The Poker Project (playing and writing about poker in the U.S.)
I've learned a bunch from the strategy/life posts on 2+2 over the years and want to involve others in my own poker-related goal: to play, write about, and better understand poker in the U.S. By "better understand poker" I don't mean learning when to reshove with 20BBs vs. a loose opener. I'm more interested in the tougher-to-answer questions that you may have asked yourself from time to time. How is poker important to me? Why does my family discourage (or support) poker as a hobby/profession? What does poker mean to different parts of America and to different parts of the poker-playing community? How does poker appear in literature and film? Why do so many players write about their experiences (insanepoker7, anotherkidanotherdream)? What can we make of this impulse for storytelling?
My Goals
Contribute to the (more or less nonexistent) academic literature on poker
I'm a teacher-researcher who studies literature, narrative, and American culture. In the fall I'll be starting a two-year post-doc in which, as a kind of secondary project, I plan to write about poker. I have two pretty clear ideas for articles and one big, hazy idea for a book. This thread will hopefully serve as a journal/blog/place to brainstorm and hear from 2+2ers.
Become a better poker player
I'll detail my poker story in the next post. The cliffs is: found poker around 2005, played semi-seriously online from 2007-2011, and transitioned to live cash around 2010 (1/2NL, very part-time). For me, getting better means more creativity and rigor in my approach to the game; developing a more intuitive grasp of poker fundamentals, esp math; and moving up in limits (2/5 and 5/10, if the bankroll allows).
With these goals in mind, you can expect a few different kinds of posts in this thread:
Session reports
I should play a decent bit this summer and hope to recount some of my sessions. The content will be similar to my trip reports from Nola (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/27/bri...) and Florida (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/27/bri...). The goal is to write entertaining stories with some strategy mixed in. My "home base" for playing will be in the Gulf Coast area: Houston, Lake Charles, Nola, and Biloxi.
Book Reviews
I plan to review both poker fiction and non-fiction. These posts will probably include a brief summary, my assessment of the book (if I like/dislike, whether it's "well-written"), and questions to think about.
Links to worthwhile poker content
Like this!: http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/9286...
Thematic Posts
on topics like tilt, storytelling, aging, regionalism, literature, strategy--whatever comes to mind!
I'm starting this thread rather than a blog because it encourages dialogue. Part of why I like poker is because it's rooted in stories and people. I'd love to ask and receive questions from you guys for as long as this thread exists. Lookin fwd to it!
I do not watch tv and the majority of the movies/series I watch are not in English. I am astonished that this might come as a surprise for certain (Anglo-saxon) peeps. Nor did I know who Messi was when I first moved to Argentina, nor who Sergio Aguero was a couple weeks back, when we squared off at the poker tables ; nor would I suspect that you would ever know who Richard Desjardins is, nor would I give you a hard time about it, even if he is as they come for us.
I used to watch TV, but nowadays it´s mostly when I´m visiting family/friends and end up watching by accident. I don´t watch it at all when I´m at home. Still read newspapers from time to time though, so I know who Taylor Swift is (she made a tour this year and came to South America, a girl died during one of the brazilian shows, probably due to some combination of the extreme heat and poor choices/judgment, so it ended up in the news).
I definitely know of Taylor Swift and her rep, just never listened to her music.
I know she has a lot of fans for sure.
I used to watch TV, but nowadays it´s mostly when I´m visiting family/friends and end up watching by accident. I don´t watch it at all when I´m at home. Still read newspapers from time to time though, so I know who Taylor Swift is (she made a tour this year and came to South America, a girl died during one of the brazilian shows, probably due to some combination of the extreme heat and poor choices/judgment, so it ended up in the news).
This is how it happens.
I do not watch tv and the majority of the movies/series I watch are not in English. I am astonished that this might come as a surprise for certain (Anglo-saxon) peeps. Nor did I know who Messi was when I first moved to Argentina, nor who Sergio Aguero was a couple weeks back, when we squared off at the poker tables ; nor would I suspect that you would ever know who Richard Desjardins is, nor would I give you a hard time about it, even if he is as they come for us.
