The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Out of interest...why on earth,given your above statements, do you play online poker and spend your time on poker forums?

So from the looks of things the iPoker network (which sky poker is also a member of) is going backwards? Or do they just not care about the new gambler? Because twister entries is 20 times as low as tournaments and thats not even taking cash games into consideration.
Also, why do you still call twister a dominant force while it has 534 player entries when tournaments has 10.701 player entries at the same time?
Its just simply untrue, or as you worded it

Proof is in numbers, and these are the numbers that are right in front of our eyes. Your "gut feeling" and resentment are not.

Furthermore, the way you talk about these sites... You always describe them as evil companies doing anything for a quick buck. All they care about is money and they dont give a **** about their customers.
Yet, with those principles in mind, you decide to remain a customer there. And from your own stories you have been for 25+ years. Now who would dedicate so much free time to a world they condemn so much?
Who in their right mind would be an active customer to an evil business for so long? Especially when they "own businesses and hold business qualifications" 😃

Also, your poker guru Phil Galfond has even better qualifications since he actually owned a poker site and he repeatedly said poker sites would be fools to rig their own software. But then again, why would Phil Galfond know more about poker and doing in business in poker than TheWaddy 🙂

I was once dealt jacks 5 times in a row on a site. One time, on the same site, I seen a royal flush come in twice. The same way! Within a day. I think this site is very much rigged. I just don't want to be the one to say it. I've won a tournament in about 10 on coinpoker so far. This site I always stuck with, because the slots made me break even. LOL. I think my stats prove its rigged, which is even crazier.

You might run a business and might have business acumen.

You sure as hell dont run a gambling business and dont have any insight or idea how casinos and poker rooms work.

For the most part it is not that companies try to turn casino players into poker players.

This has been attempted and it doesn't work.

There have been very interesting studies done on this. It is for example very hard to turn a slot player into a sport bettor or poker player.

It is actuall ythe other way around. Casinos try to turn poker players away from from poker and towards casino games as their margin is much better on these games.

5x JJ in a row and same royal flush on the same day on a site? Thats amazing! Which site?

Also you have stats to prove its rigged? Thats amazing! Please share with us these revealing stats.

It depends on whether they are here to debate with the other participants or just to slag them off.

I just saw gg poker "bmm testlab rng certificate" and it´s signed by a asian guy working on sidney secondary office of bmm labs, almost no followers on ig and he seems like he has less than 20 years old lol, just an new employee, you can search for the firm on gg updated certificate of 2026 and find this teen guy acrediting the certificate...

Slugant says this thread is not a debate @MikeHaven, so even though you can see why he posts, with no intention to debate, you allow it.

Slugant; are you seriously asking again about the tournament/twister numbers, posting a similar screenshot, when we fully discussed the amount of tourn fees involved!??? And reposting the same Galfond quotes you have previously done 4 times?? And describing him as my guru once again, when the only quote IÂ’ve ever agreed on from him is that it was possible to rig poker??

The guy clearly suffers from some kind of memory loss, so 3100 of these posts are down to Slugant repetitionsÂ…..

Seems like every fkn rigturd has their own secret system to beat the rigged rng.

Imagine being the incredibly evil head of a poker site, investing millions in a heavily manipulated dealing system, based on a player's behaviour and cash in history and then comes Percy, 69, from Assfaceshire, England and just adjusts his playstyle a little bit.

You are a business owner. But you are grinding 5$ and below games on sites you perceive as rigged for holiday money?

You do you buddy. But you get why it sounds weird that some succesfull business owner would spend his time on such silly ventures.

Seems like a weird sotry.

Regulation is there and we have certificates that certify the rng used in most pokerstits.

There were also rooms in the past catering to riggies like real deal poker.

Guess what? Goal post were moved and the riggies turned on them and real deal was declared rigged too.

As soon as you run bad for a few days what ever system is used for dealing will be rigged too.

There is no standard of proof you would accept over the feeling of hey i am getting cheated here. i should be winning more.

Exploiting the rigged RNG

That’s some next level ****

Surely that is the most insane thing this thread has seen in years

Maybe you worked out that everything happens a % of the time

And you must have 2 million hand sample and god knows how you collected this data of this rigged RNG.

