2025 WSOP!!

It’s on topic for now. If it gets more overtly political, I say move the convo. But nothing wrong talking about how politics can impact WSOP turnout.

There is only one WSOP and poker players at degenerates. They will show up if they have the funds, politics notwithstanding. As for recs, they may be more likely to let politics change their plans. But there’s only one WSOP for them too. This isn’t like planning a vacation to the beach. It’s a unique destination.

Considering the significant minority foreign players make up, and these other factors, I really don’t think politics will play much of a role. The general economy will have a bigger effect. And at this point, other than fear of the unknown, I haven’t seen any concrete effects. Things may be different in 2 months though.

I don’t know how big part are Canadian players in whole picture.

But we were in Canada this year . You can feel anti American/Trump feelings. I don’t know if it’s going to affect Canadian poker players.( Pro or Recs )

Due to a significant drop in demand stemming from Trump's tariff war, airlines have reduced capacity and canceled routes between Canada and the U.S., with bookings down by over 70% and airlines cutting up to 3.5% of flights.

Out of 60 millions tourist to the US in 2023 , 20 millions were Canadians . I bet some of the poker players will boycott WSOP at least some rec players . Combined with some Euros from countries with travel advisory for the US we will see lower numbers this year .

I have no doubt that a significant portion of Canadian players will pass on the WSOP this year. I have read they represented 4 - 5% of the Main Event entries in 2024 (unconfirmed).
Couple that with some MSM stories of issues with Europeans having VISA and Entry issues and the aforementioned Tariff disputes it is likely those segments will be down in attendance.

But the real issue as it almost always is with Las Vegas is the American economy, Stock Market, and consumer confidence.

How the economics pan out will have the largest impact on the entry level. Since most trips aren't strictly spur of the moment what is occurring now will probably dampen people making plans to attend.

Only true DEGENS gamble money they "need" most players are regular REC's that make up the huge fields and they may feel the economic pinch and pass some events. Personally my wild ass guess is attendance is down up to 10% and be in the 2022 or 2023 levels.
The pro's will show so the field mix might be a little stronger than the last few years. Now if the economy tanks between now and then anything could happen.

Ha! Good angle!

Less Euro's and Canadians coming (your take) and you say the fields will be much tougher? Come on man.

People don’t go to the WSOP as tourists. They go to the WSOP to participate in a competition. It’s different.

Tourism during Covid cratered. Particularly from countries with severe restrictions, like Canada. But live poker flourished, to the degree it was allowed to. So again, this idea that a significant decrease in WSOP attendance will be over international trade disputes seem silly to me.

There are plenty of people who live in Canada and like Trump and his policies more than their own government’s. Are their actions going to be driven by their politics? Will they be more likely to boost WSOP attendance because of their political feelings? I doubt it. Most people talk a big game, but act in accordance to what they would do when no one is looking. Because usually, no one is.

The U.S. administration is leading the way with tariff discussions and policies, but they are far from the only ones. Canada’s trade war with China is entering its sixth month. I’m guessing Canadian vitriol with China doesn’t get the same headlines as what some Canadians think about Canada’s trade relationship with the U.S.

Anyhow, right now, as a result of rising protectionist policies around the globe, we have seen a disruption in trade and markets. Some people will benefit from these new policies. And some people will be hurt by them. This is how it has always been. But in the short term, the transformation causes uncertainty and a slowdown in growth. If there is a downturn in WSOP attendance, it will be because folks either have less money to spend on poker, or worry they may have less money in the near future. That’s pretty much it.

In other news, I found this poll interesting. Like all polls, I think it’s virtually useless to glean much real data from. I mean, in the same poll it says 70%+ of a certain demographic would never agree to join the U.S. while 43% of the same demographic would agree to join the U.S. under certain conditions. Make of that what you will. But it does show sentiment is mixed. Depending on where one gets their news and information, you never get the sense that any issue has two sides or any nuance at all.

https://www.ipsos.com/en-ca/43-percent-c...

I'm gonna go out on a small limb and say torching the economy and alienating most of the world won't be good for turnout.

Pros will still make the trek, but I expect this to look a bit like WSOP21 where the fields were very red, white, and blue.

On the plus side, if CZR stock keeps falling like this, you can win a bracelet and buy a seat on the board.

I think it'll be a small downturn about 10-15%. Something noticeable year over year but won't be the end of things. With the uncertainly of the markets and economy, people will be tightening up. It'll have more of an effect on the 1500s and less buyins than other.

I'm guessing that the reasoning he said fields will be tougher is because there would be a larger mix of pros vs recs. There probably won't be much of a drop in pros attending, but there would be more of a drop in recs because of the things being discussed in this thread. A drop in Euros and Canadians attending will likely impact this mix, but not as much as the drop in American recs, IMO

I agree. Regardless of nationality going to the WSOP is the dream of every serious poker player most especially those who have never yet attended. I have trouble thinking that players will refrain simply because they despise Trump. This is like going on tilt before the series even starts. Don't you all want take your seat and hear that -- "SHUFFLE UP AND DEAL"? Is there any substitute for that? C'mon man! I bring a slightly different perspective. I am old. This might be the last chance I am physically able to play. Been coming to the WSOP for years. I'm going. If you let political gripes deter you you lose.

