GOAT NBA Discussion: Biggest fraud poster: fallguy. Super AIDS Containment thread
History shows that all high-scoring primary ballhandlers (ball-dominators) have high volume of unassisted buckets/solo missions that leave teammates in spot-up roles (higher assisted rates), which lowers their assists and produces low-assist teams.. However, Lebron's ball-dominance is even worse because he starts at forward, so the spot-up role and assist-lowering effect on teammates is stronger when the ball-dominator plays a non-ball-dominant position (any position outside of PG) - the ball-dominance is more abnormal at other positions outside of PG... Accordingly, Lebron's "frontcourt ball-dominance" is simply the worst kind of ball-dominance that underperforms good rosters the most, such as the most losses ever with preseason favorites, Finals teams, and a 3 straight losses with homecourt (a record).
The Pat McCafee show is a joke - Lebron is sitting up there like he's some kingpin when in reality he loses every year and the media clamors to get him more help every year...
His AAU ball-dominant skillset produced perennial losers with Luka, AD, Love or Wade and cannot produce a great team..
He has horrific clutch efficiency and never hit a big shot on the championship level, so he simply isn't a winner, and the numbers show he has the most losses every with every type of good team, such as preseason favorites or Finals teams, and also a losing record with every type of good team (preseason favorites, Finals teams, all-star teammates, 1 or 2 seeds).
Ultimately, a few dozen journalism majors perpetrated a fraud by convincing millions of clueless fans that the biggest loser, choker and colluder in history is the GOAT - someone that never hit a big shot on the championship level and has a losing record with every type of cast.
Jordan fact.MJ wanted to stack his team, but owners realised that having Pippen was better.
Lebron is the only top 10 candidate that teamed up with opponents, while Bird said that MJ elevated teammates more than anyone:
https://www.basketballnetwork.net/old-sc...
narrator: Orlando Woolridge was not, in fact, an All-Star for the rest of his career. (Nor once.)
History shows that all high-scoring primary ballhandlers (ball-dominators) have high volume of unassisted buckets/solo missions that leave teammates in spot-up roles (higher assisted rates), which lowers their assists and produces low-assist teams.. However, Lebron's ball-dominance is even worse because he starts at forward, so the spot-up role and assist-lowering effect on tea
History shows that the best players to win is to be a great defender and counting on others to scores has a team -> playing a system ?
Your own #2 on top 10 list says so ….
So all the garbage of jump shooter etc, gall dominator , etc out the windows .
Your narrative about pippen as well !
AND strangely enough , your goat himself says so lol !!!
So when you say pippen sucks because of w.e nonsense you speaks like he can only score in a system is bad (about Duncan btw?) , mj saying he couldn’t had a better teammate, you chose a similar player like Russell at your #2 spot in top 10 and despite all your theory , results should matters -> 6 rings ….
Wtf you talking about exactly , contradicting YOURSELF all over on top of all this …?
In the 1998 2nd Round, Pippen had zero points in clutch-time (shown below)... lol.... and of course 3.0 on 20% in the 4th quarter of 94' 2nd Round (shown above).
This type of worst-ever efficiency and clutch ability is what happens when you force a dunker into a 2nd op
4 games do not make a career .
I’ll just take 4 games in mj career to show you how mj isn’t the goat …
Makes no sense …
Btw I’ll just find easily like almost ALL games played by bosh and love in the playoffs and show you how they sucks …
But no, ah yes , for those playoffs doesn’t count …
Or it’s Lebron fault despite without Lebron they never win a god damn thing .
And for w.e reason, they suck because of Lebron but you can’t say it about mj for pippen …
Man stop your insanity .
Your own criteria makes u lie all over the place .
If pippen sucked so much , love and bosh were probably the worst franchise players in the history of the sport …..ho yes I forgot again , playoffs does not count for them , jfc …
narrator: Orlando Woolridge was not, in fact, an All-Star for the rest of his career. (Nor once.)
Bird didn't know that he had drug problems and Woolridge was traded away from Jordan after Jordan's injury year in 1986... So he didn't get a long tenure with prime Jordan like Pippen did, but Woolridge was actually a more talented player than Pippen and this is well-documented.. Woolridge also played in the super-team 80's and didn't get the 2-star vs 2-star format that Pippen got alongside MJ in the 90's - anyone wins alongside the GOAT in a 2-star vs 2-star format.
