The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Bad beats are part of the game. I understand that. But after absorbing more than my fair share on Poker Stars I switched

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22 July 2008 at 04:53 AM
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2050 Replies


Earlier posts are available on our legacy forum HERE

by TheWaddy

We have established we can not prove it.
(Absolutely any screenshots you would say itÂ’s not a big enough sample, or IÂ’ve cherry picked the ones in my favour. We have established this). Still you ask.

You cannot keep saying this. And you cannot say "we've established this" and think its over.

Because everybody can read that I claimed the opposite.

I said exactly what you need to do to prove it and I wont be able to dispute it. How can I dispute an avalanche of 4 outers or the same player winning for 2 hours... I simply cant. We just need to see it, and you can easily provide it.

You are in poker since 2017 so you know how to use a tracker. You dont even need to buy one, you can get a trial on most.
1) install it
2) imported the hand histories, even if you cant watch them in-client they are stored on your computer. For skypoker I already told you the path
3) In Holdem manager, poker tracker, hand2note or whatever tracker you have chosen show us the avalanches of 4outers. Show us the same player hitting each <20%.
This is not difficult stuff, it will take minutes.
We all want conclusive evidence whether the rng is rigged or not. You claim to have this evidence but keep it to yourself even though you want the world to know poker is rigged.
4) Stop saying we cant prove it, if your stories are true it would be so goddamn easy. And since you dont like me, dont put this little effort in for me. Put this little effort in for your fellow riggies. You have the evidence, now stop withholding it.

ITT there are people who, if telling the truth, have hand histories on their PC that will surely prove that poker sites are rigging the RNG. I dont have those hand histories unfortunately but players like waddy & exoflow do.
They have information that will 100% incriminate rigging poker sites.
Yet they dont share this information with the public and therefore the evil rigging poker sites can keep on rigging, thanks to the embezzlement of Waddy & exoflow.
They are the ones protecting the rigged rng. Not me, and yet I am the shill... world upside down


@ John, yea post that stuff in the math forums, its likely too big here. I will read and react to the math stuff in that thread.

but i will quickly reply to some things you said besides the math

You say "Yes, it is not any important nuance for experienced players like you, me and other guys"
Yet you also say you are provoked to play???
But provoking to play a hand doesnt work on experienced players like you
But you got provoked...

And you cant claim I told you to kill yourself, which I didnt, and then claim i did why showing a quote reading "Must be tough being a non-walking tennis coach, almost as hard as being a non-winning professional poker player."

And if you can call me a liar because you THINK i am lying, thats fine. But then get all sissy when I call you an idiot because i THINK you are an idiot.

Also, I really want to know John, so please answer.

You think you have evidence on your pc that will prove a rigged rng.
You've made enormous time sacrifices to show these things.

How do you feel about players (like waddy & exoflow) who tell they have even more incriminating stuff on their pc...
Hand histories of things even way way crazier than you saw... stuff that shouldnt be happening 1 in a billion times...
Evidence that nobody could deny and would be crucial in taking down the evil rigging poker sites...
And yet they keep all this evidence to themselves...
Doesnt that piss you off?


by Slugant

@ John, yea post that stuff in the math forums, its likely too big here. I will read and react to the math stuff in that thread.

Okay, I will try to find a good moment to be able comunicating in time there.

by Slugant

You say "Yes, it is not any important nuance for experienced players like you, me and other guys"
Yet you also say you are provoked to play???

Where did I say it? Slugant, to be fair, i'm sometimes surprised with your statements, because we do not discuss maths at the moment. It's a conversation logic.

I say "the software provokes a player" - I announce, that in my opinion the software of iPoker intentionally (algorithmically) deals flops according to a folded on a preflop hand to provoke a tight player to participate in a postlop.

by Slugant

But you got provoked...

If the software provokes me, it doesn't mean I got provoked?? Could you, please, provide a quote where is said that, because me, at the same time, say "I avoid postflop, since it's unprofitable to play on a distance". I avoided postflop gaming online, man. Quote me, please, I want to see it.

Man, it's very easy, what for you do unconfirmed claims about someone said something. To be fair, I just don't understand this. It's a chat. You can just check this.
The topic of me, being provoked is not that important, but I don't understand your intention. So, I ask.

by Slugant

And you cant claim I told you to kill yourself, which I didnt, and then claim i did why showing a quote reading "Must be tough being a non-walking tennis coach, almost as hard as being a non-winning professional poker player."

I think we misunderstand the phrase "provoking to a suicide" here. Okay. I got your point.

by Slugant

And if you can call me a liar because you THINK i am lying, thats fine. But then get all sissy when I call you an idiot because i THINK you are an idiot.

Look, I just don't understand here again.

Example 1.

Your phrase -

by Slugant

This is a lie for instance, you know your results are online right? It shows you never played higher than micros. You can tell yourself you play it to "test" but its clear to everyone else is that you only play micros because you never beat it

It's a lie, the online information from Sharkscope shows that I played 60$ SnG's:


It's checkable.