Have you ever heard of Donald Trump (He was president of U.S.A). How about Beatles or Elvis (Presley)?
Have you ever heard of Donald Trump (He was president of U.S.A). How about Beatles or Elvis (Presley)?
This is getting stoopid : as stated above by other posters, yes I have heard of Taylor Swift/know of her reputation, but would not recognize her physically (much like I would not recognize all members of the Beatles) and could not identify what songs she sings (even if perhaps there was a tinge a familiarity) ; is this really that hard to understand???
I must in a bubble/in another culture all together, as I do not know Taylor Swift at all/would not recognize her face on a billboard/and perhaps not even recognize one of her songs... 😊 🙄
Now you're making me think of which pop culture icons I don't know much or anything about! The band that comes to mind is BTS (Korean boy band?)...My sense is that they're YUGE but I wouldn't recognize any of them and can't name one of their songs.
This is getting stoopid : as stated above by other posters, yes I have heard of Taylor Swift/know of her reputation, but would not recognize her physically (much like I would not recognize all members of the Beatles (lol) and could not identify what songs she sings (even if perhaps there was a tinge a familiarity) ; is this really that hard to understand???
I promise this will be my last post on this topic. IMHO, it would be weird if someone , not really old, from a delvoped nation didn't know who Lebron James or Mick Jagger was. (Maybe remote Northern Canada is an exception). Maybe you're really old?
I promise no more posts on this topic from me.
love the thread Bob.
2023 in Review, Looking Ahead
As a reminder that this lovely dumpster fire of a thread is at least a bit about the silly card game that unites us all, let’s start with poker. I logged 260 hours at the lolive tables—up slightly from 242 hours the previous year. As longtime readers know, these days I focus less on grinding and more on enjoyment. #reclife
From this vantage point, the year was a success: I look forward to almost every session that I play, despite the fact that my poker skillz have much to be desired. One of the blessings of lolive, of course, is that everyone else is even worse, and my incompetence was rarely punished. With the exception of the rare donkament, I stuck to cash and results were good. I’m always tempted to use forward momentum as an excuse to push myself, to grind harder, to play bigger, but no, poker is still a relatively low priority for me at the moment. That said, I do want to get more involved with the Gulf Coast community this year, and one of the best ways to do that is to plop my butt into a seat. So here’s a modest volume challenge to kick off the year.
Bob's Lolive Mini-Challenge: 250 hours by the end of May.
Punishment for failure: I’ll ship a gee to the first person who poasts a TayTay-with-dog pic itt
Bob’s Books [25/52]
I'm probably missing a few, but whatever. The standouts, for me, would be Ross’s Delight books and Nunez’s The Friend. "One day last July," Ross wrote,
[quote=]feeling delighted and compelled to both wonder about and and share that delight, I decided that it might feel nice, even useful, to write a daily essay about something delightful. I remember laughing to myself for how obvious it was. I could call it something like The Book of Delights. I came up with a handful of rules: write a delight every day for a year; begin and end on my birthday, August 1; draft them quickly; and write them by hand. The rules made it a discipline for me. A practice. Spend time thinking and writing about delight every day. Because I was writing these essayettes pretty much daily (confession: I skipped some days), patterns and themes and concerns show up. For instance, I traveled quite a bit this year. I often write in cafés. My mother is often on my mind. Racism is often on my mind. Kindness is often on my mind. Politics. Pop music. Books. Dreams. Public space. My garden is often on my mind.
It didn’t take me long to learn that the discipline or practice of writing these essays occasioned a kind of delight radar. Or maybe it was more like the development of a delight muscle. Something that implies that the more you study delight, the more delight there is to study. A month or two into this project delights were calling to me: Write about me! Write about me! Because it is rude not to acknowledge your delights, I’d tell them that though they might not become essayettes, they were still important, and I was grateful to them. Which is to say, I felt my life to be more full of delight. Not without sorrow or fear or pain or loss. But more full of delight. I also learned this year that my delight grows—much like love and joy—when I share it. [/quote]
Part of the delight of reading about delight is that you can easily turn the project inward, and start writing yourself. Or even better: you can foist delight-writing upon others, as I did with my high school students.