On a related subject -- when will online registration, likely via Bravo, begin? If you google the subject the word is 'early April'. It is already early April and nothing. I say Friday May 2nd.

There is no immigration crackdown on tourists. And there’s a visa waver program that allows a tourist to stay up to 3 months w/o a visa if they are from one of 40 countries. Bottom line, there is no structural impediment to coming to the U.S. for the WSOP that hasn’t been there for years.

As for tax treatment of winnings, nothing has changed to my knowledge. Are you aware of changes? If not, again, I will suggest this is a non-issue for the 2025 WSOP.

As for bitcoin (and I assume other cryptocurrencies follow a similar pattern) it’s down off its post US election highs, but is still up 13% in the last year. And anyhow, folks predicted a big WSOP downturn due to a bigger crypto sell off a couple years ago and that never really materialized.

As for the other economic issues you raised, these may play a part, especially a couple months from now. But I think the desire by some to make political arguments is based mainly on their desire to turn everything political, rather than a fair analysis of reality.

And I am from the U.S., but I don’t see why I have to live in a foreign country to evaluate sentiments about the U.S. I can tune in to one of numerous news outlets to get a daily dose of anti-Trump and/or anti-US reporting. This has been the case for many years. The only thing which has really changed is there are protectionist (ie anti-globalist) movements gaining traction all over the world. I doubt very much that folks who believe in that sort of thing have any issue with what Trump or the U.S. are doing. And some of them play poker too.

I don't think it's fair to suggest that people pointing to recent events to suggest WSOP attendance will be down are making a political argument. You may well be right that there are people in Canada who like what Trump has done, but the facts speak for themselves. It was just reported a few days ago that year-over-year bookings for March air travel to the U.S. from Canada are down 70%. I appreciate that a trip to the WSOP is maybe a bit different than a family vacation to Disney World, but I think it's implausible that Canadian poker players will somehow be completely unaffected by the significant swing in popular sentiment that has resulted in that 70% drop-off.

So yeah, count me in with the group who is pretty sure we'll see a decline in attendance this year. If the last two days are an aberration and the economy doesn't get worse in the next couple months, it might not be huge, but we're still highly unlikely to see any more records fall in 2025. If, on the other hand, the market continues to tank and we start to see noticeable consumer price increases in the next few weeks, I think we'll find out pretty quickly that WSOP spending is, for a great many rec players, pretty far down the priority list, and we'll be looking at something more like a 10-15% decline.

Personally, it wouldn't bother me at all if attendance is down. Smaller crowds and shorter lines are something I would welcome, and since I'm not going to final table anything, smaller prize pools don't really affect me.

Where's the confidence?! In b4 you make ME FT

Tell that to the tourists who have been denied entry at the border merely because they wrote stuff that was negative about Orange Shitstain. If you wish to say that hasn't happened, all you are doing is proving that the second sentence above is bullshit. You may not have to live in another country to evaluate their sentiment, but you do have to actually listen to the anti-Orange Turd news to be aware of it. He is a blight on the world, and most of the world hates him, and they now hate us for electing him. If I were from Canada, or anywhere else, and had written stuff on social media that was negative about him, I for sure would not try to travel here. Everybody who supports him is brainwashed by the media and the confirmation bias created within their silo. If they haven't been brainwashed into believing a litany of lies and fake news, then they are blindingly stupid, or pure evil. Those are the only options.

Well, now we’ve crossed into the realm of overtly political and I vote this discussion shift back toward a focus on WSOP.

I am a person who voted for Trump and I live in Florida. As someone who's living is based on tourism, I must admit there are a lot of guests I've talked to who have said that it would be their last trip to the US while he is in office.

I can see how that might effect the WSOP as well.

Does anyone work in a casino and play the employee event? They changed it this year to a more broad category that seems to include any poker-related type of job (influencer, announcer, etc.). I’m not sure why they changed it and what the turnout will be as a result.

My brother works at a small casino in Montana and plays this event every year. It’s a really good structure at a minimal buy-in.

I actually talked to a local casino here in California a few years ago about hiring me for just a couple hours per week so I could play in it. They were willing to help me out and have me work a day on the weekends driving the parking lot shuttle but my wife didn’t want me giving up a weekend day :(

I believe you are in the wrong thread https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/285/p...

Is where this belongs. Happy to listen to anything you care to add poker related this however isn't.

Agreed, big Fossilman fan, but lets take the politarding elsewhere please.

While I agree that the other poster's perspective is blissed by USA-centrism at best, resorting to insults was unnecessary.