Israel/Palestine thread
Think this merits its own thread...
Discuss my fellow 2+2ers..
AM YISRAEL CHAI.
[QUOTE=Crossnerd]Edit: RULES FOR THIS THREAD
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30593 Replies
I feel like violent football hooligans marching through a foreign city's streets are not the best historical analogy for those who assisted defenseless people during WW2
why can you call anti Gaza chants islamophobic , if anti Israeli events aren't automatically antisemites?
maybe they had nothing against Muslims, maybe they just hated Gaza
Because the chants aren't only anti Gaza, as you know because we have this translation of the chants:
so some form of violence is acceptable, and other is not, and you have the diagram to show us.
I believe in another logic- Don't attack me with any form of physical violence, and you wont get shot.
No. Having lost the war they have lost the land. That is not ethnic cleansing. That is the standard consequences of starting and losing a war. When Arab countries originally attacked Israel after its creation do you think they were intending on letting the Israeli's keep their land? No. They were intending on keeping it. Why should this be any different?
As an aside, when all the surrounding Arab countries expelled their entire Jewish populations THAT was ethnic cleansing. I don't hear too much c
You don’t hear too much from me about that because I’ve literally never been asked that in this thread. Yes, obviously that is also ethnic cleansing.
Your criteria for not being ethnic cleansing of civilians is who started the war? I’ve not heard that. You might consider it justified ethnic cleansing but it’s still ethnic cleansing.
I understood the first time. Really just wanted you to repost that for posterity.
Rationalizing violence because of chants... (as if that was the motive) ... you are clearly deranged.
He is not deranged. It is just zero sum lizard brain tribalism. There is no first principles at work. Any view and action his perceived "tribe" takes is viewed in a positive light, and vice versa.
For good or bad, this is how the vast majority of human societies operate. Western liberalism is a very unique experiment to rise above such base impulses. And in 2024 most of the world, including many western leftists, reject liberalism and first principles.
On a more positive note
Gaza scholar
Wonder how this thread will tear him apart
You don’t hear too much from me about that because I’ve literally never been asked that in this thread. Yes, obviously that is also ethnic cleansing.
Your criteria for not being ethnic cleansing of civilians is who started the war? I’ve not heard that. You might consider it justified ethnic cleansing but it’s still ethnic cleansing.
Do you think the areas of Prussia that were intentionally "ethnically cleansed" of ethnic Germans following their defeat in two world wars of the early 20th century should be given back?
Meanwhile,
. I'm sure this is just because of a few football hooligans and not representative of Israel.
so some form of violence is acceptable, and other is not, and you have the diagram to show us.
I believe in another logic- Don't attack me with any form of physical violence, and you wont get shot.
LOOOL
Fortunately European gun laws were in place, so your violent gun toting fantasies are irrelevant.
He is not deranged. It is just zero sum lizard brain tribalism. There is no first principles at work. Any view and action his perceived "tribe" takes is viewed in a positive light, and vice versa.
For good or bad, this is how the vast majority of human societies operate. Western liberalism is a very unique experiment to rise above such base impulses. And in 2024 most of the world, including many western leftists, reject liberalism and first principles.
Liberalism is the very essence of lizard brain tribalism, as you should know from your time at UP.
I understand. I had a family member sent to a camp because they were a doctor that treated Jews. I’m very proud of that.
Nevertheless, attacking a group of fans of a team attached to a national identity doesn’t mean the motivation is antisemitism or a rejection of Israel as a legitimate state rather than anger at the actions of that state. I think it’s pretty dangerous to reinforce the flawed belief of antisemites that the state of Israel and Jewishness are indistinguishable.
Eh, soccer hooligans are some of the most racist people alive, it's a pretty safe bet they're antisemites.
He is not deranged. It is just zero sum lizard brain tribalism. There is no first principles at work. Any view and action his perceived "tribe" takes is viewed in a positive light, and vice versa.
For good or bad, this is how the vast majority of human societies operate. Western liberalism is a very unique experiment to rise above such base impulses. And in 2024 most of the world, including many western leftists, reject liberalism and first principles.
Those of us not taking a tribal view are not doing very well at the moment.
You don’t hear too much from me about that because I’ve literally never been asked that in this thread. Yes, obviously that is also ethnic cleansing.
Your criteria for not being ethnic cleansing of civilians is who started the war? I’ve not heard that. You might consider it justified ethnic cleansing but it’s still ethnic cleansing.
you dont have to be asked a specific question in order to argue on the merit of the conflict in good faith, understanding both sides are responsible for the current situation.
each side was more "in the wrong" at different times, and each side created a sense of wariness of the other sides motives.
the problem with Jal, Victor and you, is the one dimensional approach, which Dunyain just dissected.
And ofc the main blind spot is ignoring the phenomena of the radical Islam, and the part it takes in all of it.
Just as you raised the argument that the violence is not necessarily against Jews, but maybe against Israel, while Jews and others are explaining to you and to all that they cant even carry Jewish symbols, as they are being targeted.
It is ok to criticize Israel, but we cant ignore the facts.
Meanwhile,
. I'm sure this is just because of a few football hooligans and not representative of Israel.I'll ask again
Israel should withdraw without the hostages and with hamas in power?
It's just another very sad sign of what's happened to the Israeli and Gaza populations after so many decades of segregation, apartheid and propaganda.
Because the chants aren't only anti Gaza, as you know because we have this translation of the chants:
sure and arabs as well isn't a synonim of muslim. You might think the actual intent was islamophobic sure. But then we can start from antisemitism everytime anyone attacks Israeli people.
Just as you raised the argument that the violence is not necessarily against Jews, but maybe against Israel, while Jews and others are explaining to you and to all that they cant even carry Jewish symbols, as they are being targeted.
It is ok to criticize Israel, but we cant ignore the facts.
The star of David, the greatest symbol in Jewish History, is being taken off school calendars and winter displays because of its "connection to Israel"
Google it
There are hundreds of instances
And more proof that antizionism is antisemitism
The atatck was indefensible fullstop
but holy ****, imagine being a palastinian reading this lot.