We spent a month sharing Ross's delights and writing our own, and I have to say that my students—Gen Zers who have been born into the era of infinite distraction—did a great job. There was a funny moment involving Delight #17: Just A Dream.
[quote=Ross]A few years ago I had a dream in which I had been ****ing my mother for about two years. Thankfully I didn’t actually live through (dream through) the ****ing part but instead just woke up (in the dream) to the fact that for the past two years (is two a significant number?) I had been ****ing my mother. Just as you would if you just realized you had been ****ing your mother for the past two years, I lost my goddamned ****. I was pacing around, hyperventilating, thinking, How could I have been ****ing my mother for the past two years?! Mind you, this wasn’t an Oedipal faux pas, which, as far as I’m concerned, is completely forgivable and understandable; he was ****ed from the start, and the blind man said so.
As I recall, in the dream, maybe my mother and I were to meet up later, or she was on her way over (a date?), when it occurred to me that something (****ing my mother for the past two years) was not okay. What have I done, what have I done, I thought. In writing this I will commend myself for not, in the dream, blaming my poor mother, my dear mother, who was also a party to the depravity.[/quote]
Needless to say, this isn't the sort of thing that teenagers usually read. There was a lot of hooting and hollering, let me tell you. Afterward, I couldn't resist snapping a photo of the excerpt above and sending it to a teacher-friend and telling her that my students' heads were stupendously blown.
(To be clear: Yes, I am corrupting the youth.)
What I'd forgotten is that, for the last year or so, my phone automatically shares photos with my mom, a wonderful, and wonderfully prudish, Boomer. Here's what she sent me later that afternoon.
The Friend is a very different book. It's also honest and wise, but slanted in a dark direction—towards sexual trauma, suicide, and hypocrisy. The narrator, an unnamed novelist living in NYC, constantly questions the purpose of writing through arguments with herself, her friends, her students, and most of all, other writers.
[quote=]Lecture notes.
All writers are monsters. Henry de Montherlant.
Writers are always selling somebody out. [Writing] is an aggressive, even a hostile act . . . the tactic of a secret bully. Joan Didion.
Every journalist . . . knows . . . what he does is morally indefensible. Janet Malcolm.
Any writer worth his salt knows that only a small proportion of literature does more than partly compensate people for the damage they have suffered
in learning to read. Rebecca West.
There seems to be no remedy for the vice of literature; those afflicted persist in the habit despite the fact that there is no longer any pleasure to be derived from it. W. G. Sebald.
***
You cannot hope to console yourself for your grief by writing, warns Natalia Ginzburg.
Turn then to Isak Dinesen, who believed that you could make any sorrow bearable by putting it into a story or telling a story about it. [/quote]
The book also contains one of the best takedowns of literary culture I've ever read. At one point the narrator has a conversation with an aspiring Buddhist who had abandoned a promising writing career. Why had she stopped? "It wasn't that I wanted to withdraw completely from the world," the woman said.
[quote=]I wasn’t about to become a Buddhist nun or anything like that. But as I say I started having doubts about becoming a writer. I didn’t see how I could reconcile a literary career with the goal of freedom from attachment. Soon after I finished the Buddhist retreat I did a residency at an artists’ colony—I was hoping to get back on track with the novel. I remember looking at the other people there, some of whom were just starting out like me and some of whom were already established, and thinking about what it took—besides talent, of course—to succeed. You had to have ambition, serious ambition, and if you wanted to do really good work you had to be driven. You had to want to surpass what others had done. You had to believe that what you were doing was incredibly serious and important. And all this seemed to me in conflict with learning to sit still. To let go.
And even though writing isn’t supposed to be a competition, I could see that most of the time writers believed that it was. While I was at the artists’ colony, one of the writers there got an advance so huge it was reported in the Times. That night at dinner he said, There go my last two friends. He was joking, of course, but I have noticed that whenever a writer hits it big a lot of effort seems to go into trying to bring that person down. Also, it seemed like money was in the front of everyone’s mind. I didn’t get that. Who on earth becomes a writer for the money? I remember my first writing class, the teacher said: If you’re going to be a writer, the first thing you have to do is take a vow of poverty. And no one in the room batted an eye.
