Israel/Palestine thread
Think this merits its own thread...
Discuss my fellow 2+2ers..
AM YISRAEL CHAI.
[QUOTE=Crossnerd]
Or the more simple explanation is that you’re reaching for the most salacious comparisons you can without actually caring about accuracy.
No, this is a mistaken view. They also targeted what they called a military base, the British HQ at the King David Hotel, though it was an admin base and most people present in the building were civilian. It was hardly unprecedented, given the Nazis' recent excesses and the Red Army's revenge, and in any case the crimes of Oct 7 were of not dissimilar character, albeit a one-of
By the point you are talking about Britain was focused on doing PR with the Arabs (who were actively supporting the genocide of Jews) to get access to oil fields, and was actively blocking Jewish immigration to Israel, even while genocides against Jews we’re taking place through Europe.
At that point Jews/Zionists considering Britain a hostile actor against them was an arguably valid viewpoint.
A British military officer literally trained and led the Arab Legion who tried to genocide the Jews in 1948.
Hamas targeted military bases. the early Zionist terrorist gangs explicitly targeted civilians. in fact, they planed for years to displace the entire population and to do so they used some of the most heinous methods in history. even if Hamas exclusively targeted civilians, the wouldnt come close to the intentional destruction wrought on the innocent native population by the
Ok I understand that Hamas has targeted IDF military targets ….its also true some of their members are motivated by radicalism and violent ideologies hence kidnapping random civilians.
Hamas today also lacks the military capability that Israel has. I know that the civilian to military death ratio is way way worse on the Israeli side. Even in the modern era.
But it’s true that the early Zionist militants and Hamas militant both targeted civilians. It’s simply a fact.
I’m also well aware of the fact that IDF spokes people lie all the time. Like how they say, they are the most humane military in the world.
Here is the issue with Hamas and this is something you should certainly question yourself. There’s no doubt that many of their members are people who are perhaps motivated by a number of things whether it is Palestinian resistance, Islamic radicalism there’s a number of motivations there. The real question is who are their current leaders and where are they getting their money from? Is there a connection to Israeli politicians…it is a reasonable thing to ask considering that was unimaginable that Hamas was able to cross into Israel on October for the reasons mentioned 1000 times.
You should be asking yourself why the PLO isn’t the most popular military resistance now. As the PLO included Christian leaders and was quite secular compared to Hamas. Hamas is clearly something that many people in the west would not be motivated to admire or understand their resistance because of their radical right wing conservative religious ideology.
Also, you should really look into October 7. I know you think you have a response to it but more digging needs to be done here. W/e Israel’s military response was immediately on October 7 It’s clear that Hamas had way too much time considering the amount of hostages they took back into Gaza. That simply doesn’t make any sense, considering the military capability of Israel with their drone technology, attack helicopters, and the fact that most of their military aged men and even women are in the military or carrying military weapons or able to access military weapons.
'Early' is wrong, because that implies the 1890s and 1900s, but the Zionist terrorists of the 1940s were obviously quite similar to Hamas.
Yes that’s the time I’m referring to. I could’ve been more specific but tbf the link I provided does mention the 1940s.
Also we can’t forget about the Zionist operation to Assassinate Folke Bernodotte
lol Hamas deliberately goes for civilians. Victor is mentally ill.
Unless you’re really ******ed enough to think the Nova music festival and some Kibutzes are IDF targets.
You should be asking yourself why the PLO isn’t the most popular military resistance now. As the PLO included Christian leaders and was quite secular compared to Hamas.
the PLO is not a military resistance. they are collaborators with the Israeli regime. thats why they arent popular.
as for your questions about the Israeli connections to Oct 7th and funding Hamas, I am aware of it and while I think its possible, I still think its more likely false than not. like, I wouldnt be surprised if it was false flag, but I just dont believe it at this point.
furthermore, you make a lot of assumptions about Hamas and Palestinian resistance, military or otherwise. you can actually just read the words of Hamas and it would clear up a lot of your assumptions.
Collaborators with the Israeli regime = there’s some chance they may come to a pragmatic compromise instead of sacrificing every Gazan as a martyr. Victor is mentally ill and has never spoken to a Palestinian in his life.
there’s some chance they may come to a pragmatic compromise instead of sacrificing every Gazan as a martyr
astounding ignorance as the PLO has no authority in Gaza
There’s 2 million Palestinians living in Israel. You’d think having a collaborative relationship with neighboring countries might be beneficial. That’s unless you’re a mentally ill moron.
