Do you believe in God?
Tell me people do you believe in God?
I would love to be reunited with my loved ones in heaven, give me a reason to believe and save my soul.
You have to free yourself from the tight leash of scientific empiricism you’re holding first.
A good father trusts his son and lets him go to explore other potential realities.
It’s not “Prove to me xyz, then I will unhook the leash.” You have to unhook the leash first.
You have to free yourself from the tight leash of scientific empiricism you’re holding first.
A good father trusts his son and lets him go to explore other potential realities.
It’s not “Prove to me xyz, then I will unhook the leash.” You have to unhook the leash first.
^ This applies to you too Lagtight except it’s traditional Christianity rather than empiricism.
I certainly wasn't convinced through "indoctrination." I became a Christian at age 30, after teaching philosophy for five years.
Then let's hear what convinced you that it is true, and not just more religious stories like all the other religions. I'm just betting you have absolutely nothing of substance on that, and if you do I will be the first to salute it.
Great! Please share and save my soul.
I didn't become convinced through indoctrination, like a religious person.
I certainly wasn't convinced through "indoctrination." I became a Christian at age 30, after teaching philosophy for five years.
Either way, people become convinced to believe things through various mechanisms,
I agree.
Agreed. Something convinced them, it wasn’t a choice.
What a unique diversion to avoid the confronting the biblical fact that Paul contradicts the teachings of Jesus at every turn, and that Jesus says we must follow the laws of Moses forever.
Not going to respond to your claims unless you provide specific statements (chapter and verse) where Paul contradicts Jesus. Let alone "at every turn."
Let’s do the big one. Paul said the laws of Moses were a yoke too much to bear, and not a requi....
I would love to be reunited with my loved ones in heaven, give me a reason to believe and save my soul.
You have to free yourself from the tight leash of scientific empiricism you’re holding first.A good father trusts his son and lets him go to explore other potential realities.It’s not “Prove to me xyz, then I will unhook the leash.” You have to unhook
Scientific empiricism just means what we can see, touch, hear, taste, etc. what reason do you have for abandoning what our senses can tell me and what I should replace it with?
My 2 cents; lol @ all of you who need a fairytail to find 'strength' or 'guidance' in life.
Just pathetic really.
Good day! (L)
Let's do the big one. Paul said the laws of Moses were a yoke too much to bear, and not a requi....
Thanks for fixing the link, DesertCat.
Will respond in due course.
My 2 cents; lol @ all of you who need a fairytail to find 'strength' or 'guidance' in life.
Just pathetic really.
Good day! (L)
I heartily endorse this message!
Fortunately, I'm not aware of any current participants in this Forum who believe in fairytales. (Even Evolutionism doesn't fit that description in my opinion.)
Then let's hear what convinced you that it is true, and not just more religious stories like all the other religions. I'm just betting you have absolutely nothing of substance on that, and if you do I will be the first to salute it.
Will honor this request in due course.
(I think I already answered this in a post eons ago; I'll try to find it and repost it.)
Why is it that nobody seems to realize that the religion that they are in is just one of the religions? Why do they think that their's is the only true one, and that it just obviously overrules all the other ones?
Answer: indoctrination. They mistake their religion for reality ... instead of just realizing, "Yeah, this is our preferred religion. We like the lessons in this myth so it's our club. It has nothing to do with the metaphysics of the universe."
That's a splice that saves the religion from absurdity, and saves apologetics from constant evasion.
Yes God is in charge of gambling games like poker and blackjack and craps.
Proverbs 16:33, which reads "We may throw the dice, but the Lord determines how they fall," is a proverb that emphasizes God's sovereignty and control over all outcomes, even those that seem to be decided by chance. The verse suggests that while humans may initiate actions, the ultimate outcome is determined by God.