It seemed to me that everyone I knew who was a writer—which back then meant pretty much everyone I knew—was in a state of chronic frustration. People were constantly getting worked up over who got what and who got left out and how horribly unfair the whole business was. It was very confusing. Why did it have to be like that? Why were the men all so arrogant, and why were so many of them sexual predators? Why were the women all so angry and depressed? Really, it was hard not to feel sorry for everyone.
Whenever I’d go to a reading I couldn’t help feeling embarrassed for the author. I’d ask myself did I wish that was me up there, and the honest answer was hell no. And it wasn’t just me. You could feel it in the rest of the audience, that same discomfort. And I remember thinking, This is what Baudelaire was talking about when he said that art was prostitution. Meanwhile I was still struggling with the novel. And then one day I said to myself, Say you don’t write this book. Weren’t there a zillion other people willing to bring novels into the world? Weren’t there, in fact, already too many novels? Did I honestly think mine would be missed? And could I justify doing something with my life, my one wild and precious life, that I knew, undone, would not be missed?
Around this time I happened to hear some writer talking on the radio. I can’t remember who it was, but for me it might as well have been God. I remember him saying that if in all the next year not a single work of fiction was published, instead of the staggering number of stories and novels we knew would be published, the effect on the world would be essentially the same. Not true, of course, because I suppose there’d be a significant effect on the economy. But I knew what he was saying, and I felt as if he were saying it to me. Which is when I said to myself, You must change your life.[/quote]
I suspect that most writers have had these or similar thoughts, just as most poker pros have asked themselves, during the millionth trudge to the cardroom, wtf am I doing with my life? More to the point, I've had these thoughts. During the pandemic I had to watch my writing group—filled with some of the best people you'll ever meet—die an excruciating, poisonous death. I spent some of this year, through therapy and journaling, asking myself what I really wanted out of writing. The answer, I think, is not much. This summer, after a second failed go-round with a NYC literary agent, I mostly felt relieved to be freed from the expectations of satisfying "the market" and building a brand and creating an emotional "payoff" for readers so that I, in turn, might extract a financial payoff: ten gees, fifty gees, a million gees + a movie deal, who can say? The Big Five publishing industry appears to be about money and competition, just as Nunez said.
Fortunately I don't have much skin in the game. Teaching is my jam, and with luck that's what I'll continue to do, while also finishing my poker book on terms that I'm comfortable with.
PUPDATE
In June I got the sad news that my beloved fluffball has cancer. Surgery wasn't fully successful, and the vets couldn't say how long she had. Welp, six months later, against all odds, she's thriving. A lot to be thankful for this year.
GL in 2024!
I promise this will be my last post on this topic. IMHO, it would be weird if someone , not really old, from a delvoped nation didn't know who Lebron James or Mick Jagger was. (Maybe remote Northern Canada is an exception). Maybe you're really old?
I promise no more posts on this topic from me.
I also promise this is my last post on the subject : again, I know of Taylor Swift, but we were always talking of recognizing a pic of her or any of her songs (I most likely have heard some, but could neve
+1000
Now you're making me think of which pop culture icons I don't know much or anything about! The band that comes to mind is BTS (Korean boy band?)...My sense is that they're YUGE but I wouldn't recognize any of them and can't name one of their songs.
you're not missing anything
so these labels in korea literally form academies of aspiring pop stars as teens
they could spend several years in this "prospect phase" learning to dance, improving their singing skills, getting plastic surgery, etc
at some point, if the label thinks they are ready for the big leagues, they'll come up with an act for them, assign them a role in the act and then hand them music written for the band
as a result it's all soulless and formulaic crap that all follows the same exact patterns to the point where it's genuinely quite difficult to tell the difference between any bands or songs of theres
i've literally been in korea at a poker table where some kpop song is played and people are trying to figure out which group it is and there are 5-6 competing options and nobody is really sure
but... the terrible quality of the music aside, what they excel at is manufacturing fan interest via drama, behind the scenes looks, constant media and social media interaction - these are groups with 10x more resources put into marketing and publicity than actual music so all the fans know the favorite colors and hobbies and birthdays of each member and they really grip them in with stuff like "omg did you know when they visited california they went to a starbucks and bought coffee for everyone and posted it to tiktok and now I know that my favorite singer likes mocha frappachinos the most"
Great post Ben! That (quoted) self-doubt about the purpose (or lack) of writing unfortunately - or fortunately...??? - also got the best of me a couple of years back. Thankfully I have replaced writing with activities that have become more important (for me).
