GOAT NBA Discussion: Biggest fraud poster: fallguy. Super AIDS Containment thread
You have Duncan and Shaq in your Top 10.
Explain the logic of why losing earlier in the playoffs is better? Do you think in 1995 it was better for MJ to lose to the Magic in the 2nd round, rather than making it to the Finals and losing to Hakeem?
Or losing to the Pistons was better than losing to the Lakers in the Finals.
It depends if the 2nd Round or conference finals loss is considered a big overachievement, such as 89' Jordan massively overachieving in the playoffs - this historic overachievement is considered superior to Jordan making the 93' Finals and losing for example - losing the 93' Finals would be a black mark (even though the bulls didn't have homecourt)... Finals teams are always more evenly matched than a 1 vs 8 seed, or high seed vs low seed.. And again, a player's performance on the championship level (highest level) is the most relevant information and nullifies anything they did prior.. Who cares if you kick ass in previous rounds if you're worst-ever on the championship level.. If you're analyzing 2 players, are you most interested in how they performed in earlier rounds where everyone does okay, or the highest level that separates the best from everyone else?
So i guess you mean that Duncan and Shaq didn't have jumpers? Well yeah, but they make the list becasue Duncan dominated the league and won a bunch of championships with much less talent than Lebron had. And i'm forgetful on Duncan's shooting some but i think he had a really good foul line range jumper? But again it's because he did everything else and dominated. Kinda like an
I'll repeat my question.
Explain the logic of why losing earlier in the playoffs is better? Do you think in 1995 it was better for MJ to lose to the Magic in the 2nd round, rather than making it to the Finals and losing to Hakeem?
Or losing to the Pistons was better than losing to the Lakers in the Finals.
It depends if the 2nd Round or conference finals loss is considered a big overachievement, such as 89' Jordan massively overachieving in the playoffs - this historic overachievement is considered superior to Jordan making the 93' Finals and losing for example - losing the 93' Finals would be a black mark (even though the bulls didn't have homecourt)... Finals teams are always m
I'll repeat my question. Do you think in 1995 it was better for MJ to lose to the Magic in the 2nd round, rather than making it to the Finals and losing to Hakeem?
Or losing to the Pistons was better than losing to the Lakers in the Finals.
Thanks for reminding us how embarrassing it was for MJ to be taken to 7 games in 1992 against a terrible Knicks team.
Image LeBron did this. FG would post it every 3 minutes.
Imagine if LeBron did this.
He did dumbass .. many times... Much worse than that
It's amazing that Jordan carried the worst playoff cast ever to 4th quarter leads in 4 of 6 games vs the best team ever.. It took the playoff record (goat caliber) to do it... So once again, you prove MJ is goat.
And Lebron did far worse than that, and in his prime .. It's been posted itt.. He had entire series where he didn't score at all in clutch-time.
Lebron is the only player in history that shot 35% with 6 TO's for an entire series
He did it twice
Then he had the goat choke in 2011
Or the goat meltdown in 2010
And he lost many times with help, while Jordan never did
You keep losing
Do you think in 1995 it was better for MJ to lose to the Magic in the 2nd round, rather than making it to the Finals and losing to Hakeem?
Do you think in 2010 it was better for Lebron to lose to the Celtics in the 2nd round, rather than making it to the Finals and losing to Kobe?
^^^ those are your words verbatim, except Lebron is substituted for Jordan... Lebron has more losses in every round than Jordan, and more lotteries...
Of course the championship level is what matters, and that's where Lebron's individual and team performance has reached the worst levels ever - no one has had worse individual or team performance on the championship level than Lebron - it's the level where he falls short - it's the level that exposes him
Finally, why would you praise someone that puts the top 3 players on the team to make the Finals?? Why would that be considered goat-caliber... How is that different from Jokic teaming up with SGA and KAT? And why would making the Finals with these guys be considered a goat achievement.
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CAREER
Jordan 1st Round....... Winning record
Jordan 2nd Round...... Winning record
Jordan Conf Finals...... Winning record
Jordan FINALS............. Winning record
Lebron 1st Round....... Winning record
Lebron 2nd Round...... Winning record
Lerbron Conf Finals..... Winning record
Lebron FINALS............. Worst record ever
^^^ it's clear that Lebron was exposed once he got to the highest level.
Accordingly, it's safe to say that Lebron can't compete on the championship level by virtue of a lottery record overall (worst-ever), while also having the worst-ever individual performance (goat choke) and worst-ever team performance (multiple record losses)... He's also 0 for 7 on game-winning or tying shots in the Finals (4-8 for the goat).
