GOAT NBA Discussion: Biggest fraud poster: fallguy. Super AIDS Containment thread
Everyone said that the Cavs would've won in 2015 if they had Kyrie, and he's proven to be the difference-maker to get Lebron and Luka over the hump.... So the 16' Finals wasn't a surprise except the comeback aspect of 3-1 deficit.. But the actual result wasn't unexpected to anyone that understood the history - Lebron's roster was initially favored as the preseason favorite, but
They fell to underdog due to the Warriors winning 73 games.
Cavs actually went over their under/over win total for the year.
But don't let facts get in the way of your story.
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They fell to underdog due to the Warriors winning 73 games.
Cavs actually went over their under/over win total for the year.
But don't let facts get in the way of your story.
Kawhi's Spurs were on pace to win 70 games all year in 2016 and settled on 67 wins... The Cavs were supposed to have a year like this and if the Cavs had been the 70 win juggernaut that they were supposed to be, then the Finals odds would've been neck-and-neck - it would've been a clash of titans like the 80's Celtics/Lakers... But instead, the Cavs won 57 games and then a ridiculous 53 in 2017.
And Lebron fell from preseason favorite to loser or underdog for 6 straight years, not just 2016 - so it's weird that you would single out 1 instance instead of addressing the obvious point that Lebron underachieves favored rosters regularly and as a standard - that's what his brand of ball does and the evidence shows this...
And we know why he underachieves his rosters - it's because his skillset of high-scoring ball-dominance produces low-assist teams and turns everyone into spot-up shooter, thereby preventing elite roster consruction and chemistry.
Kawhi? Why are you mentioning Kawhi?
He's not a franchise player.
No one said anything about HOF's... Draymond, Klay and Pippen are HOF's but not franchise players.Franchise players are elite producers that were asked to build a lottery team from scratch - the franchise is building around them and they essentially have their own team... This is reserved for the best players like Lebron, Jordan, Wade, Kobe, AD, Luka, etc... Kevin Love, Bosh a
He's no Kevin Love.
I realise you don't know how to do basic math when it comes to betting, but under/overs are based on the expected win totals for the year. They were not "expected" to win 70 games.
How delusional are you?
The above also shows you that the good teams are in the west, and just because the Cavs were preseason favourite, doesn't mean they would be favourered in a series against the Warriors (or SAS).
But once again, don't let numbers get in the way of a good story.
Do you also notice how teams 2-5 are the next favorites after Cleveland? Do you notice how they're all in the West? Do you understand that even if the West was the favorite against the East without teams attached (and I'm sure they were) that Cleveland would still be the rightful favorite if it's basically a lock that they're coming out of the East? Could you see how this throws all your pre-season favorite narrative out the window?
Neither were the Warriors or the Spurs.
Yet those teams were juggernauts, while the team with the most on-paper talent and preseason favorite fell far short despite having the best roster.
And again, you aren't addressing the underlying point that Lebron has a massive trend of underperforming favored talent by falling to underdog or losing with preseason favorites for 6 straight years.. Lebron has a bad brand of ball that underachieves favored rosters like the preseason favorite from 11' to 16'.
Do you also notice how teams 2-5 are the next favorites after Cleveland? Do you notice how they're all in the West? Do you understand that even if the West was the favorite against the East without teams attached (and I'm sure they were) that Cleveland would still be the rightful favorite if it's basically a lock that they're coming out of the East? Could you see how this th
From 2011 to 2015, the odds for the top teams were an equal mix of East and West... So your excuse for the 6 straight preseason favorites from 11' to 16' holds no water.
Accordingly, the reason that Lebron's teams were preseason favorites from 11' to 16' is because he's the only guy that teamed up with 3 franchise players, while every other team only had 1.. And we're talking about guys in their prime, so 2010 Shaq or 2016 Duncan don't count..
Lebron teamed up with Wade, Love, Kyrie and Bosh, yet you're searching for other reasons why he was the preseason favorite every year... No one else in the league teamed up during that time - only Lebron.
If Jokic teamed up with SGA and Senguin, that would make him the favorite every year, while decimating the Western Conference - that's what Lebron did... Everyone knows that he put the top 3 players in the conference on 1 team, so it's amazing that he got praised for winning the conference after that.. Fraud is the only reason this type of crap happens.
If Jokic teamed up with SGA and Senguin, that would make him the favorite every year, while decimating the Western Conference
Except Jokic can't fit with another big (this isn't the 80s). That's why he volunteered to go to the bench and eventually (bc it was untenable) the team traded Nurkic.
Unlike LeBron, who could fit with anyone. In a roundabout way you proved again why LeBron is such a Swiss Army knife. (And again show how you fundamentally don't understand/appreciate defense.)
Except Jokic can't fit with another big (this isn't the 80s). That's why he volunteered to go to the bench and eventually (bc it was untenable) the team traded Nurkic.
