Ukraine-Russia War Take 2
Here is what the preliminary take on the Ukraine thread disappearing is:
The site was hit with a massive spam attack where hundreds of spam threads were created. In the case where, for example, I see a single spam thread and delete it, that is called a soft delete, and mods can still see them but forum members cannot. Those deletion can be undone.
When a massive attack hits with hundreds of threads, an admin uses a different procedure where the hundreds of spam threads are merged and then hard deleted, where the threads are gone, and no note is left behind. As I have mentioned with my own experience of just soft deleting a large number of posts, sometimes a post or thread gets checked or merged accidentally and is deleted by mistake. Dealing with hundreds of spam threads takes a sledgehammer, not a scalpel.
It appears that our Ukraine thread may have gotten caught up in that recent net of spam threads. If so, it is likely gone for good. I cant say this for sure, and am awaiting comments from admins on this issue. Yes, this sucks. And hopefully there was some other software glitch that caused the disappearance, and we may recover it in the future.
But in the meantime, I have created this new Ukraine-Russia War thread to enable the conversation to continue. Obviously continuity with earlier discussions will be lost. There is no way around that. So as best as possible, let's pick up the conversation with recent events and go from there.
If you have any questions about this, please post them in the mod thread, not here. Let's keep this thread going with posts about the war, not the disappearance of the old thread.
Thanks.
He then went on to support Vivek who was even more hard on Ukraine than Trump is.
Agreed, unfortunately Russian propaganda is attempting to tie this to Ukraine and useful idiots are amplifying their message again.
It doesn't really matter if he was official working with the foreign legion he was helping them and they were accepting . well it just doesn't really matter period. as for vivek you can both be pro ukraine and vote for someone against Ukraine if you think hes the best choice for your country on overall policy's even if hes against one specific policy . He also donated and voted biden in 2020. peoples preferred candidate can change even if they are against one view. Pretty much every person ive voted for had policy's I thought were ******ed you dont get alot of choices in a two party system.
Also from what I seen he was not so much pro vivek as anti trump just asking for a vivik + that republican chick ballot. but he could have still voted for biden over them he just seems to hate trump so much that he didn't even want him on the ticket
But that seems likely he liked vivek
Did you read the tweets I just posted?
"Do less. Please."
"If you did nothing at all I'd be grateful"
"Honestly this all seems like a load of crap and fantasies. Unless someone is able to act like a professional we are pulling the plug."
They asked him to go away after realizing he is crazy. He wasn't helping them and they weren't accepting. His help was refused. This isn't some "nothing official occurred" semantics; nothing occurred. At the end he even threatens the end of Ukraine.
The point regarding Vivek is that Vivek is extremely anti-Ukraine. Anyone who is pro-Ukraine would not be hoping for Vivek to run in order to vote for him.
This dude hiding in the bushes to assassinate Trump had no significant ties to Ukraine. Anyone trying to fabricate ties is selling propaganda.
ya the one in the middle paints a different picture more recently in his views. I mean I dont care about the crazy part that was obvious. Not sure this anya person is the best source tho
Did you read the tweets I just posted?
"Do less. Please."
"If you did nothing at all I'd be grateful"
"Honestly this all seems like a load of crap and fantasies. Unless someone is able to act like a professional we are pulling the plug."
They asked him to go away after realizing he is crazy. He wasn't helping them and they weren't accepting. His help was refused. This isn't some "nothing official occurred" semantics; nothing occurred. At the end he even threatens the end of Ukraine.
The point rega
I am pro Ukraine but Vivek is so good overall I would be happy if he was running instead of Trump.
I am not even sure Vivek would be worse for Ukraine than Trump.
Long but extremely good read:
guy who was on the executive board of gazprom and rosneft is pro-putin you say?
i cant ****ing believe it
Weird that Ukraine hired a pro Putin guy as a negotiater.
Not sure what you believe happened, but Zelensky didn't hire schroder lol
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Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy lambasted controversial former German Chancellor Gerhard Schröder in a video address Wednesday night.
