[WSOP.com Nevada] Unofficial thread

Fake news. There's absolutely nothing in T&C's about seat changes. I've looked. You're lying.

So wsop reached out to me about ideas for increasing cash game traffic on the site. I am compiling a list of things that I think would improve, but it is somewhat difficult to look at making cash games better for myself, while also helping the population.

My ideas so far:

games are ending earlier so late night happy hour

- serious incentives for table starters or short handed players

- achievable goals for one or two tablers that puts them in achievable tournaments (not 6,000 people qualify), maybe 100-500 hands to qualify

- bringing back cash drops

- rb not resetting monthly (I know they agree with this but there are problems)

Any and all ideas are appreciated, either post here or pm me. Be nice to get a mixed feedback of infrequent players and grinders.

Not a big fan of this one, at least for me being a cash player I have little to no interest in playing a tournament, I am sure I’m not alone. Prefer to keep the promotions separate.

My vote would be some type of daily leaderboard board.

Thank you, also if you don’t like my ideas that is helpful as well

I’m all for it if it brings more traffic, I could be wrong and maybe it makes some random mtt players jump in the cash streets for 500 hands.

Just for me personally I won’t be incentivized to play more if it means I have to play a tournament is all.

Personally I'm a big fan of leaderboards as well. The beast over at ACR is a great example of how well these leaderboards work.

One thing that does very well for the cash rooms in Vegas that might work well online too is an hours-based freeroll or cash bonus. This kind of promotion wouldn't punish the rec players for playing only one table, but also wouldn't hurt the 8-10 table grinders. I also think that rec players love bad beat jackpots, and those kinds of promotions don't hurt grinders too badly either.

What kind of incentives are you suggesting for short handed/table-starting? I like the idea of it, but I also think that it would need to be something that can't be exploited.

My only problem with them going back to annual rakeback is that the % was significantly less under the annual version than the current version. If we can get 38-40% rakeback or higher in the new annual version that would be better for sure. I know there are many players that I've talked to live who think that WSOP doesn't have rakeback anymore because of the low starting rakeback. They won't even bother to look into it because it seems so low.

Bettr can you break down how the beast leadership board is presented? I like the idea of leaderboards if it’s not simply dominated by who plays the highest stakes.

I will pass along the idea of hours based cash bonus

Short handed up in rb is my simplest idea, prob need to think more about it but 10% more rb playing 4 or less tables. Or some sort of bonus for starting tables?

Agreed about annual. They are quite generous with rb, but like you said, the current system doesn’t get the credit it deserves when on the first of the month you have nothing. This is a flaw they recognize I will say.

option to download hand histories through the client 24 hours after theyre played

It's a little difficult for me to explain. But I'll do my best and also post the link.
https://www.americascardroom.eu/promotions/the-beast/

Essentially, it's another form of rakeback, where a small amount gets taken out of each pot to pay for the leaderboard. There are several tiers that can be reached, with the highest paying $500/week. The tiers reset each week. As each landmark cash amount is hit, additional slots get added to each tier, with fewer being added to the top tiers and more being added to the lower tiers. Most high volume NL50/NL100 players on ACR hit the top tier with ease. On top of the prize money, you get a free satty ticket into their big weekly Sunday MTT.

If you like the hours idea, you could combine it with your happy hour during non-standard hours and do double hours during those times.

I think the extra rakeback in short handed games would be the way you would have to go about it for sure. Because otherwise people would just start games and then snap leave/restart games to exploit the promo.

I think downloadable hand histories would help grinder types for sure, but I know recs are extremely happy about the fact that there are no huds on WSOP. It would make it a lot easier for all of us to do hand review for sure though.

+1 don’t need a hud, but this is also nice to catch cheaters. Something like bovada does would be great where you can see all the whole cards 24 hrs later.

GG has daily leaderboards for each stake level i believe and a bad beat jackpot.
Some order ideas would be bomb pots, splash pots.
The site now is pretty great I feel like honestly, good rb, generous reloads, very soft games, but any improvement would be great.

It’s the client laggy yesterday if you open 6+ tables?

Regarding the suggestion,

- Competition similar to Coinpoker in either PLO or NLH. Highly unlikely they will do it but worth the request
- Get rid off monthly leveling
- Would love to have run it twice button
- Open the zoom table

Run it twice option more than anything.

Show me where it explicitly states you can't leave a table and come back in another seat. I've read the T&C's. There's absolutely nothing even hinting at this.

I don't believe your "trust me bro, "someone" told me so."

If they decided that it was something they didn't like, (perhaps because other players complained about it), then it would come under:

9. TERMINATION

9.1 WSOP reserves the right to terminate your access to the Site, in whole or in part, at any time, with or without notice, for any reason or no reason. WSOP is not liable for any consequences resulting from termination of access. Any violation of these Terms may result in access restrictions.

https://www.wsop.com/legal/terms-conditi...