Example 2.

Your phrase -

by Slugant

because you lost everywhere and will never take a harsh look at yourself for being not good enough.

It's a lie, the online information from Sharkscope shows that I won on Partypoker with a ROI of 45%+ (550$+, 951 tournament, average stake 6$.)


Then, I move to iPoker, lose micros (!) there and prove the game is not random. But you claim - "you lost everywhere".

Or do you mean, that those Sharkscope pictures are fake?

Then you accuse lying who? TeflonDawg and Gipsy Team forum members? Okay, np, it's your case between you and them.

Example 3.

Your phrase -

by Slugant

And remember, it started off as saying ipoker was rigged. Only when his terrible pokerstars results were shown, that site was suddenly rigged the same way as well

It's a lie,
at the same time, this is my first post on this forum -

by Johnmir

Well, if you play on Pokerstars (different rooms algorythms of player's bankroll management work according to slightly different logic) your final table allins will always be under EV (5%-10% unlucky circumstances) to controll your bankroll (if you manage to show a high ROI level). So, these huge allins will influence on an overall result.

This is my second post on 2+2 -

by Johnmir

I specialize on Pokerstars, Partypoker and Redstar's RNGs ))

I clearly claim, the game is not random there. More than that, a bit later I say that I took the logic of software dealing (non-random algorithms, which interferes into the game) from Pokerstars to iPoker. Originally it was uncovered on PS.

And you couldn't have missed. If you did, you can't claim what you said above.

I got more examples recorded, I can publish them if you wish. I record your phrases where you lie, because you use a "trick" - since not everyone can control a huge forum, you just lie a bit later after discussion "disappears in the bunch of comments" so people can't check if it's true. So, to make it easy, I just write some of your phrases down, with quotes.
I have to do it.

Now, let's comeback to -

by Slugant

And if you can call me a liar because you THINK i am lying, thats fine.

Could you, please, open a disctionary or google. You need to know -

If you lie multiple times - "you are a lier"
If you killed someone - "you are a murderer"

It's not an insulting (and you can read this, it's "ethics and laws") because it's is based on facts.

In case it is not based on facts, but I still claim it - it is a slander, or, sometimes, is insulting (depends on a contest). But it's not our case. You did lie.

by Slugant

But then get all sissy when I call you an idiot because i THINK you are an idiot.

1. No "then" here, I didn't insult you with "lier", I proved that you are.

2. No, if you think i'm a "idiot", "moron", "bitch", "garbage", "poorminded" - you can't call me like that, it's is regarded as an insuting. GL, reading the laws and ethics. You are not aware.

by Slugant

You think you have evidence on your pc that will prove a rigged rng.You've made enormous time sacrifices to show these things.How do you feel about players (like waddy & exoflow) who tell they have even more incriminating stuff on their pc...Hand histories of things even way way crazier than you saw... stuff that shouldnt be happening 1 in a billion times...Evidence that nobody

I think, it could help the case (and I will ask TheWaddy about that a bit later, what does he plan to do with his information). At the same time, I don't see it could make too much (!) influence, cause in case my evidence won't work, then it's simply senseless to provide any other materials. Probably, i'm wrong. But I can see, the situation is simply outlaw.

The easiest example - if you wasn't banned for at least a week (****ing week!) for insulting here - is it reasonable to expect confirmation of my materials on the forum? No, it is not.

If Curacao ignores the materials without any answer, the sphere is uncontrollable.

Some day, this situation will come to some serious stage, when people will be killed (not only criminals, usual people like me), offices of the rooms will be destroyed. But the time hasn't come, yet.


I have previously asked many poker sites, The Gambling Commission and eCogra to run all my hands since 2011 through their audit.

All refused this invitation. It was my opinion that none of them actually have software that relates to poker odds.

They are the only people who have any authority to bring online poker to something like an authentic experience.

Although I currently can not bring up history on Sky Poker, even if I could, I would not divulge this with an ego maniac from Eastern Europe who has no authority and plays or has investment in an unregulated site.

PS I have never used a tracker as I play poker. I know absolutely all pro online PlayStation players sit there with their little charts telling them what to do, but that is not me. Thats why we got Tom Dwan calling Phil Helmuths AA in that clip I put up, as he said it was standard with his 10 10. Thats an online player comment, so poor a play that he could not even see that information screaming in his face, all he could see was his online chart.

Massive difference between good poker players and PlayStation poker players.


by Burkeman

You can export hands from GG. If you are so certain you can share data or the hands. I play on GG (and other sites) and it seems fine to me - never had any concerns with the RNG.

Based on what?

I posted three scenarios were the outcomes defied the odds.

When starting with pocket kings, ace hit the flop over 29% of the time (IIRC 29.5%) over 175 hands. As I stated then, before any cards are dealt there is an about 21.5% chance an ace hits the flop. As Johnmir pointed out (and I agreed) the opponents who are calling my bet or 3 bet often have an ace. So the actual odds in this scenario is actually lower than 21.5%. Even when basing the calculations on a 21.5% of an ace hitting the flop, the actually 29.5% result is over 2 standard deviations from the mean.

