GOAT NBA Discussion: Biggest fraud poster: fallguy. Super AIDS Containment thread

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For a good laugh, watch to the end:

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I guarantee that Jordan wins 6 titles if Paxson is upgraded to Kenny Smith, and Pippen is replaced with this guy:

Horry agrees with me:

"I would lock up sorry-ass Pippen"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZpVlMVY...

And let's not pretend that Horry isn't capable of exceeding Pippen's peak production capability:

FINALS

95' Horry...... 19.0 gamescore... 18/10/4/3/2 on 57 TS

92' Pippen.... 18.1 gamescore.... 21/8/7/2/1 on 56 TS
91' Pippen.... 17.5 gamescore.... 21/9/7/2/1 on 53 TS
93' Pippen.... 15.6 gamescore.... 20/9/8/2/1 on 46 TS
97' Pippen.... 15.1 gamescore.... 20/8/3/2/2 on 54 TS
96' Pippen.... 13.4 gamescore.... 16/7/5/2/1 on 43 TS
98' Pippen.... 13.0 gamescore.... 16/8/5/2/1 on 50 TS

2nd year Horry was the 2nd best player on the 94' title team, while 2nd year Pippen was a trashy bench player... And 3rd year Horry played better than Pippen ever did in the 95' Finals, while 3rd year Pippen had the migraine choke to cause loss in 1990.. Horry was a born clutch player with many historic shots, while Pippen was a career choke artist with zero historic shots.

Again, Jordan would easily win with Horry in place of Pippen, and Paxson/Grant upgraded to Kenny Smith/Otis Thorpe... Basically give Hakeem's cast to Jordan.

True winners relax.

which is probably why fallguy posts 24/7/365 about Jordan.

Yup, that's what they're supposed to do after accomplishing goat things like 72 wins and 3-0 lead, aka 72 wins and title

Setting the 72 wins was important.

Setting the 16-1 playoff run was not important.

Got it.

you dont win a title until you win the ****ing series
eventually an nba team WILL come back from down 0-3 in a series.

Never has anybody glazed harder for an athlete than Fallguy has for Jordan. Anytime he plays bad he was relaxing or it wasn't his fault somehow and anytime a teammate improves its entirely his developing etc. Its actually pretty epic to witness.

It is pretty funny though that you can't admit Rodman was amazing in that series vs the Sonics.

And Jordan wasn't that good (compared to his other Finals).

It's like he can't say that as it will break his AI program.

Do you guys remember when Matt looked up the Bulls winning percentage when Pippen scored 25 points alongside MJ, and they won like 98% of their games or something ridiculous like that.

It showed what MJ could do with scoring help and that he would've won easier with a sidekick that averaged 25 ppg

Again, it's called the "Mike Tyson-Buster Douglas Effect", aka foregone conclusion and human nature.. One rule about dominance is that it's never infinite or without letdowns.. MJ simply had the least letdowns ever because it took 72 wins and then 14-1 with 3-0 lead for him to letdown

I honestly couldn't disagree more - the 96' Bulls were pure perfection, so Jordan scored LIKE A ROLE PLAYER for the entire ECF and Finals because that's how great their chemistry had gotten.. No one needed to take over a possession or stop the ball, so opposing defenses were always shifting and getting worn down.. The Bulls had achieved perfect chemistry, and this was only possible because Jordan was great enough to carry his goat scoring burden as if he was any other role player on the team - no ball-domination.. And he only struggled to maintain this perfect standard towards the end of the Finals when he had the Buster douglas effect going a little bit (relaxed)

So you're saying Jordan should've played in a way that allowed somebody to score 25 alongside him more often?

Jordan never played bad - he was always the best player in every series, except for maybe his very first series against the Bucks in 85'.. Otherwise, he was the best player in every series and he never got "locked up" in a series like Lebron did in many series... So it's LEBRON that played "bad" in the 07' Finals, 08' ECSF, 11' Finals, 16' First Round, 14' ECF, 21' First Round, and many more.... Never Jordan.. Again, you guys are just projecting Lebron's bad play onto Jordan, but Jordan never played badly for a series like Lebron did many times.

So, Jordan should have tried to score less and they would have been better.

Good point.

Pippen's historically-bad efficiency ruins your point (he couldn't handle additional load), and also his 94 season of only 22 ppg shows that he was playing to capacity alongside MJ.

