Tom Dwan - the missing man
How convenient is it that he just falls off the face of the earth after issuing and bailing half way through a 50k hand challenge when he goes down over a million dollars?
He come out a year or so ago and said that he has this "big" problem with FTP that he would address once he had a decent nights sleep, what ever happened here?
He agreed to pay penalties on a monthly basis for not playing an agreed amount of hands with jungle, did cates ever receive any of the penalty money? I think it's about time the community got some answers. There was a lot of money placed on the outcome of the match which never got resolved, as you can imagine anyone who took jungle's side must be pretty aggrieved.
Ike and Justin bonomo was both judges along with Ivey being escrow, from what I remember Ivey wanted nothing to do with any of the decision making after dwan went AWOL which lead to phil sending jungle his 500k back. What's the point of having judges in any bet if they can't actually enforce any rulings?
If anyone else had bailed on a bet of this size when he should have escrowed the 1.5million it would be a much bigger deal.
To add to that he's listed to play in the 500k super high roller at the aria
Yeah but nobody would have bothered looking into it in the first place if Ferguson, Lederer, and the rest of them didn't scam people out of millions of dollars. That just gave the feds a reason. If they weren't stupid greedy scumbags who knows where online poker would be today.
This is just wrong. Daniel Tzvetkoff was arrested and alerted the government to the "money laundering" the big sites were doing through a Utah bank, of which the sites had an ownership stake, so that he could avoid a massive prison sentence.
Yeah but nobody would have bothered looking into it in the first place if Ferguson, Lederer, and the rest of them didn't scam people out of millions of dollars. That just gave the feds a reason. If they weren't stupid greedy scumbags who knows where online poker would be today.
Are you sure you know what you are talking about?
If I remember correctly, there was no inklings about Ferguson, Lederer and crew being scammers at all before Black Friday when things got shut down. If anything they were well respected and admired for hitting it big in business after starting out as pro-gamblers. The UIGEA which made things "illegal" was passed years before Black Friday, it just wasn't being enforced. Sites weren't sure exactly what types of gambling were totally illegal, sort of illegal, legal, etc. So most sites kept doing business as normal after UIGEA until forced out, including Poker Stars and Full Tilt.
Ironically, they were getting scammed by players much more then they scammed players. As certain players found a flaw where they could keep depositing money and Full Tilt never actually received the money. When players found that flaw, they abused it.
Then after Black Friday came and surprised everyone, **** hit the fan, and Full Tilt got caught with their pants down. Instead pf having player deposits segregated in escrow like they should have it turns out they were just disbursing money to themselves as if it were their piggy bank. This is what made them "scammers." Some would argue their intent wasn't to scam, which is plausible to an extent. This is different then a ponzi scheme in that Full Tilt was super profitable and they very well may have been just them being irresponsible with player funds knowing profits will easily cover tall those disbursements over the years.
Then Black Friday hits and they don't have the money to pay back players. Biggest reason players were pissed is because they sure weren't volunteering to refund all those disbursements they had received of millions or dollars over the years. But in reality that never happens in any type of business unless forced by law. Sort of like when banks go insolvent or need to be bailed out the bank officers still make tons of money, let alone returning any.
That's how I remember it, let me know if I'm wrong on anything.
Are you sure you know what you are talking about?
If I remember correctly, there was no inklings about Ferguson, Lederer and crew being scammers at all before Black Friday when things got shut down. If anything they were well respected and admired for hitting it big in business after starting out as pro-gamblers. The UIGEA which made things "illegal" was passed years before Black Friday, it just wasn't being enforced. Sites weren't sure exactly what types of gambling were totally illegal, sort
You are wrong. They were pilfering player funds long before Black Friday. One could argue they thought they would never have to cover all the player funds and black Friday exposed their thieving, but the issue is they took money they had no right to take.
You are wrong. They were pilfering player funds long before Black Friday. One could argue they thought they would never have to cover all the player funds and black Friday exposed their thieving, but the issue is they took money they had no right to take.