A similar result happened with AK, AQ and AJ missing the flop over IIRC 1300 hands (connecting under 30% of the time) and again a result beyond 2 standard deviations from the mean.

The third result was 3 suited hitting the board over 40% of the time when I hit a straight or a set. A smaller deviation from the mean but a deviation. And when I calculated the odds originally, I made an error because I forgot about a back door scenario, but not surprisingly nobody here could figure than out.

The funny thing is some claim I altered the data and demand I provide my hand history files. We all know it isn't to check the hand history data because if I altered it and it worked in HM you couldn't tell if the files were altered by reviewing them. It's the non hand data they want and as I have proven many of the individuals here are outright dishonest and can't be trusted with that data.

Ultimately others could post their own results in these scenarios and their all in adj in tournaments to see if these results are indicative of what is happening at GG. But they refuse to provide even that limited data as they demand I provide my hand history files.


by Amazing3338

Ultimately others could post their own results in these scenarios and their all in adj in tournaments to see if these results are indicative of what is happening at GG. But they refuse to provide even that limited data as they demand I provide my hand history files.

Exactly.

To be fair, I'm a bit surprised, that in spite of many guys claimed games on GG are not natural and are unfair, no one esle provided any simple screenshot of a tracker...


by TheWaddy

... Thats why we got Tom Dwan calling Phil Helmuths AA in that clip I put up, as he said it was standard with his 10 10. Thats an online player comment, so poor a play that he could not even see that information screaming in his face, all he could see was his online chart. ...

Sorry for the o/t question for this thread, but you are saying that every time a tight player min-reraises your TT in a live game you should fold?


by Mike Haven

Sorry for the o/t question for this thread, but you are saying that every time a tight player min-reraises your TT in a live game you should fold?

Hahahahahaha

by TheWaddy

PS I have never used a tracker as I play poker. I know absolutely all pro online PlayStation players sit there with their little charts telling them what to do, but that is not me. Thats why we got Tom Dwan calling Phil Helmuths AA in that clip I put up, as he said it was standard with his 10 10. Thats an online player comment, so poor a play that he could not even see that inf

Maybe if you did use a tracker you could actually gather some data to help you review your play. Or you can keep thinking you know poker better than Tom Dwan but you still lose at micro stakes because they're rigged against you.


by Mike Haven

Sorry for the o/t question for this thread, but you are saying that every time a tight player min-reraises your TT in a live game you should fold?

Interesting the actual Moderator uses the same technique as poker sites/forum defenders in using an untruth to belittle those who dare question online poker.

Wow.

Even got a belittling ‘ hahahaha’ from Nath, who also misunderstands the clip.

So how does a flat call $150 from Helmuth, raised to $1100 by Dwan, reraise to $3600 by Helmuth constitute a min-reraise?

You mention the phrase ‘ tight player ‘…. What would a flat call, followed by a third of his stack reraise suggest to you from a tight player?

Here is the massive difference between deciphering information for a poker player and those who just know internet poker!

I think I am done here, there is never going to be any sense arguing with those who just don’t get poker as they have only ever played on the internet.


by TheWaddy

PS I have never used a tracker as I play poker. I know absolutely all pro online PlayStation players sit there with their little charts telling them what to do, but that is not me.

In my opinion, you chose the right way of poker gaming. In a fair game it would lead you to significant results.

You will like my comment regarding this (sorry for redirecting you) -

https://twoplustwo.com/post?postId=59063...


Yes, guys, look.

Let's just watch attentively, I don't see a problem to do it. The hand is pretty understandable.

Hellmuth, limps on a small blind 150 (pot 600)
Dwan raises to 1100 (pot 1400)
Hellmuth, reraises to 3 600 (pot 4700)
Dwan is all-in - pot 23 600.

(Hellmuth calls, pot 40 000)

1. Yes, there is no a min-raise here.

2. A comment to everyone, The Waddy, Nath, Mike -

To be fair, I have no idea, how Hellmuth plays. But the table dynamics is critically important here.

To be fair, I just don't understand, how do you manage to discuss this game without a full watch of it?

Do you understand that it's a heads-up game, and players may lead opponents to a mistake for a half an hour to get it. You CAN NOT discuss this hand without a prehistory of the hole heads-up game. Is it a poker forum? Sorry for being that strict.

Any other ideas? Anyone else believes we can discuss this without reviewing the prehistory of the full match?

3. If we try to ignore the table dynamics.

Hellmuth calls, and, after Dwan raises him, he reraises x3+.

In fact in many cases, it is a huge hand that Hullmuth tried to "hide" on a preflop to play it on a postflop effectively. Initially, yes, Dwan's all-in looks like a huge mistake (I hope online-pros know at least this - 50% cases TT vs Hellmuth is a 20% all-in, and in other 50% cases - is a 55% all-in, avg all-in = 37%).

