If you lived in Minneapolis, and an ICE agent demand ID.....
......would you comply. (You have broken no law. You're just walking into the grocery store.)
Why or Why not?
Exactly. As much as this sentiment seems to piss people off, especially when Victor says it, the political parties in this country truly are just different wings of the same bird.
Serious question, are you basing the claim that the border policies are equivalent based on one cherry picked stat or do you actually have some backup to this? Because I guarantee the sentiment on the ground is not that their border policies are equivalent. Especially when it comes to refugees.
Biden deported about 30% more people than Trump's first term and arrested as many as 2.4 million people at the border in a year. How dumb does someone have to be to call that "open borders".
I do not recall masked, armed thugs disappearing people off of the street, or blatant violations of Constitutional rights during any of those Biden-era deportations
Yet that's all we seem to see now. Even JoeRogan is questioning the methodology of all this.
It's almost as if who is in charge, and their character or lack thereof, matters.
I do not recall masked, armed thugs disappearing people off of the street, or blatant violations of Constitutional rights during any of those Biden-era deportations
Yet that's all we seem to see now. Even JoeRogan is questioning the methodology of all this.
It's almost as if who is in charge, and their character or lack thereof, matters.
right, libs are fine with mass deportations that cause irreparable harm to millions so long as they dont see it. they support the Dems bc they believe that they can cause mass suffering more efficiently.
Exactly. As much as this sentiment seems to piss people off, especially when Victor says it, the political parties in this country truly are just different wings of the same bird.
There's plenty of difference on immigration (as I'm sure you agree). I'm just saying it's absurd to say Biden's policy was open borders.
I hate to give the racist xenophobic idiots any satisfaction but Trump's policies have ended immigration. Arrests are down at the border because the reign of terror has made the USA undesirable. 1.9 million people "self-deported" in 2025. Net migration was negative for the first time in 50 years. And, of course, the people leaving and not coming are the people who don't want trouble, not the gang members of the reactionaries' imaginations.
Im not saying that the liberals explicitly support causing mass suffering. they just obv view it as a necessary part of the system. and they believe that Dems are better at managing it.
Fair enough. I think libs just assume their leaders are well meaning experts who tell the truth. They blindly trust what they are told and derisively dismiss all critics as "not serious people".
thats definitely true as well.
but people such as Gorg and the UPers would not agree with this part. or at least they claim they dont.
I think libs just assume their leaders are well meaning experts who tell the truth
They subscribe to the our piece of **** is better than your piece of **** ideology, and fail to realize they're comparing two pieces of ****.
There's plenty of difference on immigration (as I'm sure you agree). I'm just saying it's absurd to say Biden's policy was open borders.
There is plenty of difference, but it’s still less than people think it is. Both parties seem to hold certain moral identities that don’t actually cohere with reality.
right, libs are fine with mass deportations that cause irreparable harm to millions so long as they dont see it. they support the Dems bc they believe that they can cause mass suffering more efficiently.
When people talk about mass deportations, they’re not talking about the regular procedure of removing someone as they are entering the country illegally, but rather a mass removal of people who are on the interior of the country. There was no mass deportation of the latter sense under Joe Biden.
There is plenty of difference, but it’s still less than people think it is. Both parties seem to hold certain moral identities that don’t actually cohere with reality.
The difference between Dumbocrats and Non-Trump Republicans can be very small or nothing. Trump is a different idiot. But, Dumbocrats repeating forever things like "no person is illegal" while tens of millions of people were living in the USA and working hard and paying taxes and they are just left to not be citizens? The best any Democrat can muster is DACA? Reagan gave amnesty to 6 times as many people as DACA...oh, wait, DACA wasn't even amnesty...didn't grant legal status like the Reagan Amnesty did.
Anyway, they left millions of people vulnerable to the current Gestapo.
When people talk about mass deportations, they’re not talking about the regular procedure of removing someone as they are entering the country illegally, but rather a mass removal of people who are on the interior of the country. There was no mass deportation of the latter sense under Joe Biden.
I will continue to both sides this because, despite differences, both sides are awful.