Yes God is in charge of gambling games like poker and blackjack and craps. Proverbs 16:33, which reads "We may throw the dice, but the Lord determines how they fall," is a proverb that emphasizes God's sovereignty and control over all outcomes, even those that seem to be decided by chance. The verse suggests that while humans may initiate actions, the ultimate outcome is determ
And that's indoctrination because you just believe whatever it says and recite it. Instead of saying, "Hey, here is another one of those religious doctrines, of which there are untold varieties" ... you swallow it as gospel for no good reason. It's one of the religions, and quoting the doctrine of the religion makes it still just one of the religions. There is no more reason to believe it is reality than for any of the other religions. But when someone swallows it it replaces reality in their thinking. Then they just recite it like a parrot and act like, "What's the problem? I'm telling you the truth of the universe." And that's the brain on religion.
Yes God is in charge of gambling games like poker and blackjack and craps. Proverbs 16:33, which reads "We may throw the dice, but the Lord determines how they fall," is a proverb that emphasizes God's sovereignty and control over all outcomes, even those that seem to be decided by chance. The verse suggests that while humans may initiate actions, the ultimate outcome is determ
This is a big claim, any evidence it’s true?
Nah. They just believe it. On matters of religion, their mind goes blank -- both critical thinking and reality testing are suspended -- and they recite whatever the doctrine is.
I just read a good quote: "An open-minded person will adjust their beliefs to information; and indoctrinated people are conditioned to dismiss anything that threatens the reality of the doctrine." That word "conditioned" is good there, not one usually used to characterize the phenomenon, but very effective and accurate.
Well, considering that it’s a completely unfalsifiable claim, I can’t see how you could test it or provide any real evidence for it. How would the distribution of cards at a poker table be testable different if a deity were determine that distribution vs no deity involved? Especially since the Christian deity is purported to be omnipotent; presumably he could make that distribution appear to be indistinguishable from a random one. One could postulate that devoutly religious players might be more prone to winning, but even were that hypothesis rejected by the data, the believer could simply claim that God doesn’t play favorites at the poker table. I don’t think there is any hard data that could refute the claim, so there can be no evidence for it based on data - ANY data will be taken as evidence for the claim. Hence the claim is useless and may be ignored
In my opinion,
this whole Proverbs chapter 16 is about keeping your cool in the face of adversity. Some outcomes are not in our power to control. This particular passage means to say that when we draw lots fairly, and it doesn't come out in our favor, don't be surprised. No need to be upset or angry or to cause trouble. No need to take it personally. You should understand that you never had any control of the outcome of this process. A higher power controls the lots. Theists call it God. Non-theists can call it nature.
In my opinion, this whole Proverbs chapter 16 is about keeping your cool in the face of adversity. Some outcomes are not in our power to control. This particular passage means to say that when we draw lots fairly, and it doesn't come out in our favor, don't be surprised. No need to be upset or angry or to cause trouble. No need to take it personally. You should understand that
Not being results oriented and accepting the randomness that drives much of life is a good thought process.
But attributing it to a deity without evidence is a poor thought process. Proverbs was written by early iron age men searching for explanations for how the world works, and how to best live their lives. Given how we are biased to anthropomorphize natural events and processes, they attributed things they could not understand to an entity.
12 minutes of pure genius, or sacrilege, about religion ... according to one's inclination.
And another:
“It’s time to let go of ancient man’s superstitious beliefs and dogmas.” – Baron d’Holbach
That's a pretty good quote. He wrote it in the 1700's. I'm sure he'd be horrified to see the resurgence of fundamentalism that considers buying into such as the good.
Some food for thought. Are the following superstitions: drinking someone's blood gives eternal life, donkeys talk, the sun stands still in the sky, someone walks on the sea, god is born of a virgin, witches need to be killed, miracles left and right, there was a global flood, the human race comes from 2 progenitors, all the species were put on a boat, men lived to be nearly 1000 years old, there is a roof over the world with heaven just beyond.
Or are they a sound, scientific metaphysics of the universe?
So the lesson is in assessing belief systems regarding origins and metaphysics, we don't dismiss them from all standards of reality and nature like ancient superstitious cultures did. That just isn't defensible, isn't reasonable, isn't sensible, obviously isn't reality based. It's magical.
Of course there are untold more examples of fiction in the Bible, but I left out the undead army arising from their graves bones a-jangling. When you read something like this, say to yourself: "Okay, this is fiction. To take this as true is to revert to primitive superstitious literalism that has no place in reality, thus placing the belief system in the land of unreality.