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Here's a new reason why Lebron isn't goat:
During the 2010's, a few dozen journalists began saying that Lebron was in something new called a "goat debate", and they did this every day for 10+ years... Consequently, millions of fans that get their knowledge from these journalists believed it, thereby allowing Lebron's manufactured resume and perennial losing to unfairly leapfrog greater winners like Kobe, Duncan or Curry.
In contrast to a media-created "goat debate", Jordan became the actual goat (there was no debate) immediately upon achieving a substantive body of work that was objectively-superior than the 2 forebearers of the modern era - Magic and Bird... This wasn't some one-off series of 40 ppg or something... It was a substantive body of work that entailed goat winning and goat dominance simultaneously, such as 3-peating with 34/7/7 in the playoffs or 36/7/8 in the Finals.. This contrasts greatly with inferior guys that make the Finals or win titles with a pathetic 25 ppg, and they might not even lead their team in scoring or make all-defense... It's an entirely lower level and not worthy of anything more than a top 10 debate, let alone a goat debate.
TLDR: media-created "debate" versus Jordan's substantive body of work that originally made him the GOAT (3-peating with 41 ppg)
Everyone can see that the Lakers are much better without Lebron on the floor and every stat shows him as a massive negative, such as plus/minus, net rating, and many more... Meanwhile, 40-year old Jordan was a positive.. His crafty off-ball game, jumpshooting, defense, and closing would easily win the title with 2 All-NBA-level performers like Luka and Reaves - what a duo, smh
40-year old Jordan was much better than Lebron:
Fallguy you died on this hill 900 pages ago, find a new hobby. Maybe see a psychiatrist.
Fallguy you died on this hill 900 pages ago, find a new hobby. Maybe see a psychiatrist.
Maybe stop getting the entirety of your basketball knowledge from a few dozen journalism majors.. Then you won't fall for a fraud and feel compelled to post in a thread that definitively solved and exposed the fraud (it's the ball-domination part, aka no off-ball game ----> no ball movement ----> bad chemistry/fits for 22 years ----> perennial loser with every cast ----> never a great team)
Back in the 80's you could just find some random auto mechanic and tell him that he should try basketball and he'd come and start winning Defensive Player of the Year awards and even show up in MVP voting.
It wasn't just a beginner format, there were literal beginners on the court.
Follow a lead on a photo of a tall guy in Sudan, and within a few years he finishes 5th in NBA rookie of the year after basically never touching a basketball until his teenage years.
Back in the 80's you could just find some random auto mechanic and tell him that he should try basketball and he'd come and start winning Defensive Player of the Year awards and even show up in MVP voting.It wasn't just a beginner format, there were literal beginners on the court. Follow a lead on a photo of a tall guy in Sudan, and within a few years he finishes 5th in NBA ro
The best American players today are Tatum, Ant and Ja, which is a joke compared to the 90's, so the reason why the NBA has weaker players and competition than the 90's is the massive decline of American basketball - this more than offsets the increase in international play.
Facts
Now that everyone has KD over Kobe.
A better question is the argument of Giannis over Kobe.
Giannis is about to have his 7th straight Top 4 MVP finish. Kobe maxed out at 6 straight (he had 7 total).
In those peak years...
Giannis averaged 30/12/6 on 60 eFG% 0.258WS/48, 9.8 BPM 30.4 PER
Kobe averaged 29/5/5 on 49 eFG%. 0.19WS/48, 4.5 BPM & 24.5 PER
Kobe did have the extra Championship to be fair, but did have the help of a HoFer and Top 3 coach of all time.
It's pretty clearly Giannis.
US players are almost certainly better than ever.
They just face a legit international field of players now and just generally much better competition in every way.
It wasn't even until 1994 that Kevin Bacon discovered tall men in Africa.
MJ
Russell
Wilt
Kareem
Bird
Kobe
Duncan
Shaq
Curry
Jokic
Magic
Lebron
Oscar
Isiah
KD
Hakeem
Dr. J
Moses
Karl Malone
Robinson
Dirk
KG
West
Baylor
Barkley
I think that's like 24..... 14 thru 24 are fluid
Funny having curry and KD so high and blaming lebron and harden losing vs them , claiming they suck because they played with less all stars than the warriors .
Just the concept they lost because warriors just had a better team seem to be nonsense for FG .
I mean how can the warriors could easily be beaten (FG words) while have KD and steph so high on the list , play together and add 2 all stars on top of it shrug .