Doyle is like, yep, seems like a good idea to collaborate with these ghouls. what could go wrong?
Irrelevant comparisons aside, there’s also millions of Palestinians living in Jordan, who also shares a border with Israel and they aren’t being martyred.
Incidentally, Jordan is also a collaborator with Israel.
Jordan literally arrests people that advocate for Palestinian freedom.
Jordan literally arrests people that advocate for Palestinian freedom.
I don’t support that if they are arresting peaceful protesters but I don’t pretend that Jordan is a progressive state. I’m just saying the Palestinians living there aren’t being targeting and killed by the IDF.
How familiar are you with kids today? My 13 year old son has a smart phone and is well aware all the major tech companies have surveillance built in.to their apps. And That the govt probably has access to. Same thing with all his cousins and friends. I even tell them all not to download or use Tik Tok because they don’t want the Chinese govt spying on them, and none
I'm personally cool with the government spying on me. Maybe they'll learn something interesting.
Your mileage may vary.
I don’t support that if they are arresting peaceful protesters but I don’t pretend that Jordan is a progressive state. I’m just saying the Palestinians living there aren’t being targeting and killed by the IDF.
they will be at some point in time. the vision is Greater Israel and that includes Jordan. the point of Zionism is continuous expansion and extermination. Bibi spoke the other day about Greater Israel and despite me eating a ban for saying it, Israeli leaders want to take over much of Jordan Lebanon Egypt Syria and Saudi Arabia.
https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_e...
they will be at some point in time. the vision is Greater Israel and that includes Jordan. the point of Zionism is continuous expansion and extermination. Bibi spoke the other day about Greater Israel and despite me eating a ban for saying it, Israeli leaders want to take over much of Jordan Lebanon Egypt Syria and Saudi Arabia.
Doubtful, and in any case that just isn’t the present reality. If you guys can’t logic your way through this one, there’s no hope.
The best way to combat Bibi would be to stop playing right into his hand, something the Gazans seem unable to do.
the present reality is that Israel steals land in Palestine, Lebanon, and Syria almost every single day. and their leaders and citizens continually call for taking over more and more. you are the one ignoring reality. Jordan is on the agenda and they will get to it if they arent stopped.
what do you get as a citizen of the empire? well for one, you get to be the reserve currency of the world. That allows you to run massive trade deficits systematically, which means your people can consume more in aggregate than they can produce, year after year after year.That has been defined "exhorbitant privilege" in economics. A massive privilege only 1 country at a time wo
It also leads to the hollowing out of key industries within the country, as there is little incentive to produce globally competitive products if you can export freshly printed paper that has value.
The last globally competitive non-software industry in the US (that is manufactured in country) is weapons, so if you aren't in that industry, you aren't benefiting at all from an income generation perspective.
You have plenty of subsidized imported cars and cheap goods in Wal-Mart, though.
I'm saying adults probably don't want it. As for the kid argument, I am more curious what pro-Israel posters think about teaching young kids values like freedom and self-determination. Couldn't the US stop the 50%/70% anti-Israel sentiment in 18-49s if they simply taught them from a young age that America is a powerful country that gets what it wants, rather than all the high-m
Any thoughts on this, or is the pro-Israel crowd fine with hypocrisy ad infinitum?
It's funny, because I created this account to give a Gen-Z perspective and make the point that at the current rate Israel is guaranteed to get defunded, and got very stiff pushback for it. Now it seems everyone has accepted that there will be no way to continue the "special relationship" a generation from now.
My new question for pro-Israel posters is this: why not dig your heels into the slippery slope, oppose Netanyahu, and say it's a massive strategic mistake to give up on the guaranteed flow of unlimited ammo after you've created so many enemies?
Are we okay with a country that has shown a willingness to take extreme actions dramatically increasing their reliance on nuclear deterrence?
Any thoughts on this, or is the pro-Israel crowd fine with hypocrisy ad infinitum? It's funny, because I created this account to give a Gen-Z perspective and make the point that at the current rate Israel is guaranteed to get defunded, and got very stiff pushback for it. Now it seems everyone has accepted that there will be no way to continue the "special relationship" a genera
I am not sure what your question is nor what you think the hipocrisy is. If you clarify what you mean i can tell you what i teach my kids about Israel events.