It doesn't mean, that all the online players do play bad. And it doesn't mean that Dwan comitted a mistake, because we didn't see (didn't discussed) prehistory of the match.

But. If you insist on discussing this concrete hand without reviewing the match, Dwan goes for a crazy newcomer's mistake.

Please, be attentive while discussing. It's a poker game. It's a poker forum. It's a game of details. Do I miss something? I mean, guys here act, like they understand the game, while I would like to see that behid these words stay some knowledge of game basics.

P.S. Guys, it's a "rigged thread", usually I don't take part in discussing of the game, because it's all about the proofs and numbers. But, same as on Gipsy Team, once online-"pros" started to discuss the game, it appears to be a "bad idea" for them (Mike, it's not towards you, you just asked a question). Think twice, please, before start discussing the game here, it may apear that you are not simply ready for this.


Jesus guys are you not embarrassed?

I mean seriously there has got to be something wrong with you if your ego is so fragile that it just cant stand to face the truth that you guys suck at poker.

you do you but everybody around you knows whats going on and its really really embarrassing.

John when you wrote about how your buddies would beat the game yet you struggled and you would laugh together about how ridiculous that is because you are such an advanced player. They were laughing about you.

But keep on checking if you made 5% chips in the first hour of a final table bro. Wont improve you as a player and also doesn't necessarily show what you think it does but as long as its fun to you why the hell not.

I suggest you guys focus on live poker. cant wait until you run bad for a session or two and we get the live poker is rigged too post.


by Johnmir

Where did I say it? Slugant, to be fair, i'm sometimes surprised with your statements, because we do not discuss maths at the moment. It's a conversation logic.

You asked where did you say the software provokes you??? Here you go Johnny

by Johnmir

And this is one of reasons, why I managed to prove rigging. Software started to provoke me to join the flop TOO often, because I folded AJ, AK, QQ, TT preflop too often.

You forgot what you said apparently. Keeping track of your own statements is something I would call conversation logic😉
And about discussing maths, you've been told to post it in the math forum. Go ahead

by Johnmir

Could you, please, open a disctionary or google. You need to know -

If you lie multiple times - "you are a lier"
If you killed someone - "you are a murderer"

And if you lose at microstakes - "you are a microstakes loser" 😃😃
Funny you were trying to say dictionary but spelled it wrong. And then also spelled liar wrong 😃 You just cant stop making mistakes hahaha

But when it comes to lies Johnny, you will always be the best. Your entire life is a lie. Your entire poker "career" is a lie. To everyone and everywhere you've introduced yourself as professional poker player. You are the exact opposite.
Even on this forum you've filled in your bio where you wrote:
"Games & Stakes
Holdem MTT 10$-100$, heads up, LH cash"
Lets see what you've been playing last 6 years:


Maybe you should update your bio, you dont want to be a LIAR right?
The $60 sng you mention are from 2014. Stop living in the past Johnny, you are not a young man anymore. You are a weak and old man, the world is changing Johnny.
Also, in the stream you deleted like a weasel you had a bankroll of $13. Must be hard playing $100 heads up with that huh 🙂

But if you ever want to play $100 HU I am one click away. You are much better than me so it would be easy win for you. You pick a site.

When shall we play? Dont chicken out.

by TheWaddy

I have previously asked many poker sites, The Gambling Commission and eCogra to run all my hands since 2011 through their audit.

All refused this invitation.

Much like you have information (hand histories) on your computer that will uncover the rigged rng but your refuse to show them.
If you dont want to use a tracker yourself you can always send the hand histories to someone and they can check for the 4 outer avalanches.
You can send them to me, I have trackers and unlike you I dont mind putting in some effort to uncover the rigged rng. Because if its rigged I want to know!

Dont refuse this offer.
Otherwise everyone would know you are in on the whole fraud and are collaborating with the evil gaming commissions and poker sites.
It will be 100% proven and established that you are a poker shill purposefully withholding evidence that will incriminate rigging poker sites.
You are protecting evil gambling sites who did so many crimes AND are rigging the deck. But we perhaps will never find proof.
All because thewaddy is an established poker shill who keeps evidence against the sites hidden. What a scumbag!


Let’s post a load of posts so the Moderators false statements get buried and never mentioned again…..

JohnMir it was significant in the fact that before this heads up tournament, helmuth had given an interview where he stated he’s not going all in preflop unless it’s AA, KK and that doing it with AK was just a no no. Everyone knew this yet Dwan could not even spot it given the overwhelming information.


by Mike Haven

Sorry for the o/t question for this thread, but you are saying that every time a tight player min-reraises your TT in a live game you should fold?

by TheWaddy

... So how does a flat call $150 from Helmuth, raised to $1100 by Dwan, reraise to $3600 by Helmuth constitute a min-reraise?

You mention the phrase ‘ tight player ‘…. What would a flat call, followed by a third of his stack reraise suggest to you from a tight player? ...

I think I am done here, ...

The Waddy,

OK. My bad. I'll retract "min-" from my question, add in "HU", and ask again:

Sorry for the o/t question for this thread, but you are saying that every time a tight player reraises your TT in a live [HU] game you should fold?