Btw, we know why Lebron's teams can't compete on the championship level - it's statistical fact that Lebron lowers everyone's assists and increases their assisted rate (turns everyone into spot-up shooter), and this simpleton brand can't compete with the superior ball movement and team assists of the Finals level.. Lebron's lowering of everyone's assists creates low assist teams and team assist deficits in every series loss of his career.
Lebron does not have the worst finals record ever. Jfc.
Are you seriously considering people who are 1-0 as having a better record? What about those that are 0-1? Or Elgin Baylor's famous 0-8?
I mean 4-6 is obviously better than 4-0. Brutal.
Lebron does not have the worst finals record ever. Jfc.
Are you seriously considering people who are 1-0 as having a better record? What about those that are 0-1? Or Elgin Baylor's famous 0-8?
Lebron's 22-33 record in the Finals represents the worst win percentage of anyone since 3-pointer basketball began in 1980.
He's been given super-teams and allowed to play with more coaches and good players than anyone in his era, yet he has a lottery record on the Finals level, along with worst-ever individual and team debacle, and inability to compete in the clutch (0 for 7 on game-winners or tyers).. He simply can't compete on the championship level, but you're right he's decent at the lower levels.
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After Game 1 of 91' Finals:
Lebron's 22-33 record in the Finals represents the worst win percentage of anyone since 3-pointer basketball began in 1980.
I mean there are players who literally got swept in the only NBA finals they ever played, and I'm pretty sure AI finished 1-4 in his only finals, but even ignoring that you probably consider someone going 3-4 better than someone going 22-33.
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Notice how Pat Riley doesn't mention Pippen:
1997
For today's championship, Riley picked the Bulls to win. ``I don't think anybody's going to win again until Michael retires,'' he said.
``Sometimes you can build a great team and you'll never win a championship because you had the misfortune of being born the same time Jordan went through his run.''
https://scholar.lib.vt.edu/VA-news/VA-Pi...
Again, no one thought about Pippen, and no one thought of them as a "duo" until decades later when new media started creating new narratives
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I mean there are players who literally got swept in the only NBA finals they ever played, and I'm pretty sure AI finished 1-4 in his only finals, but even ignoring that you probably consider someone going 3-4 better than someone going 22-33.
Generally speaking, someone that's 3-4 in the Finals (1 Finals appearance) wouldn't be comparable to someone that's 22-33 (10 Finals appearances).
But when we compare apples to apples, guys that have winning records over a large sample sizes (Kobe, MJ, Curry, Duncan) can be favorably compared to a loser like Lebron.
But lets revisit the 3-4 guy for a minute... He actually compares favorably to Lebron if we only include Lebron's 0-4 in 2007 and disqualify all of his Finals once he colluded to form super-teams - it was never fair for everyone in the league to have "normal" rosters of 1 franchise player, while Lebron forms "super-teams" of 3 franchise players (big 3's).. This was the case from 11' to 16' when Lebron hand-picked 6 straight preseason favorites before KD finally responded in 17'.
He did dumbass .. many times... Much worse than that It's amazing that Jordan carried the worst playoff cast ever to 4th quarter leads in 4 of 6 games vs the best team ever.. It took the playoff record (goat caliber) to do it... So once again, you prove MJ is goat.And Lebron did far worse than that, and in his prime .. It's been posted itt.. He had entire series where he didn't
Jordan leads a team to a lead and then loses... GOAT
LeBron leads a team to a lead and then loses... Meltdown.
Got it.
Anyway I think I'm done on any discussion for a while. Just posting random stuff.
I like how you gloss over the Bulls having basically 0 missed games as a team over 6 finals runs like that isn't ungodly luck.
that's some LeBron vs Dallas level choking right there.
Jokic, Wemby, Sga, and Luka only guys currently have a chance to take Jordan's crown. They will all fall short probably, but they got their chance. Maybe Wemby if he stays healthy, and improves on his 3 pointer, has the best shot. And wins at least 6 titles!
Wemby's body holds up for 10 years he's the GOAT defensive player, not really all that close. Idk if his offense will get there but he has a strong shot at the best 3-5 yr peak.
Wemby's body holds up for 10 years he's the GOAT defensive player, not really all that close. Idk if his offense will get there but he has a strong shot at the best 3-5 yr peak.
Yeah if he stays healthy, knock on wood, goat defensive player for sure. His offense is pretty darn good too. I don't think he's reached his prime yet. Meaning he can improve his offense and be a serious contender for goat if he starts to perfect his offensive skills. Maybe putting some weight on and hitting the gym too could make him even more formidable.
