How to approach suspected cheating ?

99.99% of the time people are wrong about this.

You are going to need some proof, starting with multiple hands where you saw the player go to the flop on hands they in other circumstances would have folded.

This complaint/suspicion makes little sense, with my limited understanding of such things....

1.Take off your tin hat
2. You apparently are playing live, if you are referring to RFID chips inserted into chips.
3. If you ARE playing in Nevada live, complain to the casino and copy the Nevada Gaming Control Board.

See what happens.

You might want to research what RFID means and how it is used in casinos in Nevada. That exercise would help you explain your suspicions or might convince you they are mistaken.

What about guys with mini cameras like berkey said, they play like whales (vpiping close to 100%)

Frankly .... you're pulling the 99.99% out of your ass. The RFID technology has been around for 7-8 years. It only costs about a $1k to get a deck bar coded so that it can be read with an RFID reader. Anyone can do it easily and the motivation is obvious.

There was no proof with Mike Postle. It was just the abundance of the evidence and the stupidity of doing it on recorded video so that it can be analyzed.

Just that the results were too good and the play didn't make any sense. This person's win rate is by far the best of all the tournament players in the casino where we play. Month after month after month. These tournaments are mostly 20 minute levels with what should be high variance. No matter how skilled a player someone might be ..... you need to run really good to win in a turbo.

Today I was in a hand with the dude and he raised 5 BB with 10-6 offsuit in late position right before a 10,10, 6 flop. He raised pre-flop in a hand with 97o which came dame 865 for the nut straight.

The villain doesn't need to know which specific cards will be spread on the flop.

The software that comes with the RFID reader is capable of determining which seat will have the best hand at the conclusion of the hand.

All the player needs to do is make sure that they are in the hand and the story will unfold for them.

All the player needs to do is provide the input regarding the number of players at the table.

Read the article above about the people caught cheating in Houston this summer.

I'm not sure if you're being serious or trolling, but in case you're serious...

Normally casinos have a rule about being on your phone during a hand. It's just not enforced very strictly. If you think he's getting info relayed through his phone just make sure to call him out for being on his phone. If the casino repeatedly stops him from going on his phone and he's still sneaking looks during hands a la Postle then that might give credence to your theory that he's cheating. At that point you might privately approach a trusted floor with your concerns.

Also they still cut the deck right? The cards that come out on the flop will vary based on the cut. I'm pretty sure the theory with Postle is that he could see his opponent's hole cards after they were scanned by the RFID table, but they'll have to get the info relayed after the cut right? Once the hand has started and you're not supposed to be on your phone?

If someone asked me to take a polygraph id tell them to pound sand. They're worthless. Additionally if I'm not actually cheating I'm not wasting my time with such nonsense to appease someone in a game in the casino.

Raising garbage in LP and flopping gin a few times isn't indictive of anything. How often does he raise in that spot? How often is he flopping gin and wrecking people?

If you're talking about a private games- well you should assume you're being cheated at all times and then figure out if it's still worth playing.

Do you realize that RFID and barcodes are completely separate and very different technology.

But to get either a RFID and a barcoded deck into play you have to counterfeit that specific casinos decks and get it into play.

Your suspicions are so big they shoots themselves in the foot.

No way.

The extent of the technical aspects required to cheat in a way where you know that a non-optimal hand makes the nuts is so vast, it is far more likely that it's just in your head. I'm not saying it's impossible, but it's just real ****ing big. And if you remove the possibility of an inside job, it's even bigger, it's an astronomical cheat made by an expert team with a whole lot of money at hand, to win your measly chips.

But if you flip it around, everything is smoother and easier to understand. Some dude that played a lot of poker, raises **** hands in a live setting and makes the nuts, nuts that beat the 2+2er tryharding. Oh yeah, that seems like a daily occurrence. Probably will happen tomorrow, too.

I kinda wanna make the joke that, if there is such a movie-worthy expert team cheating at the pokers, using micro chips small enough to be realistically undetectable, but big enough to transfer information, on every single card; while a dude is waiting in a van in the parking lot transferring and interpreting the data to tell the dude, secretly somehow, that 4-6 will make a straight, well, you probably dont even wanna be the guy that calls them out of their bullshit hahahhahahahaha

You ask good questions.

For your reference .... an RFID reader does not have to be embedded in a smart phone. It can be in a key fob or sewn into a hat. The signal of whether or not to engage in a hand can be a simple binary buzz ..... there is no need for the villain to know the rank and suit of the cards ...... they just need to know that the cards they hold will match the community cards in a more optimal fashion than their opponents. No phone is necessary.

The cards are indeed read after the cut.

I encourage you to read the example from Houston and ask yourself ...... if that technique is available to everyone ...... what stops everyone from doing it ? Do you imagine that we live in a world where people wouldn't cheat for an edge ? I think that's naive.

It is not possible for rfid to identify where the cards will be until they are actually dealt. Passive rfid will sense ALL the cards in proximity to the reader but not their precise position.

Now a barcoded deck can be read if the barcode reader is in the proper position. But you will need something to process the information, analyze it including your position and then signal you.

You still have to get your deck into play on your table and get in the right position. Honestly, it would be much easier to have a dealer mechanic set the deck for you.

My sense is that some of the people who are trying to label me as delusional have a vested interest in maintaining the appearance of integrity in poker. I wouldn't rule out the possibility that some people who employ this technique are present on this forum.

I would rather have a scientific investigation into facts and possibilities. I think the Houston example is something we should investigate more seriously and come to grips with it rather than issuing blanket statements assuming that what I'm suspicious of is delusional.