(If you would prefer the question to be, "You are saying that every time a tight player reraises your TT after a call and your raise in a [HU] live game you should fold?", please read it as that.)

Actually, as I've just remembered you're done here, I'll have to assume your answer would have been "yes", or else you wouldn't have written, "Thats why we got Tom Dwan calling Phil Helmuths AA in that clip I put up, as he said it was standard with his 10 10. Thats an online player comment, so poor a play that he could not even see that information screaming in his face, all he could see was his online chart."

If you do decide to come back one day and admit your thinking was wrong, that's fine, don't worry about it. It's a difficult game to play and we should always be learning.


by TheWaddy

I would not divulge this with an ego maniac from Eastern Europe who has no authority and plays or has investment in an unregulated site.

Not sure on who this is a dig, I am not from eastern Europe while your fellow riggies amazing and Johnmir are... And the rest applies to them as well 😉

You are quite harsh on them. Is that because they want to prove poker is rigged and you do everything to keep the evidence hidden?
Well, I guess we can expect this behaviour from a 100% confirmed poker shill. Probably works for ACR too.


by Slugant

You are quite harsh on them. Is that because they want to prove poker is rigged and you do everything to keep the evidence hidden?
Well, I guess we can expect this behaviour from a 100% confirmed poker shill. Probably works for ACR too.

Man, yes, it’s important to consider all the possible risks… Who knows, who knows))

by donjonnie

that you guys suck at poker.

DJ, you repeat this pretty often, at the same time the only info you could use to confirm this statement (that we suck at poker) is that I lost those iPoker’s micros.

The problem is that it is proved to be rigged. And at the moment, if we consider my comments here in the chat regarding the gameplay of regular players and regarding EV ICM$, push-fold calculator, bluffing efficiency analysis, 7 consequtive successful bluffs on MTT in a row – I look much more confident in poker gaming then any of you here, since you just won $ in a rigged game. I would say, that after reading this chat (! i don't mean you are not good, but I don't have another relevant info about you!) you are not any close to be considered as good players.

The only reasonable stuff which was said about the game – were TeflonDawg’s comments regarding EV of a poker decision.

I mean, guys, the only way you can confirm you know something about the game are your screen shots of $won in a rigged game, rofl.

Speaking seriously, comparing to me, you know simply nothing about analyzing your own game. You can’t know if you bluff well, if you do not check (calculate) your BB won on bluff per hand. Just can’t, because bluffing is based on assessing of a fold equity %, and you ****ing can’t watch it in the calculator. The fun is that, even after I explained it – you do not understand this. And you are literally SURE that you are analyzing your game perfectly.

The final table? How the hell do you know if you play it well, if you do not compare your ICM starting stack share and your EV ICM$ on the final table.

But to calculate EV ICM$ on the final table you need to know how to calculate it, because poker tracker is not developed for calculating this. It is developed for assessing of cash games EV mostly. But, for sure, not for the final table EV assessing.

You haven’t got any idea of you played well/wrong, since you just train in calculator, then come to a real game, where other players take different (!) decisions. And you are sure, you played well by checking your $ on a credit card.

I will open you a crazy, unbelievable truth – NO ONE WORKS LIKE THAT in any other sphere outside this forum. EVERYONE checks different stages of the process (manufacturing, finance, medicine, education) and measures it’s efficiency.

Yes, you MUST check your average stack increase in the first hour of a tournament, because it shows if you play small ball strategy well enough, that you join flop often enough, or you have to wider your preflop ranges and start to join flop on a weaker hands in case you play against weaker postflop players. Because +EV postflop will “cover” a loss of –EV preflop.

The same for the final table. The same for hands where you went for a bluff.

by donjonnie

John when you wrote about how your buddies would beat the game yet you struggled and you would laugh together about how ridiculous that is because you are such an advanced player. They were laughing about you.

Surprised that you remember that. Yes, it was fun )) Since I was winning higher limits and winning every game vs them.

by donjonnie

But keep on checking if you made 5% chips in the first hour of a final table bro. Wont improve you as a player and also doesn't necessarily show what you think it does but as long as its fun to you why the hell not.

Man! I don’t check it any more. I haven’t got a good place to play. There are no poker games online. I didn’t manage to find! ))

And you don’t need to check it EVERY time. But once you noticed the game goes “wrong”, yes – it is the first you must to do, to check if you manage to increase your stack in the start of the tourney. And only AFTER this – you watch WHY you don’t manage to do it. You start to check your “top pair flopped” situation, “bluffing efficiency” – this is how ALL THE OTHER spheres work.

You, guys, can’t even analyze your gameplay, rofl. “Pro” players.

by donjonnie

I suggest you guys focus on live poker. cant wait until you run bad for a session or two and we get the live poker is rigged too post.

