Gross Spot with AA
This post is the next part of my previous post about a rough session I had at a home game and part of my recent downswing.
Hero is ~$320 eff and should be viewed as tight, tilted, nitty. Villain is down a decent bit (Hero is down piles) but is a thinking player, although he is tilted.
Game is 1/1/2 and its at the very end of the night (game ends in one orbit)
Preflop:
Hero in the blinds. Villain opens to $10 UTG, LAG calls in LP, Hero, 3bets to $35 (too small I know).
Flop: Jd8s8h (Pot: ~$105)
Hero continues for $40, Villain raises to $110. LAG folds. Hero calls.
Turn: Js (Pot: ~$325)
Hero checks, Villain Checks
River: Ts (Pot: ~$325)
Hero checks, Villain shoves (covers).
What can I have done differently????
23 Replies
It would be nice to know your exact hand.
But it’s well played.
River is not a mandatory fold. You’re beating QTs and T9s that he’s turning into a bluff (or small pocket pairs that are undeniably bluffing—playing the board).
What can I have done differently????
Stand up from the table
X-call flop
As played fold
it's 175 into 325, and he's probably not turning his hand into a bluff after raising the flop. He probably has more 8's here than jacks but just because you lost a hand (potentially) doesn't always mean you "played it wrong". If he's a known nit then we can fold the flop.
3 bet bigger pf. Fold flop. Definitely fold river.
raise bigger pre. check flop.
as played fold river, not close.
Start w a check on flop. This is a good hand to put into check call bluff catch range oop here.
As played fold river.
I’m calling with the Ace of spades and folding the others. This can’t be a pure fold.
Hand is fine except for the too-small-3-bet preflop.
There's 3 spades on the board by the river, so in theory V can be shoving nut (but probably all) spades that beat our overpair ... and for half pot on river that might be true but most people aren't raising AsTs/As9s on the flop. Even QsTs would not be normal for most people/games at 1-2 home game.
Would personally be happier calling with Ac if I had to call some AA, because that blocks Ac8c and AcJc then after that blocking Ad8d seems better than blocking AhJh ... so maybe AcAh only?
Pre is way too small. Just shove the flop. As played, I'm probably calling.
Villain isn't opening many 8x from UTG 5x so if I bet this flop and got raised i'm likely just going with it and getting the money in OOP.
3b it way too small pre but you already said that but if he calls a normal sized 3b with 8x it's just kind of a cooler.
I don't mind a flop check on this one
As played I can't imagine too many bluffs from villain but if he is capable it's a call, if not it's a fold.
That's not a gross spot. That's a fold. Everything got there. If he's bluffing you there, good on him. Post flop you played fine except you might have considered folding when he re-raised you.
Tough spot. Think its well played. Preflop 35-40 not big difference. Appears to be a lot of in play dynamics going on also, makes the decision sway one way or the other.
I would probably bet bigger OTF to setup shove OTT with your stack sizes. AP: River is probably a sigh fold.
This may be terrible advice, but here goes...
I've noticed that when I'm having a bad session, I'm stuck, and I'm tilted, opponents smell it like sharks smell blood in the water. Not only will they go out of their way to get involved in pots with us, but they also seem to know when we're getting sticky with strong starting hands that didn't hit the flop.
In this hand, with a UTG open and a LAG call in LP, I might just jam pre. My reasoning is:
1. UTG's open range should be pretty strong. If we're tilted, we could be jamming light, and he could look us up.
2. We don't want to raise to any amount that either V will call, and force us to play OOP. We especially don't want to 3B, have UTG decide his hand is good enough to call but not good enough to 4B, and his call gives LAG in LP good odds to continue.
3. Winning a small pot pre-flop with AA when we're tilted, stuck, and OOP is going to do more for our mental equilibrium than torching our stack post-flop. Even if we get called and somehow lose, at least we got our money in good, and we can just pack it up and go home, knowing we didn't let tilt lead us to play poorly.
Case in point, this hand - if I was tilted and got raised on this flop, it could send me over the edge. I don't know that I'd be able to fold flop, or turn, or river. I'd level myself into calling, because V has KK or QQ, not JX or 8X.
I mean, maybe he does have KK or QQ. If we rage fold and he shows it, that's even more tilting. If he shows us JT, tilting. If he shows Q9, I'd go lay down in traffic.
ETA - as played, I don't think we can call the flop raise and fold on a later street, so our flop decision should just be raise or fold, I think. I can't see folding AA if we think he has QQ, TT, 99, or AJ in his range, so I think I'm just going to jam and prepare myself to see JJ or 8X.
Shoving this flop after getting raised is easily the worst decision possible. V will only call with trips, and will fold all his bluffs. Wtf.
What bluffs does V have here, that don't have good equity on the flop? T9 has around 30% equity, more if it's T9s with a BDFD, and a little more than that if hero's AA isn't that same suit.
The pot is $255. Hero has $245 left in his stack. We're at 1 SPR with an over-pair. Pretty sure we should stick it in here. If V out-flopped us, nice hand, good game.
Flat calling flop and then folding turn or river after putting in $145 of our $320 starting stack would be a disaster, especially if V would have folded to a flop 3B jam.
Your 320 eff, chonk flop, gii
Shoving this flop after getting raised is easily the worst decision possible. V will only call with trips, and will fold all his bluffs. Wtf.
he won't fold QQ+ or Jx after taking this line - look at the preflop action - how do we not have the best hand here on this flop? He likely has a hand with some equity and we deny it being OOP.
Villain put in half his stack - so we gotta make a decision here.
It's shove flop or fold flop for me (and I'm not folding). Too many cards we don't want to see on the turn, and we won't even have a pot-size stack left on turn if we just call flop -- we have $175 left with a $325 pot. LOL.
Ok I’m convinced I’m wrong, shoving the flop is fine.
This may be terrible advice, but here goes...
I've noticed that when I'm having a bad session, I'm stuck, and I'm tilted, opponents smell it like sharks smell blood in the water. Not only will they go out of their way to get involved in pots with us, but they also seem to know when we're getting sticky with strong starting hands that didn't hit the flop.
In this hand, with a UTG open and a LAG call in LP, I might just jam pre. My reasoning is:
1. UTG's open range should be pretty strong. If we're t
I agree with every part of this post and have the exact same experience with this phenomenon. It's important to kick your mind back onto the right track and change your "energy" which is probably just subconscious cues you're giving off. (or get up)
I can see villain having more Jx, QQ/KK than 8x given the description and action. Since they're a little tilted I would just cram the flop and see if they want to hero call. Even if they fold that will add to the tilt but with you just calling I think they look to check down unimproved with the hands you are targeting for value.
Did you muck in the end?
Looking at all the earlier comments, no one suggested you to block bet the river, which is what I may do, because if I put myself into the V's shoes, I would jam with anything given your line, literally anything. And if I were in your shoes, if I made the decision to muck, and v tabled a worse hand, I would be so tilted to not being able to continue playing for the day. That's why I would block the river.
However I doubt that 'jamming anything' from the V gets much fold equity from AA, so I am curious whether you mucked in the end.
