Getting a chip count to pause the clock is absurd

This is why at the WPT the dealer consistently counts the bet in every hand before triggering the shot clock.

Misregs gonna misreg.

I can't believe there are people who still watch tournament poker

shot clocks are still way too long and most events don't even have them. sitting there stalling should not be rewarded at all. making good poker decisions are what should be rewarded in the end.
habitual tankers simply should be made an example of and banned from future events.

I’m pretty sure in the scenario you’ve described I’ve seen dealers just say “he has you covered”, and does not proceed with a meaningless chip count.

Ari Engel was doing a great job of tanking preflop two days ago on the stream on every single hand. Ugh.

This should be the norm. Dealers were constantly counting down 10 barrels of chips to verify the count to the player with one chip. It just shouldn't be a thing.

Good counter strategy by the covering stack is to announce a non-all in size larger than the short stack.

Yes, this is the way.

That is a good counter.

They should also ban stuff like going all in preflop for all but one chip (after a tank of course) and then tanking before finally calling when someone puts you all in.

If everyone was required to keep chips in stacks of 20 and dealer is competent tne counting takes hardly any time

Right, but the player with one chip asking for a count just shouldn't be allowed.

So then you go allin but for 2 chips. If they ban that, then it's 3 chips. Then they could ban going allin but for the last 10% of your stack. Now, when you bet something close to 90% of your stack, they have to count it all down and see if it has to become an allin instead. Sorry, but there is no rule to counter this that won't be more of a problem than what you perceive to be the original problem.

Universal shot clocks (I know tournaments like Main Event may simply be too big and unwieldy to implement this, at least on Day 1’s) and a dealer with a sac who can simply say “I’m not counting down his stack when he clearly has you covered by 1000-to-1”, would solve this.

Then you just ban people for these antics. People tanking non stop and creating a race to the bottom atmosphere sucking the fun out of the game for everyone should be punished and instead they're currently rewarded.

When the entire casino knows you're calling and you sit there with a dumb look on your face using a time bank hoping for a pay jump before flicking in the last chip that should be your last tournament at that venue.

You can say hey it's currently allowed in the rules which them but it's also a huge problem. There is no rule saying a poker room has to let anyone play.

Shot clocks as it are too long and most events don't even have them. People who do stuff like this are just headaches for both the players and those running the event and don't deserve the privilege of playing.

Are we banning NFL teams for abusing the 40 second clock as well?

Obviously tanking in poker tournaments has become a huge problem hence them adding shot clocks to some events but it still needs to be fine tuned a lot. " Tanking" isn't a huge problem in the nfl and the clock is applied the same way in all games. It's not close to the same thing as poker. Chasing off recs with race to the bottom antics is bad for the game overall.

The NBA didn't always have a shot clock but they realized teams playing keep away for minutes, a quarter or even a half isn't actually basketball and it's brutal to watch so they implemented one.
Baseball added a pitch clock a few years ago because pitchers were taking way too long to pitch and batters were taking way too long to get in the box. Until 20 or years ago years ago it wasn't an issue at all. Baseball issued warnings trying to speed things up but players largely ignored them so they put in an actual clock with penalties taking out dead time. This is no different in poker where 20 years ago people weren't strategically tanking so things like shot clocks weren't necessary.

The problem with poker is the logistics implementing clocks on all tables. And then you add in the fact that tanking sucks up ev, and people really don't have inventive to call clock on their tablemates from a purely EV perspective. Basically nobody actually likes this part of poker. It's miserable. Even a lot of people who do tank for pay jumps etc say they do so bc if they don't they're giving up ev. So when you're trying to clean up a problem, and a small number of customers are still trying to come up with new ways to exploit something you're trying to fix get rid of those people and make an example out of them.

Players are supposed to play at a reasonable pace. Getting dealt 83o utg looking around for 30 seconds before folding isn't reasonable. It's parasitic. As it is shot clocks and time banks are still way too long but they're a start. The next step should be taking out some of the trash. Someone like Vogelsang long ago should have been told by wsop officials you either stop tanking non stop or you're done. You shouldn't get to ruin the experience of hundreds of other players the way he does.

If you're running a business- any business- and you're trying to fix a problem why would you keep customers who are trying to figure out how to make that problem even worse? So yea when some nerd figures out hey if I go all in for 99 percent of my chips I can waste even more time tanking before calling off the last 1 percent warn them and then ban them. It's simple.

Seriously, its a problem because these dickheads figured omg im losing equity every tournament with not tanking in this spot and then it spreads like a virus. Because as Borg mentioned, if one does it another sees it then they do it and so forth.

We're here to play a game, for fun. If youre here to make a living, great but do it within the confines of the spirit of the law.

Like you said just boot one and say if we see anymore excessive tanking "to gain an edge" then you go too.
Thats the key, tanking was fine occasionally because you had a legit decision for your stack. Not to gain and edge

I'm not in favor of stalling. I didn't use a single time card while at the Atlantis recently. But, I am in favor of holding back 1 chip if it is a smart strategy to do so. NOT to use up more time, but for several other reasons that make a lot of sense. But if I hold back 1 chip and you raise me, I don't count down my time banks before calling. I just call it off right away. However, if there is a pay jump coming, and you want to use your time banks, I'm OK with that.

Holding one chip back to try and stay in the tournament if called and you lose is totally different than doing it to waste more time tanking when put all in prelfop.

Kudos to you for playing at a reasonable pace.

If a player has time banks he can use them however he chooses. If it’s not a time bank tournament then any player at the table can call clock after reasonable time.

Seems to me most of the bitching is not from players, but from 2+2ers here who are frustrated trying to enjoyably watch live-streamed tournaments.

It was interesting at Bahamas they didn't allow a player to use time banks to stall.

It's so odd that tourney poker tolerates everything from ruining the experience of recs to outright cheating.

Winning players are bad for the casino and the eco system. Any other part of the casino will ban you for being a winning player.

Poker is a little different because all the losers cling to the fantasy of being pros and some pros are celebrities.

Still, removing $ from the system should be a privilege. Banning a winning player benefits recs, the casino and even the other pros. You'd think they would look for any excuse, but it is nearly impossible to get banned if you try.