For example, Pippen shot 34% in the 96' Finals and couldn't handle additional load... Similarly, his 96' and 98' runs showed that he had the worst shooting splits ever for a playoff run of 15 games and 35 MPG - this is out of all the playoff runs EVER with these parameters - no one ever shot worse than Pippen... Heck, the 93' Finals showed him at 46.9 TS, so he couldn't handle additional load and forced MJ to average 41... Both the Bulls/Suns averaged 106.7 ppg for the series, so every ounce of Jordan's 41 was needed, especially given Pippen's horrific efficiency (couldn't handle additional load).

So there are many ways to demonstrate that Jordan's teammates played to capacity, and therefore jordan's goat scoring was needed... Heck, the Bulls were among a few teams in the league that lacked a 3rd scoring option... Many teams and most contenders had 3rd and 4th scoring options, and also rim protection.

MJ was not better than Bird in 86. 26/10/9 on 53/67/91 splits. In a sweep. ****ing lol

I'd argue Pippen was, at worst, equal to MJ against the Heat in 96.

Shaq was obviously better in 95.

So you're saying Jordan craters his teammates? Pippen scored 22.8 per game on .434 shooting the one year he played the playoffs on the Bulls without Jordan. Those are basically Kobe Bryant numbers.

^^^ all of that is with the worst casts in the league and no help.

The instant he got a single all-star, he didn't lose 3 straight games for 9 years, while winning 2 three-peats, and producing the greatest teams of all-time.

In contrast to Jordan being unbeatable the instant he got a modicum of help, Lebron has a massively-losing record with 1 all-star, 2 all-stars, Finals teams, 1 or 2 seeds, and preseason favorites.. He has a losing record in all of these scenarios, while MJ was undefeated in all these scenarios (see previous post).. lol

86' 1st Round

Jordan.... 44/6/6 on 51%.... 30.6 gmsc
Bird........ 28/8/8 on 52%.... 25.1 gmsc

86' Bird disagreed with you and said that Jordan was "God in Basketball Shoes" and the best he's ever seen - Bird said this in 86' during and after the series.

And Pippen being "at best equal" means that Jordan was almost certainly better... Meanwhile, Shaq in 95' wasn't better due to 6 less ppg and lower gamescore.

He had a support crew so good they went 55-27 while he was playing baseball. So those Bulls losing Jordan were actually better than the pace the Celtics were on this year without Tatum. And even going 11-2 since Tatum came back they'll have to win 4 out of their last 5 games to beat the 94 bulls win total. That team was ready to contend for the title even without Jordan. They were stacked.

They had a better win percentage without Jordan for a full year than the current Lakers do in their 21 games this year without Lebron.

I obviously meant 87.

Oh, you don't remember when Jordan single-handedly lost Game 1, or went completely missing in Game 6 when they had the big lead?

Shaq was obviously better.

Unless you don't think winning is important.

Really? I get you guys like Lebron and want to argue he was better than jordan. I think it's nuts, but showing Lebron's accomlishments are fair to try and argue. But now you guys are claiming Jordan choked? And played bad in big games? This is absurd. Jordan never choked once that i ever saw. And someone will point out his first 6 years his team didn't win titles. That's on his team, not him. Just like we don't blame Lebron for his 1st stint with Cavs not winning any titles. Though his team was much better than jordan's teams. And Jordan's teams had to go thru some great teams back then.

But here's what i call choking. Not losing games, or missing a game winning chance to win once in awhile. Choking is not showing up(like not trying because he was upset vs boston, and not having the confidence to demand the ball and try and take over in games like vs Dirk) to give your team a chance to win the big games, and series. Lebron did this in games 6 and 7 vs Boston in his 1st stint with Cavs. Like a total no show in those games. Rumors were he was upset his mom was sleeping with his teammate. Whether she was, or not, you don't let your team down like that. Jordan wulda still gave it his all. Then another choke vs the Mavs and Dirk. The miami super team couldn't beat Dirk and a much less talented Mavs team. Lebron played poorly while Wade gave them a chance to win. Those are 2 glaring examples of a choke. This never happened to jordan like that. When has jordan slumped around the court and not tried? And when ddin't want he ask for the ball? Lebron even admitted it to us that he was having problems having a winning mindset. He went to talk to Tebow to learn his mindset of a winner. This is all documented, i'm not trying to be harsh. This all happened.

I will say this for Lebron. He was a choker in the 1st half of his career. I think he broke out of it as he matured some. He still was never a clutch winner like Jordan, but the Lebron choker label i think he erased. In fact he performed somewhat well. He also became a much better shooter as he got older. But again this isn't near Jordan. Lebron has had an excellent career. It's just when you put it up vs Jordan it falls short. So does everyone else that ever played the game. Except maybe Jokic now. Lebron is overrated imo. He was a top player and possibly top 10, some could argue top 5. But he's not 1. There's only 1 MJ the original goat! And maybe still goat.