LeBron > Jordan GOAT Super AIDS Containment, solved #22999 post by Matt R. (addendum #23174)

FACTS!

"Bron-ball" means that Lebron makes all the plays, so the team needs more than 7 minutes to develop chemistry when he's out..

This is why ball-dominant teams always collapse over short time periods when the ball-dominator is out, while the teams of expert jumpshooters have great chemistry and effective basketball that prevents collapse when the jumpshooter is out.

It's amazing that this team chooses to avoid a brand that has good chemistry in favor of a brand that revolves around 1 player and therefore lacks the chemistry to prevent short-term collapse without him.

Lebron has caused the US to play a bad brand of ball that is barely winning with massive talent advantage, while averaging 5 turnovers, so his numbers mean nothing.. Anyone can dominate the ball to get layups and high efficiency at the expense of chemistry, effective basketball, and guaranteed winning.

When you consider defense, turnovers and the fact that MJ's numbers came with great chemistry and winning basketball, his numbers are far superior than Lebron's.

Of course none of this matters because the 92' run was 40-50 point blowouts in every game, so no one's stats mattered or reflected anything about their game.. It's absurd and desperate to think otherwise.. Nonetheless, Jordan was still the best player on the 92' team by virtue of being the only scorer-playmaker on the team, while being the best defender (4.0 SPG and the intensity leader).

Then why are you so upset about it?

.
This kind of "life-or-death" effort was needed to beat Serbia:

yet they can handle the 92' Dream Team?.. It's absurd

we have ten of the top 20 players in the world, yet we're getting dominated and routinely down 17 points to teams with 1 top 20 player.. this obvious underachievement of on-paper talent confirms that we play a weaker brand of ball - less effective 5-man basketball and weaker chemistry than prior eras, therefore underachieving favored talent.

because the coverage is unwatchable.

for example, losing to teams that don't have indoor basketball somehow means we would beat the Dream Team.

or barely beating Serbia with a massive talent advantage means Lebron is better than Jordan.

it's dumb coverage and completely unwatchable.

It's amazing that this team chooses to avoid a brand that has good chemistry and will achieve the team's ceiling, in favor of a brand that revolves around 1 player and drastically underachieves our talent... And the excuse is "b-b-but better comp" except the comp isn't THAT much better - the USA was destroyed in 2019 or 2023 with big talent advantages, and now we're nearly getting beat as well.. We're simply getting worse at 5-man basketball (and continuing to get worse), so our favored talent underachieves.

Magic was runner-up for MVP in 1991, so when was the last time Lebron, KD or Curry was runner-up for MVP?

Furthermore, women and high school teams spam threes, so why wouldn't the original Dream Team, especially since they were already shooting 17 per game at 40%??.. Why couldn't they easily increase that when women and high school teams do?..

Spamming threes is the easiest way to play and anyone can do it, which is why teams like Nigeria and South Sudan beat us or nearly beat us - it's because ANYONE can spam threes, let alone the original Dream Team.

I don't think anyone is saying 40 year old LeBron is better than 1992 MJ.

Also apparently the USA lost a game.

By the way, your comment about Magic being runner up to MVP isn't really helping your argument. It shows how much better the rest of the world is now.

Fun fact - Minimum 5 teams from these Olympics beat the 92 Croatia team in a 7 game series.

So what ?
dream team would still win easily vs all of them .
Ok maybe not 30-40 pts differential but still easily shrug .
Ho and that is with 1 guy that didn’t even played 1 game in the nba in 1992 yet ….
They could have put shaq but they went laettner , amazing …
Imagine shaq instead lol.

40 year old LeBron is literally performing better in the olympics than 1992 Jordan did.

That's a fact.

Tatum/Jordan (as per fallguy) ball = 0 minutes in semi final game.

fallguy, why isn't Kerr giving any playing time to Tatum? I thought you said Tatum ball is mostly Jordan ball. If Tatum played anywhere like Jordan does, maybe he would get a few minutes of playing time?

Remember when the 92 dream team got beaten by some college kids. Good times.

Ah yes .
A practice game means so much …

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1992_Uni....

But remember when MJ 1984 Olympic team crush 8 times stars of nba to prepare for the Olympics ?
Official televised games ?
Ah yes practice games is so much more important …

No idea what you try to imply with those takes u throw at me ….
Just say it shrug .
2024 is the best team ever assemble is that it ?

LOL 3. Bird

Thread still delivers

many here downgrade MJ because he dominated a 1990 "weak" era".
No idea why couldnt bird be elevated by playing in the deadly 80s....

personally i would have bird higher then magic but magic won more.
So to me its a tie 1a-1b.
where u rank magic ?

I don't know. Magic is in my top-5. After MJ and LeBron, the big centers and Magic are in a cluster for me. #5 seems right after Kareem and Wilt, maybe?

Last time I checked South Sudan was a warm up game.

We up in here talkin bout practice

u know im not the one that brought closed out practice where the coach deliberately trashed the game trying to show it meant anything.
i dont even understand what is this whole discussion purpose for what you are trying to say.

me its very clear and simple.
the dream team would of crush any team in these olympics and would beat the 2024 too without a doubt.
And no that 2024 isnt the second best ever, 2008-2012 certainly .
And if it takes a 39-40 years old guy to dominate the US team well it shows how poorly they play or how actually they arent that great.
1992 had all the best players in the world and like u said this year they dont even have the top 4 players in the world.
how can u claim that 2024 team is that great while other usa team had the best players in the world , even with some of the best players that play on this year team but in their prime in others ???

Kerr is a busy man... He doesn't have time to figure things out.. He isn't a philosopher.. Most people aren't... So Kerr does what most people do - he watches TV and is influenced by what he sees... And the media only covers Lebron, so he's been influenced by that and therefore allows the team to run "bron-ball" instead of the ball-movement and winning style of 'tatum-ball"..

This leaves Tatum out in the cold - he's obviously the biggest casualty of bron-ball, but not the only casualty - every star on this team has been inconsistent and a shell of their normal self - this is standard bron-ball that we've seen for 21 years... Accordingly, Kerr's decision to run this inferior brand of ball is why we've drastically underachieved our favored talent by barely beating teams that we outmatch at historic levels.

To illustrate the point, imagine that an alien came to earth from outer space and decided to follow the NBA... The alien would watch the media coverage and conclude that Lebron must've won the last 5 titles.. So he would be shocked to find out that Lebron has catastrophic loss for 7 or the last 8 years... This includes missing the play-in, or multiple 1st Round exits, or multiple lottery seasons, or multiple record losses, and also historic sweeps where he tricked off 4 straight fourth quarter leads.. The alien would be completely stunned and quickly realize that it's fraud.. Lebron is a fraud - that's conclusion that the alien would come to.

Peak single season: #3 Bird or #2 Kobe?

What's Kobe's peak season?

Bird's is probably 84', while Kobe's is more debateable... I guess it's 09' if we're requiring the player to win a title.. I hate going with one over the other - they both have cases and I could go either way.. Gun to my head - 84' Bird... It was just tougher back then on many levels and Kobe had a pretty good blueprint by 09'