2024 ELECTION THREAD
The next presidential race will be here soon! Please see current Bovada odds. Thoughts?
Because the claim gender is a social construct is just obviously wrong. There might be a small socially constructed aspect to them, but sex roles and expression of characteristics are largely genetic and hormonal, just like in the animal kingdom.
Do all males act the same everywhere?
Are Japanese males more like American males or Japanese females?
Because the claim gender is a social construct is just obviously wrong. There might be a small socially constructed aspect to them, but sex roles and expression of characteristics are largely genetic and hormonal, just like in the animal kingdom.
Basically everything is socially influenced. That’s a much different claim than socially constructed.
Meanwhile I have several other horror stories I could relate regarding (relatively) dumb doctors treating me, my family and some friends. And I do think that Mayo or Hopkins etc trained doctors are usually pretty close to my definition of smart. On the other hand, a Harvard trained doctor/poker player I know had no qualms about saying that 90% of doctors are only about as good as the better registered nurses. How many doctors know, most details of how the drugs they are prescribing actually work? Some do. Shouldn't they all?
What about my ukemaster question? If he disagreed with an urgent care doc in the box about what should be done about your child's trans issues who is more likely to be right?
lol people should take this discussion to the philosophy forum. At this point we are way past the scope of what Kamala Harris supported in the past and now we’re just talking about epistemology in general.
Yes everyone who has been to a GP knows that most of the time their doctor didn't really cure or understand what was wrong with them and they walk away disappointed.
So they visit a hundred different doctors.
That's probably why you have the big waiting lists.
Again if sleep, meat and veg doesn't nurse you back to health you are mostly in trouble.
A lot of medicine is about money/kicking the can along/fobbing you off to somebody else.
lol people should take this discussion to the philosophy forum. At this point we are way past the scope of what Kamala Harris supported in the past and now we’re just talking about epistemology in general.
You just don't want to join in for fear of being called out on your fAlLaCiOuS aRgUmEnTs.
This is only because the internet gives access to "research" your problem. Pre-infotech era, doctors qualified by memorising vast amounts of stuff in books for a couple of years and then being shown how to apply that stuff for a few years. Plumbers did apprenticeships with knowledgeable tradesmen.
To learn about "your condition" you might read a couple of papers online and then that leads to other stuff, but you aren't reading all the medical books and generally you are at risk of falling into m
I think you've missed the point. We're not goign to do our abdomen examaination anymore than we're doing our own bloodwork, prostate exams etc etc. We can however quickly become very well informed about the diagnoses. Yes the internet makes it a lot easier.
Becoming very well informed about your specifics is also being actively encouraged in the uk at least where results of tests come with details on how these have changed, ranges, what it means etc etc.
It's nothing like qanon
Yes everyone who has been to a GP knows that most of the time their doctor didn't really cure or understand what was wrong with them and they walk away disappointed.
So they visit a hundred different doctors.
That's probably why you have the big waiting lists.
Again if sleep, meat and veg doesn't nurse you back to health you are mostly in trouble.
A lot of medicine is about money/kicking the can along/fobbing you off to somebody else.
I have a 6 month old puppy and she's at the animal hospital because she hasn't eaten in 24 hours and isn't drinking. I had taken her to doggy day care on Thursday so I could play a poker tournament. Not sure what I'm supposed to do other than spend $1000+ dollars while they x-ray her and do other tests.
I didn't rely on it. I said that he repeated it to me. A statistic that I read elsewhere a few times.
You certainly considered his statement enough to mention it to us. I guess that you are the only person who knows whether you relied on what he said, what you read, your own intuition, or some combination of all three.
Meanwhile the statistic is wrong only because misdiagnosis doesn't cause death (and usually doesn't result in malpractice suits). The Mayo clinic statistic hasn't been refuted.
This is far from the only problem with the statistic, which you surely know if you read the article that Gorgonian cited. And even if what you wrote above were correct, which it is not, it would would be a ridiculous half-defense of the statistic. The error you mention is an enormous flaw in a statistic that purports to estimate the number of preventable deaths that are caused by medical error. Any attempt to defend your citation of this statistic is doomed to look ridiculous. You made a mistake. You cited a bad statistic. It happens. I'm sure I have done the same.
As far as whether most doctors are "smart", I was obviously defining that word to mean something like National Merit Scholars. (top 2%).
How many professions do you imagine are mostly comprised of National Merit Scholars? Certainly not professional gambler, lawyer, Wall Street guy, tech, or academia.
If you you want to define "smart" relatively narrowly, and then argue that the average member of virtually every profession is "not smart," I'd probably agree with you, but that's a meaningless exercise.
Yes everyone who has been to a GP knows that most of the time their doctor didn't really cure or understand what was wrong with them and they walk away disappointed.
So they visit a hundred different doctors.
That's probably why you have the big waiting lists.
Again if sleep, meat and veg doesn't nurse you back to health you are mostly in trouble.
A lot of medicine is about money/kicking the can along/fobbing you off to somebody else.
Well I guess that’s the joy of Americans healthcare being the greatest system because it’s based on capitalism ….
I didn’t had any issue of that here in Canada shrug .
Certainly not at the rate you suggest .
So I wonder what better .