I am planning to publish ALL my results including cash game tables. We will check what ROI level is reachable in a random, fair game of poker.

by Slugant

You asked where did you say the software provokes you??? Here you go Johnny

Man, look, you say -

by Slugant

You say "Yes, it is not any important nuance for experienced players like you, me and other guys"
Yet you also say you are provoked to play???
But provoking to play a hand doesnt work on experienced players like you
But you got provoked...

You say that I “GOT PROVOKED”, but now you send me “you say the software provokes you”

Look, I’m not kidding, no sarcasm, but we are not native speakers, both. In my opinion –
“you got provoked”
And
“Software provokes you”

– are two different statements. I say, that intention of the software to provoke me. I didn’t say, that I follow software provocations. Man!

by Slugant

And if you lose at microstakes - "you are a microstakes loser" 😃😃

Nice observation, man, yes, in some other game I’m a microstakes loser, but not in a poker game. Poker game is random.

by Slugant

Funny you were trying to say dictionary but spelled it wrong. And then also spelled liar wrong 😃 You just cant stop making mistakes hahaha

Yes, I can’t type so much… So I have to concentrate on a logic of my messages, but commit mistakes in spelling. You are doing vice-versa 😃

by Slugant

But when it comes to lies Johnny, you will always be the best. Your entire life is a lie. Your entire poker "career" is a lie. To everyone and everywhere you've introduced yourself as professional poker player.

No, I didn’t, I introduced myself as an expert level player to discuss the game on the max possible level. And I prove this with every statement. Lol, guys, you don’t even know basic probabilities of the game. You have no idea how to analyze your gameplay. You can’t bluff effectively. What you can then? Press buttons in calculators? I thought everyone can do this. You don’t even need to be a poker player to control your PC's mouse.

by Slugant

But if you ever want to play $100 HU I am one click away. You are much better than me so it would be easy win for you. You pick a site.
When shall we play? Dont chicken out.

😃 Man, gimme some months to make online-poker fair and I will look forward to our games! Will be fun!

by Slugant

All because thewaddy is an established poker shill who keeps evidence against the sites hidden. What a scumbag!

😃

by TheWaddy

Let’s post a load of posts so the Moderators false statements get buried and never mentioned again…..

Slugant is working it out.

by TheWaddy

JohnMir it was significant in the fact that before this heads up tournament, helmuth had given an interview where he stated he’s not going all in preflop unless it’s AA, KK and that doing it with AK was just a no no. Everyone knew this yet Dwan could not even spot it given the overwhelming information.

Well, yeah, that move on a hands up game having 30BB stack looks pretty much like “an online” move. Where you got crazy number of tries to open a new table. In fact, we should know if Hellmuth had already made the same “trick” vs Dwan in this game.

In case he went for the same move for the third time this match – Dwan was just successfully provoked… But, looks (according to your discussion) like Hellmuth is pretty tight, I doubt it’s his “normal” move. Most-likely, Dwan committed a mistake.


I haven't read through anything about the latest posts
IMO Johnmir has too much time on his hand, weird explainations about why Poker is rigged, etc. and so on.

But I also can not say I don't feel him in some way.

Lets take the highest Volume (and also best) DoN-Reg on Ipoker in perspective:
He changed his Screenname several times (on one skin this is allowed every 3 months afaik), it's pretty easy to figure it's one and the same guy though.

His Stats:
10€ DoNs: 3K profit over 20K Games
20€ DoNs -2,3K over 13K Games
(Stats pre RB obviously)

So you may think "this is normal. higher stakes etc

But the truth about IPoker SNGs is there are many many many lowstakes Regs grinding the 5€s and 10€s (not super rare to see 6-Reg-Games there, in a 5€ Game!!), 10s are usually very bad european primetime (there are still a couple good games to sneak) but most of all I have very rarely seen 20€s opening in a bad state.
Weirdly, once there are 3/6 regged in a 20€ game it also opens rather quickly, with accounts joining one never saw before.

What I mean is this individual, if he makes 1.5% ROI pre RB in 10€ DoNs in this setup, with how the games are in the 20€s he should make like a 3-4% ROI in the 20s. Because they have at least 2 Full-Fish in literally all of the games. But he's on close to -1%, on a 13K Game sample.

This seems really really weird to me, and the samples, for DoN-SNGs also are not unworthy - it can still shift in the range of 1-2% over this sample, but not this much (DYOR in Primedope).

I'm in top5 Volume on Ipoker this year on Sharkscope, and also one of the rare guys being in profit pre RB there 😃 So this is not a rage-post. But some things are just really weird there, I am not saying Johnmir is right with his rigged-accusations (like I said, it is just too much for me to read focussed anyways so that I could say I expirienced similar), But is everything going proper there? Probably not, really IMHO. Just my honest opinion. With the regulatory options I have it still lets me have the best grind though


by ICrushSNGs22

Weirdly, once there are 3/6 regged in a 20€ game it also opens rather quickly, with accounts joining one never saw before.