Glad to see your pup is still roaming around and I am sure he will provide many more daily moments of delight ♥ ♥ ♥
I suspect that most writers have had these or similar thoughts, just as most poker pros have asked themselves, during the millionth trudge to the cardroom, wtf am I doing with my life? More to the point, I've had these thoughts. During the pandemic I had to watch my writing group—filled with some of the best people you'll ever meet—die an excruciating, poisonous death. I spent some of this year, through therapy and journaling, asking myself what I really wanted out of writing. The answer, I thi
I entirely agree with this sentiment of yours. Publishing your work via a small press will likely result in greater aesthetic integrity. The chances of making significant $ as a writer are so low that the mere idea of a major publishing deal seems silly to me (not that I've tried). Best just to wait until your books become cult classics and then allow a major publisher to buy your rights and put your books in a major bookstore, so that people who only trust major-marketed things can buy them and pretend that they've read them to impress their major-important friends.
I suspect that most writers have had these or similar thoughts, just as most poker pros have asked themselves, during the millionth trudge to the cardroom, wtf am I doing with my life? More to the point, I've had these thoughts. During the pandemic I had to watch my writing group—filled with some of the best people you'll ever meet—die an excruciating, poisonous death. I spent some of this year, through therapy and journaling, asking myself what I really wanted out of writing. The answer, I thin
I'm guessing most people who dabble in creating art kinda have to wrestle with this? For some reason, I spend a lotta time with my 8 track at home recording horrendous music that no one will ever hear. But long ago I concluded the process (struggle?) itself was meaningful (enjoyable?) enough (if only just to me) to continue doing so.
Good luck in 2024 with teaching / the poker book / delightful adventures with the fluffball!
Ggogogo!,imoG
you're not missing anything
so these labels in korea literally form academies of aspiring pop stars as teens
they could spend several years in this "prospect phase" learning to dance, improving their singing skills, getting plastic surgery, etc
at some point, if the label thinks they are ready for the big leagues, they'll come up with an act for them, assign them a role in the act and then hand them music written for the band
as a result it's all soulless and formulaic crap that all follows the same
I couldn't help myself
Underwhelming, for sure, on my first (and probably only) listen. Your overview of the Kpop scene sounds a lot like our pop country scene—or any industry where the artist's individuality is erased in favor of whatever cookie-cutter approach will sell albums. (one of TayTay's achievements was her ability to go off script from the standard Nashville drivel and continually reinvent herself. That, imo, is a chief appeal of her Eras tour: fans can experience, during a relatively short three or four hour span, a very wide range of her artistic identities. But I digress 😀)
Great post Ben! That (quoted) self-doubt about the purpose (or lack) of writing unfortunately - or fortunately...??? - also got the best of me a couple of years back. Thankfully I have replaced writing with activities that have become more important (for me).
Glad to see your pup is still roaming around and I am sure he will provide many more daily moments of delight ♥ ♥ ♥
Thanks for the good wishes Dubn! Hope your New Year's off to a good start. I'll be following along in your thread to see if you continue to shottake some live donkaments. Was fun to hear about your journey down to WSOP Paradise. Now all you need is a nice bink.
I entirely agree with this sentiment of yours. Publishing your work via a small press will likely result in greater aesthetic integrity. The chances of making significant $ as a writer are so low that the mere idea of a major publishing deal seems silly to me (not that I've tried). Best just to wait until your books become cult classics and then allow a major publisher to buy your rights and put your books in a major bookstore, so that people who only trust major-marketed things can buy them and
Thanks for popping in, Dr.! Yep, I'll be exploring the independent/small presses soon enough, I think.
