Old Man Coffee wants to move up to 2/5 from 1/3
Average 55M recreational player in S. Florida here….love love playing but about 1.25 hours from Seminole Hardrock so little challenging getting down there super often - husband and father and small business owner keeps me very busy but I’d love to be semi-competent at 2/5 but I almost always just play 1/3 and do fine I guess but I’m fairly tight and try to play position, target higher VPIP players but definitely need to study and learn pre-flop charts better. I tried my hand ONCE at 2/5 at West Palm Kennel Club but didn’t love the facility and got pushed around a little bit for a small session loss. Tried to wait on monsters but a couple super aggro players controlled the table for most part.
Don’t study a ton but do love watching YT - Bart Hanson although tbh his discussion can go over my head a bit, I like Doug McCusker although he seems very very sticky, and sometimes Brad Owen’s channel.
Only book I have read is The Course by Ed Miller. I did enjoy that.
I’m not not SUPER nitty but I don’t try to bluff the 1/3 folks too much unless I really sense weakness.
Any tips for how to move up and semi-hold my own?
Thanks in advance
WM
8 Replies
Eventually, u have to accept the bigger variance of 2-5. So you'll want to be what u consider as over-rolled for 2-5, so that losses will be water off a ducks back. If you're a solid player, constantly remind yourself that the bigger downswings also provide the bigger upswings. If you're a thinking player, you'll adjust fine.
You have the bankroll for 2/5 or have a few spare stacks to take it shot? Probably just go straight to it, won’t play very different
Fold less, raise more.
limp raise bluff because you can rep the aces everytime!
As long as you have the bankroll and are comfortable with the higher loss possibility, I say go for it. Keep reading the strat forums here, watching videos, reading books, etc. Play tight/aggressive and value bet, value bet, value bet. Don't worry about bluffing them or getting bluffed.
Take the time to let the "long run" sink in. Poker is a game that takes place over many thousands of hands. I come from a live table background and what the long run truly means was lost on me for a very long time. In one live table sesh you might see 100-200 hands. Those few aggro players pushing the table around could have had solid holdings that entire time, and be quite normal players from a theoretical perspective. My advice would be to start with learning the preflop charts, download GTO wizard and use it to do some post flop work, keep reading and watching strat videos, but as a little aside, throw $100 into an online poker website and 4 table the lowest stakes for just a couple hours a day every day for a month. This, above anything else, will show you the true shape of the game, and in my opinion should help contextualize all of the decision making practices and decisions themselves that you will learn by studying strategy.
I disagree with the GTO study for your needs. It's time consuming and complex and most people misapply it anyway.
IMO, the order of things to learn is
1. Solid Fundamentals -- This alone can make you a 5bb /hour winner at live 2/5.
2. Exploitative Plays -- This can get you to 10bb/hour.
3. GTO -- This can get you playing 5/10 and higher.
Here's my suggestions.
1. Learn Fundamentals:
Read Improve Your Poker Now by Alex Fitzgerald and Topher Goggin.
I don't mean just read it casually, I mean sit down with a notepad and highlighter and prepare to read it multiple times over the next few months.
It doesn't teach anything fancy, just solid fundamentals for live play.
Don't read anything else. Don't study from multiple teachers and try to cross-apply the learnings (not yet at least.) Find a solid source of strategy and stick to it 100%, no variation.
Improve Your Poker Now is a solid wholistic strategy for this. The only thing it lacks, imo, is range charts (it has it's reasons it doesn't include them) but you can find them online.
Those are the only 2 things you need to study. If you have tight/aggressive opening ranges and a solid understanding of post-flop play you can hold your own, and this book and a set of ranges will provide that.
2. Actively Watch Poker Vlogs
Poker Vlogs (incl. Hanson's call-in show) are great ways to practice your thought process. But don't watch them aimlessly. At every decision point pause the video and narrate your thoughts.
- What's Opponents Range here?
- - What are the best hands that opponent can have on this board?
- If I bet, will it be a bluff or value?
- - If value, what hands am I trying to get value from?
- - If bluff, what hands am I trying to get to fold?
etc.
Then watch what the player actually did. They're likely better than you. So if they took the same action/bet size -- Congrats! If they didn't - rethink through the position and ask why did they do things differently? If you're lucky they'll explain it.
Take notes of the insights you gather.
A 30 minute video should take you 45 minutes to watch as you constantly pause, think through the situation, etc.
I recommend having your opening ranges printed out so that you can look at the ranges as you watch to see what hands villain should have (albeit they'll often be wider in real life.)
Some good vlogs for this are GazzyB's, Brad Owens, Andrew Neeme.
There are also smaller vloggers that I enjoy watching because while I mostly agree with their play there are often times I disagree with them which is good - it means I've an opinion (e.g. NorCalPoker)
3. Track Your Play
Get used to taking notes at the table of hands to review later. There are "Poker Keyboards" you can install on your phone that make it super quick and easy to record a hand in your notes app.
Get an app (or spreadsheet) also to track winnings.
If you really want to improve, you need written records of results, notable hands, etc., to allow for objective analysis. After every session (day after, in the morning with a coffee) think about what you could've done differently in the hand.
If you called - could you have raised? Folded? Why? Why not? Etc.
Go back to your book/notes and reread the chapters where it discussed that position. What did it say? What example hands in the book are similiar to your situation? Why did the author recommend to play a certain way? How does that differ from what you did? Why? Etc.
Track your performance, aim for small improvements and 80% of the time study (including reviewing your decisions, which ones are good and for the bad ones why are they bad and what you can change) and 20% play