ICS, do you mean, some "new" guys accidentaly join 20 Euro DoN tables in case the game on the table is closer to the start?
Because "new" players of the room is a special case on iPoker.

by ICrushSNGs22

I'm in top5 Volume on Ipoker this year on Sharkscope, and also one of the rare guys being in profit pre RB there 😃

With the regulatory options I have it still lets me have the best grind though

Good job, man. Yeah, some guys managed to win MTT's there (20-50 Euro buy-ins), they say on Gipsy Team forum.

Thank you for an opinion. A huge problem, I never played anything significant (expensive) on iPoker. Gaming on different limits can go different way. Good to know your impressions.


by Johnmir

Man, yes, it’s important to consider all the possible risks… Who knows, who knows))DJ, you repeat this pretty often, at the same time the only info you could use to confirm this statement (that we suck at poker) is that I lost those iPoker’s micros.The problem is that it is proved to be rigged. And at the moment, if we consider my comments here in the chat regarding the gamepla

I have much more indicators that you are horrible at poker although your results are obviously a very good indicator.

you say you have been testing and just shoving preflop for year. i doubt that all the games you played for the last few years were played in this manner.

I can see the way you think about and approach poker and it tells me a lot. your main reason for starting this whole circus is that you are unhappy with your results and think because you are some kind of genius poker owes you to win at rate x but instead of trying to improve your fragile ego cant take it and you come up with a grand conspiracy with you at the center.

I appreciate that you try autodidactically learn poker. That will often lead to worse results then benefiting from the massive amount of knowledge others have already contributed to the field of poker strategy.

Another flaw in your thinking is the absolute fascination you seem to have with short term results. The statistics you pulled out to show how great you are at poker are might be interesting to some degree. real improvement wont come from strictly studying results though.

Furthermore your focus on having bluffed x times in a row is baffling.

You are also willing to agree with people that have entirely different believes that the game is rigged even if it doesnt fit with your "findings" at all.

All of this and your general sense of over inflated self importance tells the story of a man who lets his ego get in his way because he cant show some humility.

I mean again you went down this fake rabbit hole because you were unhappy with your results. This is your whole motivation. you just cant stand that you suck at poker.

You told us that you do.

by ICrushSNGs22

I haven't read through anything about the latest postsIMO Johnmir has too much time on his hand, weird explainations about why Poker is rigged, etc. and so on.But I also can not say I don't feel him in some way.Lets take the highest Volume (and also best) DoN-Reg on Ipoker in perspective:He changed his Screenname several times (on one skin this is allowed every 3 months afaik),

Sounds like collusion to be honest. I would never play dons as they are rife with it.


by Johnmir

Exactly.

To be fair, I'm a bit surprised, that in spite of many guys claimed games on GG are not natural and are unfair, no one esle provided any simple screenshot of a tracker...

Except for the all in adjusted differential, every other stat requires a little work.

Those stats actually have changed the way I play. Those changes may not be the theoretically best way to play, but it is the better way to play on GG Poker. And those changes have been profitable.


by Johnmir

You say that I “GOT PROVOKED”, but now you send me “you say the software provokes you”

Look, I’m not kidding, no sarcasm, but we are not native speakers, both. In my opinion –
“you got provoked”
And
“Software provokes you”

– are two different statements.

Well I guess I understand english phrasing a bit better then. Because this is extremely splitting hairs. You got provoked by the software & the software provokes you is similar. Both dont 100% imply that you made the mistake.

by Johnmir

Nice observation, man, yes, in some other game I’m a microstakes loser, but not in a poker game.

Are you sure? Every tracking site over the last decade would disagree




😃😃😃

by Johnmir

No, I didn’t, I introduced myself as an expert level player to discuss the game on the max possible level. And I prove this with every statement. Lol, guys, you don’t even know basic probabilities of the game. You have no idea how to analyze your gameplay. You can’t bluff effectively. What you can then? Press buttons in calculators? I thought everyone can do t

Quite a big talk from someone who has those stats ^^^. You are in no position to talk down to other poker players. 99% of them do better than you.
Look at those stars stats, You've already been playing poker for 10 years at this point and your strat is 32/13/2. Most fish who played a year have a better understanding of poker. Not to mention that glorious lossrate of -19bb/100 😃😃 Clearly an expert level player 🙂
Also, you keep dodging every challenge. For once show some integrity and put your money where your mouth is.

PS: Your bio still says you play "Holdem MTT 10$-100$, heads up, LH cash"
As we can see from your last 6 years you've played some 10nl.... very poorly. And your avg stake is 0.43, quite different from that $100 LOLOL

You might want to change your bio soon otherwise anybody will immediately see that you are a LIAR


Guys, while I'm answering DJ and Slugant. Could you, please, prepare screen shots of your successful bluffs. Should be easy for you to find, just choose your frequency of success, I pointed out where to watch -
https://twoplustwo.com/post?postId=59064...

If you take 10% of such pots, while I do take 50%, you will meet this pretty often, each 7 million hands is enough to find one case.

by Amazing3338

Except for the all in adjusted differential, every other stat requires a little work.