Zelenskyy said that “it is simply disgusting when former leaders of powerful states with European values work for Russia.”
Though he didn’t mention the former chancellor by name, Zelenskyy was reacting to comments Schröder had made in an interview published Wednesday, calling for negotiations with Russian President Vladimir Putin.
Not sure what you believe happened, but Zelensky didn't hire schroder lol
/
Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy lambasted controversial former German Chancellor Gerhard Schröder in a video address Wednesday night.
Zelenskyy said that “it is simply disgusting when former leaders of powerful states with European values work for Russia.”
Though he didn’t mention the former chancellor by name, Zelenskyy was reacting to co
I literally posted the quote from the article.
So are we dropping the "The West didn't know enough" angle and we're back to "The West forced Zelenskyy to keep fighting" again?
FWIW in 2022 this guy had an argument on how sanctions weren't working so might as just drop them and we discussed how he's just a little bit biased.
Its obvious why they would have used a guy who got along with Putin while in office at a negotiation. but a former leader of a left leaning party of a major western country is not going to lie here its like Bill Clinton coming out and saying this. Anyway who cares if early negotiations feel apart even without US interference they were unlikely to have resolved the issues without testing the waters. But now they need to realize the meddling and make peace. both sides have some stupid sunk lose fallacy going on
So are we dropping the "The West didn't know enough" angle and we're back to "The West forced Zelenskyy to keep fighting" again?
FWIW in 2022 this guy had an argument on how sanctions weren't working so might as just drop them and we discussed how he's just a little bit biased.
we arent dropping that. Gerhard Schroeder who was supposedly a negotiator at the behest of Ukraine dropped that according to the article from Welt.
this is how wikipedia describes Welt.
ofc, that doesnt really mean anything and "flagship" newspapers and former bosses lie all the time.
but...its a datapoint...
Its obvious why they would have used a guy who got along with Putin while in office at a negotiation. but a former leader of a left leaning party of a major western country is not going to lie here its like Bill Clinton coming out and saying this. Anyway who cares if early negotiations feel apart even without US interference they were unlikely to have resolved the issues without testing the waters. But now they need to realize the meddling and make peace. both sides have some stupid sunk lose fa
I mean, I think the dude def could lie lol. he probably is lying about something at all times.
I'm confused. So at the same time The West wasn't doing enough in the peace negotiations, they were also masterminding the peace negotiations behind the scenes?
Its obvious why they would have used a guy who got along with Putin while in office at a negotiation. but a former leader of a left leaning party of a major western country is not going to lie here its like Bill Clinton coming out and saying this. Anyway who cares if early negotiations feel apart even without US interference they were unlikely to have resolved the issues without testing the waters. But now they need to realize the meddling and make peace. both sides have some stupid sunk lose fa
It's an attempt to justify violence by painting Ukrainians as warmongering nazis.
This is a far smaller explosion from last week's, but the driver is far closer to it.
Here is a very good read on peace talks and Ukraine's post war problems:
Long but extremely good read:
Great read. Thanks for posting.
The article does a good job of humanizing the struggle of "Ivan" and the other Russian soldiers & deserters. One can have empathy for the individuals fighting for Russia while being opposed to their invasion.
Glad to see that someone actually read it, I didn't think anyone would since it's so long. I agree with you 100%. I've always felt bad for the Russians forced into the war whether through the means mentioned in the article of through poverty/brainwashing. Morally the situation is extremely conflicting for me. It's easy to see why Ukrainians call all Russians orcs and claim they are all responsible, yet at the same time it's also quite clear that policies and propaganda from Putin are directly responsible for turning their soldiers into absolute monsters.
I feel like a lot of Russia are not actual forced in tho. certainly some are. its more like a form of vassalage because they get 20x pay then they would in their back water town. Like vietnam has cheap labor russia has cheap soldiers. are they deceived and tricked about what they are walking into? certainly but forced they are not