Thats... what he said.
But the pilfering isn't why black friday happened. It happened because they were "money laundering" and committing "fraud" (extremely loose use of those terms on both accounts).
Instead pf having player deposits segregated in escrow like they should have it turns out they were just disbursing money to themselves as if it were their piggy bank. This is what made them "scammers."... biggest reason players were pissed is because they sure weren't volunteering to refund all those disbursements they had received of millions or dollars over the years.
You're saying this knowing they were accepting player funds and holding them personally, of which at anytime could have been seized. Then when everyone's money finally does get seized, none of it gets returned, and all that they have to do is pay a small fee (which in Lederer's case was only 2.5 of $45 million) to get out of it. Ferguson's case was dismissed completely in 2013.
Did they return the money? Anyone here jumping up and down for Black Friday reimbursements?
So yeah, not only was it irresponsible, it was downright fraudulent. People in the poker community trusted that their money was secure when in reality it wasn't. That goes beyond just failing to be transparent. I don't think there's really any debate to be had about that, because whether their intentions were pure to start out with at one point means nothing. And if that isn't what sparked Black Friday, you can go ahead and share whatever you think did
Are you sure you know what you are talking about?
If I remember correctly, there was no inklings about Ferguson, Lederer and crew being scammers at all before Black Friday when things got shut down. If anything they were well respected and admired for hitting it big in business after starting out as pro-gamblers. The UIGEA which made things "illegal" was passed years before Black Friday, it just wasn't being enforced. Sites weren't sure exactly what types of gambling were totally illegal, sort
Ivy walked away with over 17 million of player funds and refused to give it back, thats why he was a no show at the WSOP, HE WOULD HAVE GOTTEN HIS ASS KICKED
lol no he wouldn't have.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubKfNBPI...
Here is the hand.
If you look at his body language at 8:40, he is CLEARLY not thinking about raising.
10:30 thinking out loud "He said he liked his hand", you think he is doing this if he is thinking about raising? If not, what is he thinking about if not folding?
11:10-11:30 Is someone who is about to raise making those faces? We are now talking about a professional player not some amateur who is on a Hollywood act of a lifetime.
Somebody needs to make a s
I got doug polked
The fish on my right flashed JTs in my peripheral view
I fold my trash and say "i saw your hand btw"
Cutoff says "were his cards good?"
I go into freeze-do-not-move-mode
There's like $15 in the middle at a 2-1-2... we are talking big time here people
I felt like doug polk though lmao
Cutoff and UTG+1 go heads up to the flop like $25-28 pot
I am sweating bullets as the cutoff turns into tow dwan and i am now doug polk
what a weird feeling lol
cutoff won i dont rememebr how because i was so busy trying not to flinch or move lmao
You're saying this knowing they were accepting player funds and holding them personally, of which at anytime could have been seized. Then when everyone's money finally does get seized, none of it gets returned, and all that they have to do is pay a small fee (which in Lederer's case was only 2.5 of $45 million) to get out of it. Ferguson's case was dismissed completely in 2013.
Did they return the money? Anyone here jumping up and down for Black Friday reimbursements?
So yeah, not only was it irre
Different people are going to see it different ways I guess.
-In some instances the guilty party knows they are scamming people and people are going to get hurt. The whole business could have been a planned scam from the start
-some start with honest intentions and become scams, Madoff for example, start with good intentions, fail, start taking risks, start doing things they shouldn't be, somewhere along the way the cross the line and know they are scamming out of desperation
-In other cases the guilty to party had no intention or scamming ever, whether it was borrowing without permission, or early disbursements. Then some kind of act of god, or other unsuspected situation cause them to fail
Maybe some people don't see any distinction between those three situations, but I do.
Is dwan still married?
I mentioned this months ago, remembering the time where him and the fiance would post stuff on social media about them going to the zoo, swimming with dolphins etc.
Like they were pretty open about it, but now there's never a mention or any updates.