Unlike LeBron, who could fit with anyone. In a roundabout way you proved again why LeBron is such a Swiss Army knife. (And again show how you fundamentally don't understand/appreciate defense.)
Only Lebron has a long list of teammates that cratered alongside him - he's the only guy that actually has historic bad fits that everyone remembers.. The Bosh and Love debacles.. The Ingram and Westbrook disasters... The Jamison and Hughes letdowns... No one else has that.
History shows that Lebron cratered Hughes, Jamison, Bosh, Love, Luka, Westbrook, Ingram, Kuzma, Clarkson, Rose, Drummond, Dindwiddie, Christian Wood, Taureen Prince, and many more.
Btw, you're right that centers don't fit with other centers, while ball-dominators don't fit with other ball-dominators and a lot of forwards... Accordingly, jumpshooters are the only skillset that fits with everyone.
I don't use stats to form my top 10... I use things like winning, underachievement, overachievement, and the overall caliber of chemistry and teams that your skillset yielded - things like that - these things determine a player's long-run title equity more than stats.
Ok but I was responding to your statement that you can’t be a top 10 player without being top 10 in some categories …..
Which top 10 categories bird is ?
Is that like the goat Choke .
Another factual stats that u will ignore and keep
Spewing to justify LeBron isn’t too 10 even tho it’s false ?
I don't base scoring ability on PPG, or maybe that's like 20% of the pie at most - I base scoring on how much you could: 1) carry your team's scoring burden and: 2) WIN
Ok but you specifically said it counts this for assit and APG and you said LeBron isn’t high enough being top because he was 24 and then oops bird at 48th but it’s ok again ….
And now u say ppg doesn’t count really ….lol.
Regardless , when I see a guy being top 7 all time in ppg and say isn’t one of the greatest scorer ever in like , wtf u talking about .
Ah yes , now let not use stats because it would actually prove LeBron is a great scorer right ?
For the frequency , again read me .
It would matter if anyone would had the same . .
No one has 4 final mvp and only one has more …
But since that stays favours LeBron to prove he did plenty of winning being 4 Tim envi player , let’s not use that stats either now again right ?
Ps: LeBron once was a top scoring champions 1 season .
Nah is not a top scorer being all time leader and being at the 7 rank ppg per game …
And he does it for 20 freakn years where everyone one else would crater at some point in their career ..
Jfc it’s dumb .
I wonder what Shark is up to these days.
Or if anyone has seen him?
Since he's like 5'3 and would be hard to spot in real life.
The 2 games in Cleveland were 1-possession games that Lebron choked away with 24 on 35% and 6 TO's per game in those 2 games, so anyone else would've been tied at 2-2 heading back to San Antonio with all the momentum..Again, the Cavs lost that series because Lebron played worse than anyone ever has.Okay but Duncan didn't lose - he won because Lebron averaged 22 on 35% with 6 TO
So you saying a normal LeBron would of been that team by himself alone without even 1 all star ?
But why then LeBron was pre season odds were bad to win being +900 and pre final the spurs were a favorite at a -400 !!!
I guess the entire world know nothing about basketball but you ?
Is Duncan a top 10 players ever ?
And u expect Lebron by himself with no all stars to beat Tim Duncan with 2 hall of famer ?
Is that what your expertise tell you ?
Ps: Larry Hughes played 2 games in the final and even then u expected LeBron to win with 2 unknow lol
* 17.8 ppg and zero clutch points for the entire series (last 5 within 5)^^^ that's the biggest underachievement ever based on the production and clutch of a top 10 candidate in a big series loss.It's the goat choke and biggest surprise ever - it isn't just about Miami losing - it's about Lebron's performance missing expectation more than anyone else's ever has.Furthermore, Leb
I still don’t understand how you believe Lebron being the only team to win 1 games (and he won 2 not just 1 ) in 2011 why Dallas swept Kobe with a championship team ?
Why you have Shaq and Kobe winning a 3 peat , teaming up with 2 top 75 players and they lost 4-1 vs a team with 0 top 75 pool players and u think that isn’t worst ?
So Shaq and Kobe get a pass (btw favored at -700 odds !!) but LeBron doesn’t while only having -175 odds (worst then warriors 2015-16-17-18 and 2004 lakers ….
U just make nonsense at all with stats buddy , blaming so much LeBron while giving a pass to anyone else …..and they all in top 10 but not LeBron ,smh .
I don't base scoring ability on PPG, or maybe that's like 20% of the pie at most - I base scoring on how much you could: 1) carry your team's scoring burden and: 2) WIN
Let’s put a rest to this ….
You know , sometimes one argument is valid in some context and other context it isn’t .
This is a perfect example .
What you wrote there to prove Lebron isn’t better then mj might be true .
