Patrick Leonard stating the hard truth "you cannot longer make it in online poker"
Patrick leonard, one of the best online mtt players sayed a couple of day ago this reality, literally stated on the podcast Solve for why "I would say the previus years to anyone that put the effort and study to get better at poker and try to make a living, that is possible to do it" this year i think is really impossible to anyone to do it, maybe the 0.01% that runs hot would make it" and stating afterwards that he cant understand anyone not cheating with rta or using bots online if they want to make money
gotta admire the honesty from this guy, stating the truth being a pro online player for many years, being sponsored by poker sites and selling courses to improve at mtts, you can tell he truly loves the game
sucks
I haven't watched the vid (as I'm trying to not watch as much 'content' as in the past) but I think it's an interesting debate
Look @ full tilt poker. They had what appeared to be a healthy ecosystem that was created and sustained from an influx of $ from inside the company
If you look @ any official poker site today there's v little action. My theory is because there is no $ being put in.
You get a game when all the players have $ and think they are a favourite.
Now either the players don't have $ or clearly they know they're not a favourite in the game. If you're rational why would you choose to gamble if you know you're getting the worst of it?
Disagree, but then I'm more up than down. Wasn't for many years though
I haven't watched the vid (as I'm trying to not watch as much 'content' as in the past) but I think it's an interesting debate
Look @ full tilt poker. They had what appeared to be a healthy ecosystem that was created and sustained from an influx of $ from inside the company
If you look @ any official poker site today there's v little action. My theory is because there is no $ being put in.
You get a game when all the players have $ and think they are a favourite.
Now either the players don't have $
Really FTP basically just stole customer funds and disbersed to the top FTP pros in unlimited loans they never had to pay back. Then those pros got to go around playing in the biggest games and tourneys basically just freerolling. Probably a lot easier to play the game if you have a money tree that just replenishes your bank roll. Turns out a lot of those players weren't geniuses but rather beneficiaries of a scam. Who woulda guessed.
I haven't watched the vid (as I'm trying to not watch as much 'content' as in the past) but I think it's an interesting debate
Look @ full tilt poker. They had what appeared to be a healthy ecosystem that was created and sustained from an influx of $ from inside the company
If you look @ any official poker site today there's v little action. My theory is because there is no $ being put in.
You get a game when all the players have $ and think they are a favourite.
Now either the players don't have $
What point is there in having a theory when there are facts? In the times FTP was active most poker sites had a lot of action because they were offering poker in tons of countries. Now countries are segregated and some countries even have segregated provinces.
As for Pads. Not surprised that's his response considering his defense of Nacho.
What point is there in having a theory when there are facts? In the times FTP was active most poker sites had a lot of action because they were offering poker in tons of countries. Now countries are segregated and some countries even have segregated provinces.
As for Pads. Not surprised that's his response considering his defense of Nacho.
Could you please remind the OP what he defended Nacho for?
all I know is that im an absolute monster at 10nl but I always have to humble myself with a minimum of a half pint of vodka to play. is this sustainable?
What point is there in having a theory when there are facts? In the times FTP was active most poker sites had a lot of action because they were offering poker in tons of countries. Now countries are segregated and some countries even have segregated provinces.
As for Pads. Not surprised that's his response considering his defense of Nacho.
It also wasnt the mature market it is now, it was a lot harder to improve back then ,you weren't dealing with rta and things of that nature like you are today. Legalize it all tomorrow and it's still going to be a cess pool that's only going to get worse as AI gets better.
yeah if you want to easily clear 75k+ a year its def harder
but for a side profit or side hustle, its still doable. DN every year when he has to join a smaller wsop tourney says how crazy good the EV is for those things. he says those 800$ buyins or lower are really valuable
It also wasnt the mature market it is now, [b]it was a lot harder to improve back then[b] ,you weren't dealing with rta and things of that nature like you are today. Legalize it all tomorrow and it's still going to be a cess pool that's only going to get worse as AI gets better.
It was a lot easier to get better than the opposition then, because even the best opposition sucked runny eggs.
yeah if you want to easily clear 75k+ a year its def harder
but for a side profit or side hustle, its still doable. DN every year when he has to join a smaller wsop tourney says how crazy good the EV is for those things. he says those 800$ buyins or lower are really valuable
"Online poker is unbeatable." "Not true! Live poker is super-soft."
thats fair
I did see polk and other big name pros do a bankroll challenge within the last 3 yers and they easily moved upo stakes
I think online is stil beatable up to 1 NL ?? again not for aliving but side hustle
speaking as an expert, i can confidently state:
Spoiler
there's no money in online poker, everyone's solid.
also, some of the stuff pads says is quite silly and displays a lack of clear quantitative thinking.
e.g. the when he says that if reg A has 2% ROI and reg B is TWICE as good, then reg B still only has 4% ROI.
wtf does that mean?
Is he assuming zero rake? Otherwise, given around 10% rake, reg B with twice the edge will have more like 10-15% ROI...
Or is he just sharing the amazing fact that 2 times 2 equals 4?
thats fair
I did see polk and other big name pros do a bankroll challenge within the last 3 yers and they easily moved upo stakes
I think online is stil beatable up to 1 NL ?? again not for aliving but side hustle
Polk being able to do something has nothing to do with what 99 percent of players can do.
Jfc the online paranoia is crazy. People legit think 25nl is unbeatable...
speaking as an expert, i can confidently state:
Spoiler
there's no money in online poker, everyone's solid.
also, some of the stuff pads says is quite silly and displays a lack of clear quantitative thinking.
e.g. the when he says that if reg A has 2% ROI and reg B is TWICE as good, then reg B still only has 4% ROI.
wtf does that mean?
Is he assuming zero rake? Otherwise, given around 10% rake, reg B with twice the edge will have more like 10-15% ROI...
Or is he just sharing the amazing fact that 2 times 2 eq
I watched the whole podcast and i think is without roi, he was refering to mtts. he sayed that years before the top top mtt players, lets say top 5 of the world would have 40% roi, and the good players will have like 15% roi, still a good amount. This days the top 5 players will have llike 4% roi, and the very good players will have like 3% roi, so he is basically saying they are playing a game for very little amounts of roi, and basically there is no much difference in the amount of money a top 5 player will make compared to other players. 0 sum game
Complete bullshit (unless he means NLHE MTTs specifically - haven't played one of those in a decade, so I wouldn't know) . But please, do spread it as gospel so the games become softer.
Pack it up, boys!
The general approach that used to work: Be diciplined and study a lot, play 30 - 35 hours/week at 200NL or at midstakes MTTs / SNGs and clear 75 - 150k anually. You could make a decent living doing this in a western country. I think what he means is more similar to this and it being not possible anymore no matter how hard you study. And I would agree with him on that.
Nobody claims that you cant make 25k / year taking money from ret.ards at 25NL or playing lowstakes MTTs but this simply wont cut it if you live in western europe or the US.
2015 called and wants its story back
It's always going to be beatable
is it worth it is a different discussion. I don't think so these days.
I think making 75-100k on average will always be possible to a decent/good player, but for most that won't pay the bills if you're supporting a family. It's also just a job that's highly labor intensive, has no scalability, and requires sometimes large sums of money to fund. Not really a great business model but if your in your 20s traveling the world or a retiree looking for a side income it works.