You don’t program a deck. A rfid chip has to be literally embedded when the cards are made. So you would have to steal a complete casino rfid deck. You do know how closely casinos keep track of those?

Then you would have to break the code they used to program your reader. Then reintroduce the deck. But as I said rfid reads via proximity not exact position. But this requires the table be using an rfid deck. Thus it is being streamed or broadcast.

A much better method is to tap into the multiple rfid sensors in the table reading the existing rfid cards in their actual positions after they are dealt. But it must happen after cards are out. This is how Postle did it but he likely had help to access the information.

Btw yes you did literally say the rfid tech has been around 7/8 years.

The cards can be identified as soon as they are cut. They are already stacked vertically in the order in which they will be dealt and the RFID reader is capable of reading them while they are still stacked.

At a 9 person table, the small blind gets the 1st and 10th card. The big blind gets the 2nd and 11th., etc.

The 19th, 23nd and 25th cards are burn cards

Cards # 20, 21,22,24 & 26 are the community cards.

The software associated with determining the best hand combination with the community cards is relatively simple.

In the event of a paired or multi-paired board, the software will look for quads, full house and trips combinations with kickers.

In the absence of a full house, the software will scan for flush and straight possibilities.

In the absence of either, straight or flush 2 pair, high pair + kicker or high card combinations are evaluated.

Your delusion is growing. Now we are all in on it. Including us who are well over thousand miles from Vegas.

I am not saying this person is not cheating. I have no clue. But the methods you propose are not actually possible. Even if they were, there are much easier and less detectable ways.

Exactly how Postle did it has never been verified.

We know that there was a live feed from the poker table into the studio where the commentators were working. It is assumed that this was an inside job and the people were somehow forwarding the live feed to Postle who was often looking at his crotch around the time hands commenced.

What we also know is that the commentator Veronica Brill who originally brought the accusations forward ...... she was vilified by a lot of people in the poker community until Joey Ingram started doing the hand analysis and acknowledged that he could conceive of no natural process by which Postle played so many hands perfectly other than knowing what his opponents held.

So .... if people want to vilify me ... I'm in good company.

A hunch is not enough to accuse someone of cheating and demanding a lie detector test.

Reasonable suspicion would be more than, "Their win rate is the very best in the genre they are playing and they are making some extremely unorthodox plays with pre-flop raises with crap hands which just happen to turn into the nuts."

If you have a serious concern then record their play for a few hours and analyse statistically. A couple of example hands is not enough. Opening crap hands that become nutted is good evidence only if it happens with a reasonable frequency and there is an absence of opening crap hands that don't turn into winners.

The kind of cheating you describe (advance knowledge of cards from the deck) is not enabled by RFID cards. Also you can tell if they're RFID because the cards are thicker and stiffer than normal. If (and I think this is highly unlikely based on the info so far) there is cheating involving advance knowledge of the deck then it is more indicative of a card mechanic or a hack into an electronic shuffler.

What stakes are involved?
Are you playing in a regulated environment (casino)?
Is it always the same dealer?
Are the cards thicker/stiffer than others in the house?
Are electronic shufflers used?
If so, does the dealer cut the deck afterwards?
Does the house swap out the decks regularly?

What stakes and what type of games are we talking about here?

It seems to me like Tournaments are about the worst type of game to cheat with an rfid deck or a scanner as you could be moved away from the table you set up for your cheat at any time.

Yeah but... he is cheating because OP thinks so.

Yeah but... he is cheating because OP thinks so.

Yeah but... he is cheating because OP thinks so.

Yeah but... he is cheating because OP thinks so.

OP, I think you need to name the room where this is going on. The Houston example took place over a short period of time with the aid of an employee allowing them to introduce a new deck. You are alleging months of misconduct.

Op why do you suspect only rfid and not the other type of cheating (the utilization of micro cams that see under the cards when the dealer is dealing them, info relayed to a 3rd party which gives the info back to the player via mic or cell) berkey talked about this last year. This type of cheating involves only the player and not the casino and it is far more likely to happen.

But you're not doing a hand analysis. You're saying a few times someone raised garbage in LP and flopped gin. And that you're gonna demand they take a polygraph lmao.

The biggest giveaway from Postle was he was crushing these players at a rate that wasn't even possible yet refused to even play one hand off stream with the same group of players. These people had absolutely zero street smarts whatsoever to not realize what was going on.

Plenty of people agreed with Veronica that it was obvious Postle was cheating right away.

I mean seriously I could just make baseless accusations of cheating and if someone disagreed say "I'm in good company with Veronica"

See how silly that sounds?

And then to top it off you're accusing people in this thread of also cheating bc they don't want to jump on board with you're cheating accusations in a game they don't even know.

Gee guys if you don't agree I'm being cheated in this casino I won't even name ,based on a guy raising 10 6 offsuit and flopping a boat it's bc you're all cheaters! Sure buddy whatever you say.

You sound rediculous.

My initial instinct was if you're someone who has played a long time, and has never felt they were being cheated in a casino there could be something to your gut feeling. But it's obvious your just some conspiracy theory type person, who isn't using logic at all an you're just making baseless accusations.

The comment about demanding that this player take a polygraph is the part that made me think this thread has to be a troll. I'm not naive about the possibility of cheating but this seems like a complicated and difficult to execute way to cheat, having special cards made, swapping them in unnoticed at a casino, somehow getting the results forwarded to yourself, etc. It's not completely impossible but Occam's razor suggests the simpler explanation is usually correct. If you were playing at a home game with some sketchy thick cards, or even on a stream with known RFID cards, then your theory would seem more plausible, but opening T6 on the button and flopping trips isn't that far out of the norm.