KQo 3-way 3! pot AQx flop
1/2 NL. Occasional straddle on. I have about 300, straddle about 200, LJ covers. LJ raises to 15. I should probably fold OOP, but he was raising fairly frequently, and I decided to 3! to 50 with KQo. I usually 3! only premiums or sometimes good suited cards. Straddle cold calls and LJ calls. Thought maybe I made a mess of things with the big pot OOP.
Flop (145) is AQ8,r and checks through. The turn is a 5 bringing a 2-flush. Should I bet?
9 Replies
Pre is fine
Try to remember suits but yeah you can probably bet
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Betting like 30-50 on turn is fine. Folding to raises probably.
If 1 calls, maybe make another small bet on river for some thin value. If both calls, check and evaluate?
Think you played it fine to this point. I'd probably pot it. Fold to a raise.
River, check-call anything less than 2/3 pot on a brick. Check-fold flush cards, unless we have the K of that suit. In that case I might consider check-raising as a bluff, if the A on the board is the flush suit and the Q isn't.
You could bet smaller than full pot, but the smaller you go, the more hands in his continue range, and the harder it'll be to hand read him on the river. It'll suck if he calls with something like 76s and the river dribbles off an offsuit 9 or 4. We'll want to lay down in traffic if he calls with 99-JJ and spikes a set.
I actually like 3! with KQo if I think V is raising too much. I would probably go bigger like $65 because we want straddle to get out of the way and being OOP, we are happy with taking the pot down with most of our range. Basically 4x last bet + blinds.
You should be checking a lot of your Ax, straddle has 1 SPR so is incentivized to shove with a decent A, LJ should bet most good made hands but has a lot if air as players often feel "priced in" when straddle calls. So going to the turn, you should have more Ax than anyone. My base play would be to bet.
Size is tricky because of Straddle having $150. Doc's suggestion to pot is fine, except that puts straddle all in. So if call, call, you have dry side pot going to river, basically giving LJ the best possible price on a FD. I'd prefer $50-$70, make sure if straddle shoves it reopens the action. Then if straddle shoves and LJ calls or overshoves, you can evaluate and go from there. It will really boil down to whether you believe LJ is made or drawing. Go with your gut, see the result and adjust gut as necessary.
Without the Straddle, going $100ish would meaningfully narrow LJs range, take it down a lot and leave room to fold.
I bet 75 on the turn, straddle called, original preflop raiser folded. River was an offsuit 7. I checked, straddle shoved, I folded. Straddle said he had top two, meaning AQ. I was kind of annoyed that this cost me an additional 110 over if I called and folded the flop or folded to a 3-bet from straddle. When I bet the turn, I think I was only taking it down if I was ahead. Obviously, this looks like a great flop for my range with AA/QQ/AK/AQ.
Pre is fine, although I'd rather be in position. Betting the turn is fine and good. I'd go $75.
Straddle only had like $75 left on the river right?
I mean it's a gross spot, but $75 into a nearly $300 pot is a call all day with second pair in my book. OTT, he is calling with any Qx, a lot of which you beat, any flush draw, 99 through JJ. If he is sitting on the river with busted FD or JJ is he going to check back? It's a gross spot for him because AP, at best you have a Q and you have a ton of busted FD and probably a good amount Kx. You are not checking river to trap someone with only 1/4 pot behind. How gross is it for him to lose 60% of his stack and you have a K high or pocket 6s?
The weaker his hand is, the more incentivized he is to ship it and just hope that you fold sometimes. Busted FDs or JT is a double gutter, I think those should shove 100% here, and I think most players will find that shove out of desperation.
On the value side, what does he have? Qx - maybe that shoves sometimes. If he thinks you might have JJ. If he has 99-JJ its a funky merge between kind of bluffing and kind of value.
If he has Ax or 2-pair+ is he flatting the turn with a FD appearing, and several gutshot straight draws? Any 9, T, J, K, or flush completing river is bad for a made hand and he doesn't have an SPR he can get away from. That's 21 "bad" cards on the river. And depending on his exact hand, pairing the board might be bad too. From his perspective, if he can't fold if the draws hit, he might as well gii on the turn because on the river missed draws will ck/fold, while hit draws will shove. Bottom line, I don't think Ax or better gets to the river like this very often. They go in OTF or OTT.
As a result, KQ specifically beats or chops with a huge portion of his value range and beats all the bluffs.
He claims he had AQ. I think he is lying. If he wasn't, well he'd have extracted an additional $75 from me with his poor play, and in the future I will have a cliff note that he likes to trap with strong but vulnerable hands. In the future, I will bet my draws small OOP against him to name my price (confident I won't be raised enough) and bet larger OTTR when my draw hits knowing he will have more hands that can't fold even with the draw hitting than he should. You'll get your $75 back later if that is how he plays. You just reinforced the bad play, and got information for the future.
There is nothing wrong with lending $75 to get information. Those loans tend to come back with interest. I think once you've gone this far, you have to just pay off the last little bit and get the information value when you lose and sometimes you win a big pot. Reinforce his bad play with a little bit of money, and a little speech too. "Wow, you roped me in, good hand!" Always tell bad players that they are playing great. They will like you, they will want to play with you more, and they will continue making the same mistakes for longer. It really sucks when you identify a leak in your opponents and then they fix it before you can exploit it.
It's a $145 pot and we are on the turn?