Those stats actually have changed the way I play. Those changes may not be the theoretically best way to play, but it is the better way to play on GG Poker. And those changes have been profitable.

Yes, for sure. Me personally - have to move all the data from the tracker to excel every time... It's very inconvinient. Pity they didn't implement a function - "export to Excel"...
Sometimes I even open a usual client's hand replayer and fill excel manually just watching hands one by one there ((

Look, it's good that you adapted, but it's also important to remember "the right" strategy. I hope, you won't lose your "natural" skills.


What constitutes a bluff for you specifically since in stream and here you said you "avoid playing postflop"???
Does openshoving for 75bb and an opponent folding counts as a successful bluff?? Even though its an extreme -EV play??

But since you are such a bluffmaster and terrific poker player I thought of something that is missing from your research John.
When people point out to you that other players who do win structurally are playing with the same RNG you always say they win because of factors like Multitabling & playing a certain style. In fact, you "know" all the factors as to why pro's are winning even though they play worse than you. You can implement those factors, show it, and make shitload of money in the process.
We all believe in you immediately of course but it is noteworthy that this concept has never been tested by you. Other stuff you spend countless hours in Excel on, this just gets mentioned on the side. Thats not the backing we expect from a top analyst!
1tabling at the micros makes you lose and thats what you chose to do... genius move of course. Now we know that the software makes a good player lose just because he 1tables 0.20 sng's

But now Johnny, to complete your research, you should do the other side of the coin. You've told us before its easy to beat the game, most professionals are in fact sub-par players. We would like to see this in action.
If you start multitabling NOW (and not in 2010) and suddenly are winning substantially you've proven that poker sites prefer multitablers and you can actually play and beat poker!
What do you say Johnny?
I know you wouldnt like incomplete research since you are a top analyst. If you could show a losing microstakes player will suddenly win just because he starts multitabling you have proven everyone wrong and finally end your 6 year losing streak. Even Curacao wouldnt be able to deny your claims then.

Good luck with the next step in your research and we will see the results here.

PS: Your bio still says you play "Holdem MTT 10$-100$, heads up, LH cash"
As we can see from your last 6 years you've played some 10nl.... very poorly. And your avg stake is 0.43, quite different from that $100 LOLOL

You might want to change your bio soon otherwise anybody will immediately see that you are a LIAR


by Johnmir

ICS, do you mean, some "new" guys accidentaly join 20 Euro DoN tables in case the game on the table is closer to the start?Because "new" players of the room is a special case on iPoker. Good job, man. Yeah, some guys managed to win MTT's there (20-50 Euro buy-ins), they say on Gipsy Team forum.Thank you for an opinion. A huge problem, I never played anything significant (expens

I play SNGs pretty much only on IPoker (unless I get a ticket from Missions).
I game-select anything between 5€-20€ which is a good game (some fish in it), may as well say my screenname there is JustHere4TheRB.

Since you started these threads I did indeed have a closer look on things on Ipoker.
First things first - profitable players will still win there, losing players will still lose there, no doubt. So the reason why you are losing isn't the software itself..
However, if anything, I agree with you some patterns in the card distribution are very weird, now after I have put some tables aside of my stack to look at some bubble situations, looked some in my DB etc.. Especially if someone loses on a Setup early (Set-Over-Set or something OTF) they magically double up 3-4 times in a row, definitely not just the percentile they are supposed to. Similar if someone gets crippled in a DoN Bubble, If the Shorty has 0.2BB on the Bubble, don't feel too safe you'll win it if you have 10BB...
I have over 200K DoNs played on Winamax back in the day and to this severe I never felt it to this extend.

That being said, yet if you look on sharkscope, many many people are losing pre RB on IPoker STTs (I would too if not game-select), and the EV vs. actual winnings shifted hundreds of BIs between EV and actual won over the 1.5 years I played there, in both directions. Several times. This is def. not normal for low variance STT Formats. But on the other hand it always found its' way back over a couple thousand games. Do I think this is how these games should run out legitimately? Eg. that on Ipoker it's many sessions black & white? Not at all, but variance evening out over multiple thousands of games will hit me on any site.

Now Slugant, the Midstakes Cash Reg (believe I've read that) who if he spent just half the time in a Solver over spending a century here, might be able to battle Linus, can shoot their shot again.
He will look at my graph, not taking RB in accountance and say what a fish I am grinding this many games for next to no profit, and all that, just because he has the mission to justify all online poker sites are absolutely legit and random
Neither Johnmir with his paranoia (but it might actually have a point, just not in the extend he points it out) nor trying to justify everything (for no need actually!!) (Slugant) is the right answer, most likely. On Ipoker the feeling for someone actually looking at it is, card dsitrubution is even in a way you can not win/lose much $-EV.
Literally, many standard spots/flips happening, if on an any2 SB Shove I have 55, BB has A6. If I had 99, he would have A10. And so on. Not Q6 vs. A10 or something, it will be Q6 vs. AQ surely 😃 etc), probably just not making the pattern too clear
Only talking about SNGs, I don't know how it is in Cash etc.

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