Have to wait a bit more to see a doctor but at least you got the right treatment or you can see any doctor you want quickly but good luck on receiving proper care .
How many doctors know, most details of how the drugs they are prescribing actually work? Some do. Shouldn't they all?
Definitely not. That would set medicine back hundreds of years. There’s debate on how Tylenol actually works. Medicine is not a theoretical field because humans are not smart enough to do it in that manner. We’re barely smart enough to do physics that way.
You might want to look in to that whole "why it's wrong" thing a bit more. I even provided a link explaining explicitly all the problems with data extrapolation that led to that horrifically flawed interpretation. You obviously didn't read it. You should.
I completely believe you as far as the original study being flawed. I just wonder if some errors aren't counted that should be. Are they counting misdiagnosis that lead to a delay in the best treatment. Are they counting advice to certain heart patients not to exercise when such advice shortens life?
I had an echocardiogram that resulted in the cardiologist saying that I had a severe case of pulmonary valve stenosis. He did not take into account that I could run ten miles in 90 minutes. Or that such a diagnosis in older people was virtually unheard of. He turned out to be COMPLETELY WRONG.
Two years ago I went to an emergency room with shortness of breath symptoms. The doctors there said I had typical HEART FAILURE and prescribed a basket of expensive pills. Three hours later a different doctor came into the room and announced I had COVID. The original doctors did not alter their original assessment and they of course turned out to be wrong.
Will you at least admit that most Las Vegas docs are morons?
I completely believe you as far as the original study being flawed. I just wonder if some errors aren't counted that should be. Are they counting misdiagnosis that lead to a delay in the best treatment. Are they counting advice to certain heart patients not to exercise when such advice shortens life?
I had an echocardiogram that resulted in the cardiologist saying that I had a severe case of pulmonary valve stenosis. He did not take into account that I could run ten miles in 90 minutes. Or that s
Or criminals ?
Unqualified fraud ?
Gambling addict needing cash using is profession ?
Etc.
Well I guess that’s the joy of Americans healthcare being the greatest system because it’s based on capitalism ….
I didn’t had any issue of that here in Canada shrug .
Certainly not at the rate you suggest .
So I wonder what better .
Have to wait a bit more to see a doctor but at least you got the right treatment or you can see any doctor you want quickly but good luck on receiving proper care .
Health Care sucks in Canada . People are dying in Emergency rooms as they can't see a doctor. Good luck getting a family doctor as well your on 5-7 year waiting lists. Many provinces like BC are shipping patients to the USA to get cancer care
You are a rarity in Canada
Pay attention chaps, Sklansky is putting on a masterclass on how to reason without committing logical fallacies here. "I had 2 bad experiences with doctors, ergo all doctors are morons. Ok, maybe not every single one, but all the ones in Vegas at the very least."
Definitely not. That would set medicine back hundreds of years. There’s debate on how Tylenol actually works. Medicine is not a theoretical field because humans are not smart enough to do it in that manner. We’re barely smart enough to do physics that way.
I am talking about the drugs that the chemists do know how they work. Or the better doctors. Im fully aware that many drugs are tried randomly, (But of those many doctors don't realize that the 95% confidence threshold isn't good enough)
Meanwhile do you agree that after studying your plumber's recommendations, your physics background would make you the favorite if you disagreed with his fix?
Health Care sucks in Canada . People are dying in Emergency rooms as they can't see a doctor. Good luck getting a family doctor as well your on 5-7 year waiting lists. Many provinces like BC are shipping patients to the USA to get cancer care
You are a rarity in Canada
I’m sorry that is the reality where you live .
It’s not that bad here shrug .
But hey u complain too many people Works for the government…. Then u complain not enough accessibility?
U have to chose which one u care more right ?
so you got more cash in your pockets for lack of services , u should be happy !
Just go in us with that extra cash and see how it goes for healthcare ?
Meanwhile do you agree that after studying your plumber's recommendations, your physics background would make you the favorite if you disagreed with his fix?
I don’t think it’s physics. It’s just residential plumbing is basic. I know how my house is plumbed, any problem with my house I could fix with the proper equipment. I’m only calling a plumber because I don’t want to do it myself or buy specialized equipment. If i owned a 50 story commercial building I’d be much more inclined to hire a good commercial plumbing company and just expect them to fix it rather than looking at schematics etc.
A car is a better example probably because plumbing for a typical 2 story house is just too simple. It I wouldn’t ask a mechanic to do anything I couldn’t do myself either on my car. One of my biggest complaints about electric cars now. It’s much harder to fix even basic problems.
The big secret is that everyone is a moron that's just winging it.
The art of selling a counterfit gold watch is to keep the customer looking at the price tag.
lol true, to be fair I think after I called him out on it he did seem to take a lot of the well-poisoning out of his posts so I give him props for that.
I just think that for the most part, Republicans don’t actually distrust doctors. They just distrust doctors that don’t agree with them. Ironically, they’re the ones that are more likely to do the genetic fallacy/appeal to authority in a fallacious way. Look at that rando guy who did some research back in the 90s Robert Malone. They were saying “well this guy says RNA vaccines are bad, and he invented them. Therefore RNA vaccines are bad.” That’s a fallacious appeal to authority.