There were 150k interior removals under Biden. That's not quite on the scale we are seeing now...and it certainly wasn't the reign of terror and wild disregard for everyone's civil rights that is driving people to leave under this fascist, but you could still very accurately call it mass deportation.
also, we dont get to this stage without Biden (and Obama) supporting mass deportation. Biden gave record funding to ICE every single year. he gave tons to creating new detention centers. Trump's deportation czar was Obama's architect of the family separation policy who earned a medal from Obama.
for 12 of the last 16 years the Dems were in charge. they didnt see this coming? no, they set the table for it.
right now the Dems are talking about demanding more training for ICE. they arent talking about #AbolishICE and prosecuting the thugs. what do you guys think "more training" means? it means the Dems are going to give a ton of money to ICE so they can supposedly train better.
I know there is no way to reach Dem stalwarts like Gorg, or conservative Dems like checkrais, but for the rest of you guys, to quote a famous move: if the rule you followed got you to this...?
The difference between Dumbocrats and Non-Trump Republicans can be very small or nothing. Trump is a different idiot. But, Dumbocrats repeating forever things like "no person is illegal" while tens of millions of people were living in the USA and working hard and paying taxes and they are just left to not be citizens? The best any Democrat can muster is DACA? Reagan gave am
also, we dont get to this stage without Biden (and Obama) supporting mass deportation. Biden gave record funding to ICE every single year. he gave tons to creating new detention centers. Trump's deportation czar was Obama's architect of the family separation policy who earned a medal from Obama.for 12 of the last 16 years the Dems were in charge. they didnt see this coming?
Right. When you give monsters money and say it's for humanitarian aid and then they spend it on dirtbikes - that's on you. And lying and in on it or incredibly stupid? I don't think they're that stupid.
The difference between Dumbocrats and Non-Trump Republicans can be very small or nothing. Trump is a different idiot. But, Dumbocrats repeating forever things like "no person is illegal" while tens of millions of people were living in the USA and working hard and paying taxes and they are just left to not be citizens? The best any Democrat can muster is DACA? Reagan gave am
yeah the dems position on immigration was a republican border bill that they agreed to mostly as a bluff, to prove they were "serious", because they felt like they were getting hurt on the issue:
Last year, Joe and I brought together Democrats and conservative Republicans to write the strongest border bill in decades. The Border Patrol endorsed it.
But Donald Trump believes a border deal would hurt his campaign. So he ordered his allies in Congress to kill the deal. Well, I refuse to play politics with our security.
Here is my pledge to you: As President, I will bring back the bipartisan border security bill that he killed. And I will sign it into law.
they were free to bluff because they knew orangeman would reject it no matter what, but this is the extent of their imagination and "compassion". in their wildest dreams where they crushed the election and could do whatever they wanted, they'd pass a republican border bill that was essentially a political stunt.
damn i wonder why the party has like a 10% approval rate ..... it's the children who are wrong
I will continue to both sides this because, despite differences, both sides are awful.There were 150k interior removals under Biden. That's not quite on the scale we are seeing now...and it certainly wasn't the reign of terror and wild disregard for everyone's civil rights that is driving people to leave under this fascist, but you could still very accurately call it mass depo
I just don’t think there’s much of a reason to think that every single person that comes into the country has some kind of right to be here. As long as they are given due process, what exactly is the issue with deporting someone intrinsically? It’s a practice that all countries do for good reason.
As someone coming from another part of the globe where showing ID for way more mundane things than that, like boarding a plane, a bus, to vote, when checking in into an hotel, buying some big ticket item in a store etc, I do not necessarily understand why having to show your ID, and carrying it with you all the time, is a problem. Other than cultural differences really. I find
I had to show an ID to board an AMTRAK train.
I just don’t think there’s much of a reason to think that every single person that comes into the country has some kind of right to be here. As long as they are given due process, what exactly is the issue with deporting someone intrinsically? It’s a practice that all countries do for good reason.
What gives you the right to be wherever you are?
I guess I want to avoid getting into some back and forth, but man, if you think some ancestor of yours killing the people who were here and taking it gives you more right than anyone else....you suck.
And if your ancestors got here on a boat looking for a better life and you think that gives you a right that someone else looking for that same thing doesn't have? You also suck.
