AK spot
Level 2 of day 1 £140 tournament Freezeout.
SS 100k
Blinds 300/600/600
Stacks (approx)
Hero 140k I’ve had a run of hands and spots that mean I’ve chipped up without showdown
V1 75k
V2 105k
V1 utg+1 opens to 1400
H mp AsKc i opt to flat in position - not sure why although part of it was to tone down my image and keep some strong hands in my flatting range.
Folds to V2 in SB who 3bets to 5500
V1 calls
H makes it 26500
Thoughts here? My read on V1 was based on a small exposure and my read on V2 based on a lot more time at tables with him is that he is capable of squeezing here
Flop is 9 high rb
V2 bets 10500…
V1 calls
Hero?
6 Replies
This hands plays better when you 3b. The whole reason to keep the 3b Stat up is so you can get paid in these spots. I don't really have a "call range" in mp. In later position yes you want a balanced call range but AK isn't in that range. Think of hands that play well multi-way and hands that do not...
This hands plays better when you 3b. The whole reason to keep the 3b Stat up is so you can get paid in these spots. I don't really have a "call range" in mp. In later position yes you want a balanced call range but AK isn't in that range. Think of hands that play well multi-way and hands that do not...
Can’t argue with that.
But as played?
The stack size is pretty awkward. Your 4-bet sizing preflop was close to committing against player 1 but not quite committing especially with the deeper player. If I was going to flat the initial bet I would have preferred you 4-bet to a smaller size.
With this hand as played on the flop I think I would look at it as a shove or fold spot. If you're shoving it's basically a bluff (hopefully with 6 outs if you're called, occasionally you could run into a set or AA, KK). This deep a shove should have fold equity against TT and JJ, maybe even QQ.
I'm likely folding. I just think they're going to be suspicious due to the initial flat, and you're likely to get snapped off.
If you were heads up calling once might be standard, but with two players in there I'm jamming or folding. I would also be jamming if I had AA or KK.
I also agree the hand plays better as an initial 3-bet. I like the flat better at shorter stack depths where you can induce people to jam, or at least where you can jam over their 3-bet.
The stack size is pretty awkward. Your 4-bet sizing preflop was close to committing against player 1 but not quite committing especially with the deeper player. If I was going to flat the initial bet I would have preferred you 4-bet to a smaller size.With this hand as played on the flop I think I would look at it as a shove or fold spot. If you're shoving it's basically a bluff
I contemplated raising but it felt too deep to jam flop. I decided to call at the price offered and to fold to another bet unimproved.
I’m curious about what a solver would do. I think my range here is AA, KK & AK, V2’s range feels like mostly JJ, QQ, AK and sometimes KK and I block some of that…
V1 never has better than 77-JJ
It's hard to really run this spot through a solver with the multi way dynamic. Theoretically you could use HRC to solve for the pre flop ranges, but the results are going to be highly unrealistic as the solver has people flatting and overall playing facing aggression much tighter than people do in practice. Also with the deep stack multi way dynamic my computer might not even have enough memory to solve this spot.
Then you would need monker solver or something with multiway post flop capabilities. I don't have access to monker, but even with monker trying to solve for this spot ends up stacking too many assumptions on top of each other to the point that the results are practically meaningless.
Ex: What's your initial flatting range? What's V2's 3-bet range? What is V1 flatting the 3-bet with? What is your back-raising range? You get the picture. It's all so situational and dependent on the players and table dynamics.
The ranges you posted here seem reasonably realistic for real life.
I don't really like calling in your spot on the flop because I would expect you're basically never good and will usually end up having to fold turn if you don't hit one of your six outs. Even if you hit you could occasionally be up against a set.
I was also assuming your range is basically what you posted, AA, KK and AK. If you had AA or KK what would you do? I would assume jam or at least raise. So if I was in this spot I would either fold and concede the hand or raise and rep AA and KK. It's a strong move and I would expect it to work a lot as long as you don't have a maniacal image and as long as the other players aren't calling stations. The other question is whether they would really believe that you would flat AA or KK vs the initial raise when you're this deep. I don't know about that one.
