1/2: Small cbets are getting me in trouble
1/2, $500 eff
V is a hyper nit who makes questionable plays sometimes but mostly just a nit.. he bet folded bottom two (7
here is his flop strat if i lock oop to cbet range and only 3b the flop with overpairs
What's his strat look like when OOP doesn't 3B over-pairs on the flop? What is OOP supposed to do on turn with A9dd if he flat calls the IP flop raise with his over-pairs?
Maybe it's terrible, but my original thinking was that OOP doesn't have many, if any 3B's on the flop. And so when IP barrels turn, OOP continues with his good TP or better, and mostly just folds his draws.
Maybe making 2nd pair on the turn helps, and OOP should continue with A9dd. Looking at the situation with the read that V is supposed to be tight, I'd think 2nd pair isn't ahead, and OOP still needs to improve significantly.
But then the questions are whether top 2P, the nut flush or 9's full are going to be good on the river, and whether or not IP will pay off a big bet with a worse hand, when every river that improves A9dd does so in an obvious way? It's even more obvious if OOP donk leads river.
What if OOP doesn't improve? Is he supposed to check call river?
If we think IP has bluffs in this line, I can see how OOP should never fold turn. I just don't see many low stakes players finding multi-street bluffs IP here.
What's his strat look like when OOP doesn't 3B over-pairs on the flop? What is OOP supposed to do on turn with A9dd if he flat calls the IP flop raise with his over-pairs?Maybe it's terrible, but my original thinking was that OOP doesn't have many, if any 3B's on the flop. And so when IP barrels turn, OOP continues with his good TP or better, and mostly just folds his draws. Ma
i dont really understand what you're talking about with a 2 outer. i would fold this hand if ip bets the river.
i dont really care about op's reads as they seem to be designed to protect his ego as opposed to give insight into how to adjust. but it really doesn't matter there's probably no one in the world you should fold this hand to more or less a minraise otf or half pot ott. if you knew he had medium stregnth hands that are in a very difficult spot vs aggression you should either 3bet the flop or raise the turn
i dont really understand what you're talking about with a 2 outer. i would fold this hand if ip bets the river.
I was responding in part to your prior post (quoted below, with bolded / underlined text on what I took as the salient point you were making), since your screenshot seemed logically connected.
i cant think of a non condescending way to say this. if you sign up for a strategy forum and post here regularly and are advocating to fold the flop or turn in this hand you should find a new hobby. am confused how the history hand makes villain a hyper nitthe thread mostly just seems like results oriented slop while making sure to insult your opponent to make u feel better abo
i dont really care about op's reads as they seem to be designed to protect his ego as opposed to give insight into how to adjust. but it really doesn't matter there's probably no one in the world you should fold this hand to more or less a minraise otf or half pot ott. if you knew he had medium stregnth hands that are in a very difficult spot vs aggression you should either 3b
That's fair, regarding OP's reads. We got the reveal in the first post, so we can disregard the nit label.
Here's what I was asking, as a response to your point (as I understood it) that V's flop raising frequency should go up if hero is range-betting but not 3B'ing enough when V raises:
What does V's strat look like if hero simply doesn't have any flop 3B'ing range (or, if that seems too extreme, what if hero doesn't 3B with his over-pairs)? Does V still raise a lot if we tell the solver that hero mostly just flat calls with his entire range, including hands that crush TP?
I was then saying that if hero doesn't 3B his over-pairs on the flop, hero is probably splitting his range on the turn, such that his OP's continue as a call, and his draws fold.
Further, even if we're supposed to continue on turn with A9dd at equilibrium, if we ignore the reveal and just go with the read that V is tight, I'd think an argument could be made that we ought to at least consider the possibility that even if we improve on a river A, 9, or diamond, our hand may still not be good.
Even if V isn't all that tight, it's hard to find his intuitive bluffs on the flop. Most low stakes players aren't raising with TP4K here.
Obviously, if hero calls turn, but doesn't improve, and V bets river, we can fold at that point. But you made the point that folding turn would be terrible. I was asking if it makes sense for us to over-fold the turn, even with A9dd, based on the action from prior streets. V is repping pretty strong here.
Yes, I realize that V only has 3 combos of JJ here, but he might also just have one of the three combos of AJ, or one of the two combos of A3. It seems like V could play all those combos this way. We're drawing pretty slim vs those hands, and we wouldn't seem to be getting the correct odds to try to hit an 11-outer on a paired board.
When we have A9dd, it's hard to find the combos V can have that raise flop and confidently barrel turn for value, or as a bluff, in a 3BP, when hero might conceivably have all the over-pairs.
I understand your point that hero can target V's medium-strength hands that will raise-fold flop if hero 3B's or bet-fold turn if hero x/r's. But it's 1/2. Very few players in that pool are going to raise this flop as V with medium-strength hands, and even fewer are going to turn A9dd into a bluff by 3b'ing flop or raising turn.
Those just aren't lines that the 1/2 population will find at any real frequency. At the low stakes, V's flop raise is basically just "finding out where I'm at", and his turn barrel seems like a polarization mistake, if hero is just flatting the flop raise with all his over-pairs.