I feel like the answer is no
dwan wasnt up all night romancing her...
Pretty sure I heard Tom or someone in an interview refer to her as his ex-wife.
He tells the story of how the debt came about below.
Pretty sure I heard Tom or someone in an interview refer to her as his ex-wife.
He tells the story of how the debt came about below.
So all these guys were using Tom Dwan to get them into circles and spaces they could only dreamed about and made them millions of dollars gambling. But when he started to lose for them, they want side money markers to be paid? Sounds like grabbing with both hands. I'd like to hear Durrrr's side of these accounts. I'm sure there is more to it. If you borrow large sums of money to compulsive gamblers who runs big bluffs with nothing on paper to be walked into a court to sue for you are a moron.
So all these guys were using Tom Dwan to get them into circles and spaces they could only dreamed about and made them millions of dollars gambling. But when he started to lose for them, they want side money markers to be paid? Sounds like grabbing with both hands. I'd like to hear Durrrr's side of these accounts. I'm sure there is more to it. If you borrow large sums of money to compulsive gamblers who runs big bluffs with nothing on paper to be walked into a court to sue for you are a moron.
What are you talking about? Haralabos is known as a winning sports better so it impossible for him to get action. He uses other people who are seen as losing to get large bets on for him. He givs Dwan some insane 20% freeroll to place these bets. (What kind of edge does this guy have to give that kind of freeroll). Instead of being happy taking the free monies Dwan is off degening it up on his own bets with the same account which are losing and then he can't cover the winnings he owes Haralabos.
Or if you click on the Twitter post you will see bobs 6 tweets that explain it. Although it's nothing that is really new, news.
You see? clickbait
I feel bad for Dwan as the boy icon has been replaced by a ghost who appears to have seen horrors beyond common comprehension.
Many in this world have incurred debts they cannot repay but no one should be bound by violence to their debts. Creditors who have made bad loans should recognize their errors in judgement and accept that some in this world have no ability to repay and indeed, are likely to struggle simply to survive once their ability to finance their expenditures through credit evaporates. The best course forward is for such debts to be forgiven in the sense that repayment is no longer expected, and that those who have been dependent upon credit should learn to provide for themselves and live within their means, so that they may someday be of benefit not only to themselves but society.
Godspeed.
I feel bad for Dwan as the boy icon has been replaced by a ghost who appears to have seen horrors beyond common comprehension.
Many in this world have incurred debts they cannot repay but no one should be bound by violence to their debts. Creditors who have made bad loans should recognize their errors in judgement and accept that some in this world have no ability to repay and indeed, are likely to struggle simply to survive once their ability to finance their expenditures through credit evaporat
was this chatgpt? Sounds like a computer answer, which as one can no doubt imagine, based upon current research, is neither easy nor suitable for many.
I feel bad for Dwan as the boy icon has been replaced by a ghost who appears to have seen horrors beyond common comprehension.
Many in this world have incurred debts they cannot repay but no one should be bound by violence to their debts. Creditors who have made bad loans should recognize their errors in judgement and accept that some in this world have no ability to repay and indeed, are likely to struggle simply to survive once their ability to finance their expenditures through credit evaporat
Terrible take. Regardless of who you are, if it is your debt, PAY IT. Stop with the excuses and pay the damn debt, even if you have to do it small increments over a longer time. You know who pays it if they don't, the rest of us in one way or another. All it does it drive up the cost of business and we incur higher costs and expenses as a result.
was this chatgpt? Sounds like a computer answer, which as one can no doubt imagine, based upon current research, is neither easy nor suitable for many.
I don't see why it's not suitable. People should just keep in mind that artificial intelligence, like real humans, is imperfect and thus, we should not accept its output as unquestionable truth, but as a series of claims and rationalizations that should be respectively subject to verification and questioning like those that emanate from a human.
Perhaps you're suggesting some people don't verify or question the claims of authorities they trust. I agree but that is a problem with their approach to communication, not a problem with artificial intelligence.