But that same argument being used against Lebron for not being in the top 10 makes no sense at all while all the others get a pass for it ! Again !!
When did magic won without sharing the load with Kareem in scoring ?
When did Kareem won a title without sharing the load of scoring with magic and Oscar ?
When did Shaq won without sharing the load with Kobe or wade ?
When did bird won without sharing the load with so many hall of famers too ?
Curry with KD or klay ?
No idea if have Russel in your time but did this guy shared the load too huh ?
I mean yeah they all did
(except with mj where your arguments might make some sense)
but for being top 10 , lebron did like everybody else but WON more with more final mvp but hey -> no … that doesn’t count because it’s LeBron ?
Please….
FG. You need to stop talking about the pre-season favourite thing. It makes you look dumb. Like embarrassingly so. And you don't seem to realise why. But that's okay. Just stop doing it. Like the guy that wants to talk about why the earth is flat. And doesn't understand why he should stop doing it.
Keep talking about assisted percentages or something.
So Jordan cratered Rodman and destroyed his career?
And everyone wets the bed. Except Jordan. If he did it was someone else"s fault or it was okay because he wanted to play some baseball.
FG. You need to stop talking about the pre-season favourite thing. It makes you look dumb. Like embarrassingly so. And you don't seem to realise why. But that's okay. Just stop doing it. Like the guy that wants to talk about why the earth is flat. And doesn't understand why he should stop doing it.
Keep talking about assisted percentages or something.
I'm not stating opinions regarding preseason favorites - Lebron had 6 straight preseason favorites and no one else had more than 3... Then he fell to underdog or lost for all 6 years, except the Allen miracle.. So he underachieves favored talent by losing with preseason favorites, or falling to underdog.. Lebron has the most losses with preseason favorites ever (4) and has a losing record with preseason favorites (3-4).
All of this is fact, so there's no opinion to criticize - it's all historical record - no one underachieved favored rosters more than Lebron.. And he'll do it again this year because he has the best 2nd, 3rd, and 4th options in the league, but still won't win the title... And who cares about the age thing because everyone knows he's juicing and it's been proven already (why would his bestie Mims get HCG and testosterone from the black market when he's a regular guy that can get it from regular doctor - only a pro athlete would need to access the black market - and he just happened to get it from the biggest-ever distributor of PED's to athletes).
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Let’s put a rest to this ….You know , sometimes one argument is valid in some context and other context it isn’t .This is a perfect example .What you wrote there to prove Lebron isn’t better then mj might be true .But that same argument being used against Lebron for not being in the top 10 makes no sense at all while all the others get a pass for it ! Ag
Duncan, Shaq, Bird, Kobe, Wade, Curry and MJ all carried the scoring load... They all averaged about 10 ppg more than all teammates for the playoffs and Finals of a title run.
Otoh, Lebron never carried the scoring load on the championship level (never defeated max defensive attention).
And btw, that's what we're seeing now with Lebron and these Lakers - he faces no defensive attention compared to Jordan because Lebron has equal-scoring partners to attract equal defensive attention.. Historically, Luka is actually a better scoring threat than Lebron, and Reaves is a 28 ppg scorer but playing 3rd option for these Lakers.
Ultimately, scoring is the "star" category, so since Lebron cannot carry the scoring load, he needs a bunch of star teammates.. It's pretty pathetic.. Imagine needing the best player or 2nd best player in the league as a teammate... Lebron needed that with Wade, Luka and AD.
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Thread Cliffs
Lebron has the best 2nd, 3rd, and 4th options in the league (Reaves, Rui, Luka/Lebron), but we still won't see a dynasty as long as Lebron is playing - his presence prevents a dynasty while a younger star like Jokic, Giannis or SGA would easily have a dynasty with Luka.. So Lebron's presence is a cancer that will prevent Luka from having the dynasty that another top player would easily have with Luka..
Secondly, Luka is also averaging 19 on 37% so far alongside Lebron, so Lebron has destroyed him just like he did to Love, so these Lakers won't be a great team just like he failed to have a great team with Love.
Thirdly, Lebron faces no defensive attention compared to Jordan because Lebron has equal-scoring partners to attract equal defensive attention.. Historically, Luka is actually a better scoring threat than Lebron, and Reaves is a 28 ppg scorer but playing 3rd option for these Lakers.
Ultimately, scoring is the "star" category, so since Lebron cannot carry the scoring load, he needs a bunch of star teammates.. It's pretty pathetic.. Imagine needing the best player or 2nd best player in the league as a teammate... Lebron needed that with Wade, Luka and AD (AD was more like 3rd or 4th but the point remains).
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By reducing Luka to a 19 on 37% player, these Lakers cannot win a title or be a dynasty.. Lebron's reduction of many teammates like Bosh, Love, Westbrook, Ingram, Jamison, Hughes and many more prevented dynasties and titles.