Maybe stop getting the entirety of your basketball knowledge from a few dozen journalism majors.. Then you won't fall for a fraud and feel compelled to post in a thread that definitively solved and exposed the fraud (it's the ball-domination part, aka no off-ball game ----> no ball movement ----> bad chemistry/fits for 22 years ----> perennial loser with every cast ----> never
Well , when you alone in the entire world with your views, might be possible you are wrong when the entire planet cannot recognize what you see ….
You could coach and make millions , you should try .
Btw I would hard press you to find nba players believing lebron not in top 10.
He isn’t just couple of journalists.
Here's another GOAT of the era (shame he's not in the HOF) saying what's up:
Thanks fg, my algo is now tailored to counter your bullshit with it's own.
Fire v fire.
Can someone explain why putting the top 3 players in a conference on 1 team and then making a bunch of Finals is the best basketball that we've seen?? Why is this praised as a great achievement???.. Lebron was supposed to win 8 titles in a row, yet people settled on just making the Finals??. There's never been a bigger fraud in sports history.. Imagine letting a guy team up with the best players and then praising him for just making it to the title game (winning it isn't a requirement for goat.. It's amazing how dumb people are on this planet.
US players are almost certainly better than ever.
They just face a legit international field of players now and just generally much better competition in every way.
It wasn't even until 1994 that Kevin Bacon discovered tall men in Africa.
Tatum, Ant and Ja > MJ, Magic, Bird?
What are you smoking??... Prime Barkley is better than any current American player and he wasn't anywhere near the best player in the 90's.
Again, look at the top 10 for MVP in the 90's compared to today - the top guys today are all international, while the top guys in the 90's were American and they were all better MUCH than Tatum (today's best American player).
It isn't close - the massive cratering of American basketball is why the league's talent is so much worse today.. Infact, it's only the international guys holding up the weak American talent tbh, otherwise the league talent would be a joke and mockery.
Here's another GOAT of the era (shame he's not in the HOF) saying what's up:Thanks fg, my algo is now tailored to counter your bullshit with it's own. Fire v fire.
Pippen averaged 15 on 34% in that series, so who is going to score without Jordan?
This means the Bulls get destroyed by 20 ppg without Jordan, but are probably still favored without Rodman and likely still win.
Accordingly, any talk about Rodman being the key is pure poppycock from broke dudes looking for attention, or trying to sound smart and contrary... Literally just looking for attention... Period.
Kemp lacks an education, so he doesn't realize that he destroyed Rodman so much that he nearly won FMVP from Jordan.
Well , when you alone in the entire world with your views, might be possible you are wrong when the entire planet cannot recognize what you see ….
You could coach and make millions , you should try .
Btw I would hard press you to find nba players believing lebron not in top 10.
He isn’t just couple of journalists.
Literally every player and coach in the world says that Lebron needs the ball to be effective and that he stifles teammates... How is this different that what I've said itt?
No one in the pro basketball industry is going to blatantly insult Lebron's skills like I do by calling him a ball-dominator or perennial loser, but they say things like he "needs" the ball to be effective, or that he "stifles" teammates - these are nice ways of saying the same stuff that I say.
The only difference is that I've explained it statistically with assisted rate and time of possession... Nothing that I've said is opinion - it's literally the historical record and it would behoove you to learn it so you better-understand the game that you watch.
Specifically, high scoring primary ballhandlers, aka "ball-dominators" are mostly unassisted by teammates (low assisted rates).. Their large volume of unassisted buckets leaves everyone standing in spot-up roles with higher assisted rates (statistical fact)... These spot-up roles and higher assisted rates lower everyone's assists and produce low assist teams (statistical fact) that can't win with "normal" rosters of 1 franchise player (historical fact).
You've been educated bro, so don't hate on the education... You prefer the dumbske's you see on TV???... The journalism majors that did zero research and are just talking off-the-cuff - you want them telling you how hoops works?... You'll hear greater insight at the happy hour of your local bar, smh.
Journalists told you that it was impressive to put the top 3 PER's on 1 team and then JUST MAKE THE FINALS (not win) - just making the Finals is the impressive part that deserves praise.. Let that sink in... You fell for someone that is allowed to stack the deck and then only has to make the title game to get praise... And actually, he gets praised for WCF sweep losses in 2023 - this added to his goat case according to the dumske's you listen to on TV.