Can you explain the coinpoker competition to me please?

Cool, you’re doing scumbag behavior on purpose. Don’t look for sympathy when something goes poorly for you.

Yet there's nothing inherently scummy or immmoral about changing a seat. Every poker room in the country gives out seat change buttons. You're simply leaving and rejoining a table. I'll make it a point to call myself and ask and I'm sure they won't tell me I can't do that.

If there's a certain reg I don't like on my left I have every right to move to another empty seat.

I know a lot of regs will disagree with this, but I think allowing people to play 8+ tables in cash games is just bad for the overall long term health of the cash game ecosystem. The only people playing that many tables are pros, nitty rakeback grinders, or bots, all of whom don't make for good/enjoyable games. I've probably played 100kish hands on this site, and I can count on one hand the number of fishy/rec players I've seen at more than 4 tables at 100nl-1knl. A huge huge reason that ignition/bovada maintained the biggest and softest US cash game player base for like a decade straight was their 4 table cap for cash games. Allowing mass tabling also further exaggerates the effects that RTA, bots, and collusion rings can have in cash games, and these things will unfortunately continue to become more prominent and sophisticated in the future. I don't know what the ideal number of tables would be, but I think 10 (which I believe is the current cap?) is just counterproductive to a healthy cash game ecosystem.

One thing that I believe ACR does which I really like is that while they allow you to see how many players are at a table in the lobby, you can't see who the actual players are unless you sit down at the table with your buy in and get dealt in. This makes it much harder to bumhunt in an overly-predatory way. If people disagree with this though, I'm open to hearing why.

I agree that while the current rakeback system is very generous and "fair", it presents a psychologically discouraging barrier to basically anyone who doesn't grind online full time but still likes to see their points/rank go up. Its not fun to see all your "progress" get reset on the 1st of the month.

I strongly disagree with adding zoom/fast fold formats. Look at what happened to these pools on other major sites. They are dead.

I also think adding ante tables in the NL games could be great. They discourage nitty play from the regs, and might bring in some rec players looking to try something slightly different.

I think the overall goal of online poker operators should be to move closer towards a "live poker experience". This will be the only way to keep online poker alive long term and minimize the impact of sophisticated cheating tools that will continually be developed by nefarious actors. The polar opposite of a poker site that allows a 20-tabling bot to use RTA and harvest tons of data with which to build MDA exploits upon is a poker site that only allows 1 table per player (think back to first few months of clubWPTGold, the softest poker site that has existed in the last decade or so), doesn't allow HUD's, and has a game structure that is harder to solve, or better yet, a game structure that constantly changes somehow (think bomb pots, cash drop pots, antes, standup/squid game etc.) which would surely make botting/consulting a solution database far less profitable.

I'm not saying now is the time to literally switch to a 1 table cap, but my point is that now is the time to start looking at the future of online poker from a different, more long-term focused perspective.

I think having a daily or weekly leaderboard could be fun, I believe the way GG does it is that its broken down by stake? So if you only play 200nl you are only competing for the 200nl leaderboard? This way seems to make the most sense to me, or else there'd basically be no point in even offering the leaderboard to anyone playing under like 100nl or so.

Thebigswoot- I agree with most of what you said and full transparency will pass on everything except your mass tabling take because it is a big part of my income. If there were multiple viable sites I would be more on board with maybe 6-8 max. Problem is that when it comes to lack of bots and rta wsop remains the only one I trust.

I also really like the leaderboard idea, and like I posted before: wsop knows they messed up with the reset of points monthly. I don’t think they can do anything till the end of the year.

Hope that comes across as honest as possible.

Yeah don't screw with multitabling. Hell no. I can see going down to 9 total as it fits a screen really well and is about the max for allowing one to concentrate fully.

I also don't want zoom tables. Fish don't like them.

And RUN IT TWICE!!! I seriously doubt they're capable of programming that.

Yeah I think many of the grinders would just move to ACR or app games if they got rid of multi-tabling. All of the adjustments that are made should be in the interest of improving the experience of both recs and grinders.

Don’t think that’s true, Atleast for me I am 12 tabling most of days but it’s spread out between multiple sites like clubwpt, I max out 4 and load the rest with apps/wsop. Not going to play way worse games on ACR if I can get 4 wsop games still.

Honestly it’s a really good idea to cap the number of tables, 4-6 would be ideal. As someone who loves to mass table I think it benefits the site overall if they did so.

It's a rake free cash game for 4 weeks. They track win/lost over that time-span and winner gets Rolex, 2nd and 3rd gets cash prize. I don't think WSOP will ever do that.. but might as well host some kind of event to bring more people in the game.

Reducing traffic and ability of regs to start tables would benefit no one. Imo I think 9 tables max is optimal for everyone.