lower economic growth.

So, nobody needs to worry. It is not like anybody is going to do anything about this issue.

by rickroll

Snip.

Sure, these are the good kind of concentration camps.


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This isn't the 1950s and China isn't remotely a communist country.


by tame_deuces

It is pretty novel to be so far to to the left that concentration camps and slavery is okay.But sure, it is all good. You support the Uighur genocide because it is done by communists, Rickroll supports it because it is done by the Chinese and Dunyian supports it because the majority of victims are Muslims. Outside this predictable political response, which is also representativ

firstly, there is no genocide. we see real genocide in Gaza (something that you undoubtedly support) and this isnt remotely similar even in the fever dream of the evangelical insane anticommunist Adrian Zenz where most of these accusations originate.

but furthermore, you are so indoctrinated with Western Supremacy that you think when I compare something to the US carceral system that I am defending it.


by jalfrezi

This isn't the 1950s and China isn't remotely a communist country.

If you mean communist in the sense that it lives up to an ideology about equality for all and the rest being book-keeping, then sure - they are not a communist country. It is also debatable if such a country has ever existed. If one did, it certainly would not point to a person and say "you're going to the camps because of your ethnicity". However, in the colloquial sense of an unitary single party state (albeit with some pretense of free party participation in name only) under an ideological umbrella which traces its roots to Marxist-Leninism and embraces the "dictatorship of the proletariat", then it certainly is a communist country.

However, that is a debate for the lecture hall.

This is a topic is about persecution and concentration camps. I don't care if concentration camps are Chinese, Russian or American, or whether it is Chinese Communist Party that says genocide is okay, whether it is the Russian Duma that approves eradication of nationality in countries they invade, or whether is the American Supreme Court that says you don't get due process if you have the wrong skin color.


It's pertinent because you accused someone of "supporting the Uighur genocide because it's done by communists".

As China shares very little with the tenets of Communism you need another reason to explain why he "supports the Uighur genocide".


by jalfrezi

This isn't the 1950s and China isn't remotely a communist country.

If you said that in China you could end up in a concentration camp.


It doesn't matter what China's government chooses to call itself when you can look at its policies and be sure it's not Communist.


by jalfrezi

It's pertinent because you accused someone of "supporting the Uighur genocide because it's done by communists".

As China shares very little with the tenets of Communism you need another reason to explain why he "supports the Uighur genocide".

For that to hold true, it doesn't really matter what you think is communism, it only matters what Victor thinks is communism. He has described himself as a Stalinist in the past and I have never seen him call out China on matters of note. I suspect he is quite happy to let the unfortunate matter of Chinese concentration camps for specific ethnicities go unnoticed.

Any disagreement between you two on what constitutes "true communism" isn't for me untangle.


by tame_deuces

If you mean communist in the sense that it lives up to an ideology about equality for all and the rest being book-keeping, then sure - they are not a communist country. It is also debatable if such a country has ever existed. If one did, it certainly would not point to a person and say "you're going to the camps because of your ethnicity". However, in the colloquial sense of an

lol bro you support the main purveyor of violence, torture, persecution, and concentration camps in the history of mankind.

its just another flavor of the liberal mantra that says "its ok when we do it. " Im sorry but when you support the USA, and iirc actually served in a NATO Army, then you dont get to criticize and lecture others on human rights.


by Victor

lol bro you support the main purveyor of violence, torture, persecution, and concentration camps in the history of mankind.

its just another flavor of the liberal mantra that says "its ok when we do it. " Im sorry but when you support the USA, and iirc actually served in a NATO Army, then you dont get to criticize and lecture others on human rights.

A condom could have prevented this.


Im sorry that Stalin took away your serfs


by Victor

Im sorry that Stalin took away your serfs

You can choose a leader for your country: Stalin or FDR?


by d2_e4

A condom could have prevented this.

Vic's parents would had been starved to death by Stalin before it got to this stage though.


by jalfrezi

It's pertinent because you accused someone of "supporting the Uighur genocide because it's done by communists".

As China shares very little with the tenets of Communism you need another reason to explain why he "supports the Uighur genocide".

We can No True Scotsman this stuff until the cows come home. And we can talk about the evils of capitalism and Western democracies until the cows come home. Neither tactic changes the fact that countries that have self-identified as communist (whether they met the Cambridge dictionary definition of communism or not) were responsible for some horrible atrocities in the 20th century.

As I've said many times before, if you want to build a case that the governments of the United States and Western Europe are evil, caping for Stalinism or Maoism (as Victor is prone to do) is not the way to go.


by geezerchess

You can choose a leader for your country: Stalin or FDR?



This whole OU Womens Studies essay saga is the perfect microcosm that is MAGA ******ation and hypocrisy.

They literally want "DEI" for ******ed religious white people to be able to succeed in college

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