Hope all is well is Aussieland.
Booked. Enjoy the anti-sweat!
I'm guessing most people who dabble in creating art kinda have to wrestle with this? For some reason, I spend a lotta time with my 8 track at home recording horrendous music that no one will ever hear. But long ago I concluded the process (struggle?) itself was meaningful (enjoyable?) enough (if only just to me) to continue doing so.
Good luck in 2024 with teaching / the poker book / delightful adventures with the fluffball!
Ggogogo!,imoG
Yeah, I think any artist-creator grapples with the challenge of where to land on the spectrum of, on the one extreme, absolute artistic purity (whatever that means) and full-blown selling out on the other. Sometimes you can see poker vloggers confront this problem, for example, and it's been interesting to see how that medium is evolving as we move into the Tiktokification of content.
On the writing front, the best recent exploration of creativity and consumerism that comes to mind is Eula Biss's Having and Being Had, which I plan to return to soon.
Then there's this Nicholson Baker quote that manages to be both inspirational and bleak (lol)
[quote=]In the end, I don’t care how famous you get, how widely read you are during your lifetime. You’re going to be forgotten. And you’re going to have five or six fans in the end. It’s going to be your grandchildren or your great-grandchildren are going to say, Oh, yeah, he was big. … So I think the key is, write what you actually care about. Because in the end, you’re only doing this for yourself. … So maybe do your best stuff for yourself and for the three, four, five people who know in the coming century that you ever existed. That’s all you need to do.[/quote]
Thanks for the good wishes, and right back atcha! Please continue flatting KK to a single raise as you put all other giraffes in the Winrates thread to shame.
January Recap
After some chillaxing in southern AZ, there was a lot of movin and shakin. I flew to Vegas and discovered my true calling as a slot pro.
From there, I flew direct to Honolooloo. Over the years I'd managed to set foot in 48/50 states, and here was a chance to reach 49.
Beach views of Diamondheard
Makapu‘u Point Lighthouse Trail
Sunset on Sunset Beach
Ka'ena Point (what animal is in this pic?)
HOMA
Views from Diamondhead
After a brief rest back in AZ,
I took a roundabout route home, driving north for a bit before heading east.
Grand Canyon
Canyon de Chelly
Riverwind Casino
No, your eyes don't deceive you: some poker was played! It's been ages since a HH found its way into this thread, so here goes. A few minutes into my session, a burly mid-forties guy with tatted-up forearms arrives and raises his first hand from UTG, I reray pocket Cowboys from the button, he calls. Flop Q♦T♠3♥, he check-calls my bet. Turn 4♥, he checks, I bet again, and he tanks for about twenty seconds before jamming in his whole stack. I didn't drive to Oklahoma to fold overpears so I snap and he shows...
which I thought was a very interesting hand for a random dude to be showing up with in the wilds of a low-steaks Oklahoma cardgame. Welcome to poker in 2024, I guess.
Munching Freedom Fries in Paris
Horseshow Bossier City AKA Gatorville
At one point a fortyish white guy sat next to me who looked like he'd walked off the set of Duck Dynasty. Raggedy flannel with a pack of Marlboros in his front pocket, long graying beard, salt and pepper hair beneath a Liberty Construction ballcap, a few teeth missing, thick Cajun accent. At one point he rose from his seat, rolled up his blue jeans, and showed the dealer a nasty ankle scar. His shin was grotesquely swollen, with stitches running from his ankle down his foot. Nine months earlier, he said, he was fishing in the swamp when a gator attacked him.
"Unprovoked?" I asked.
"Yep. I jammed my thumbs into the gator's eyes, and he let go. That's the only way I survived."
Operation Deny marknfw [41/250]
Entering Mardi Gras mode! Hope everyone's month is off to a good start.
Alaska the only one left?
How many states is your dog up to? 😀
GcluelessonehandedtypingnoobG
Sea Lion
Doggo loves fries!
41/250! Relax, you're almost there. June is a looong way off, you have plenty of time.