And I would also imagine that all poker sites rig the RNG with the same algorithm?

Or not?

Otherwise you would have to work out each rigged RNG

That is because I am not a closed-minded and opinionated conspiracy theorist, and I like to hear all sides of debates and arguments without unnecessary censorship and insult. Please think of me as a fair and objective chairperson facilitating inclusive discussions in a pub lock-in.

Where did I say this isnt a debate, you need to learn how to use the Quote-Button. Its very visible right beneath every post.

But kudos on you for going to the head teacher for the 10th time, you must have been a very popular kid 😉

Why even quote someone when there is literally only 1 thing you agree on him with? You know if you quote someone to brush up your own argument you seek connectivity to him. But the only good Galfond has ever said is that yes hypothetically poker could be rigged. OK, that makes sense because that is extremely selective and thats how we have gotten to know you.
Also, we didnt discuss the fees involved. You've invented some numbers that twister players played 20 an hour while tournament players 1table. This is so far from the truth. Tournament players multitable and pay way higher entry fees, often with rebuy. And thats besides the fact that the number of entries for tournaments is 20 times bigger than that of twister. And besides the fact that cash games are also way more popular and they multi table more. You also said that twister is targeted towards recreational gamblers; Who play less tables simultaneously than pro's and also play less hours than pro's so again there is way more volume on the tournaments and cash games.
You cant just blurt out random thought and lies that fit your narrative and say we've discussed it so we've dealt with it. Something could be dealt with if you show any evidence of your ramblings that would end the discussion. But god knows you will never ever do that.

Why does the successful multiple business owner with business qualifications need to grind out rigged micros for some holiday money?
Do you ever get the feeling that what you are saying isnt believable

What a saint you are. The hero this poker world so desperately needs.
He will do anything for the victims of evil poker sites.
Anything.
Except do research of course.
Or post that that research.
Or show any data or facts.
Or quit playing on the evil sites.
Because lets face it, you will not go back on your stance. You already "concluded" that poker is rigged (even though you also claim it cant be proven either way).
So there is absolutely no need for you to continue playing on these rigged sites.
But you still do.
How is that raising awareness for helpless poker victims around the world?
They might think you are the liar after all.
And they would be right.

The funny thing is, they never rig a mid or high stakes player. They always rig against random microstakes players.
And not only that, these microstakes players face the same rig on every site.
Talk about some bad luck.

Actually most riggies have claimed this.
Mostly because if you look at their strategy and stats its easy to conclude they are bad poker players.
So if you say to them they are playing a very bad strategy they can reply, "no no my strategy isnt bad, I alter it towards the rigged RNG."
But then you take a look at how that exploiting goes and its not going great.
Dear old Johnmir knew the algorithm so well and adjusted his ranges so well he was able to grind out a solid -20bb/100 lossrate at 10nl 🙂

Oh there is so much data collected by these heroes. But inexplicably we have never seen a shred of all this data.
Its just the darnest thing.
Its almost like the data isnt there or something.

Yep i didnt think anyone would mention the fact that regulation, regulated by someone who understood poker and had their own developed method of auditing, is clearly the way all poker players should be pushing for.

You much prefer the argument and throwing personal insults to our ways of life, than to players to be all agreed its random and to be able to play with confidence in that fact......

How many more are going to ask for 'data', when there is no program that exists available that can even get close to deciphering it!

If Pokerstars for example had conclusive proof, i think they might just share this..... But hey, they choose to let the internet and 50% of players talk about their business negatively for 25yrs instead!

But even when Pokerstars dont have it, Slugant thinks a single recreational player can do this 'easily'

The Moderator keeps bangin on about 'conspiracy theorists', Bob the Slob about 'rigtards', Slugant endless requests for 'proof'....... All these things can be eradicated just by proper regulation.

But these people mysteriously dont want the decks to be audited by someone with Poker knowledge, who would be willing to fully explain what testing relates to (testing houses refuse to answer at present, great that) ... or even respond to the suggestion of it.

Again. i ask , why is that? Takes a 25yr old debate out the equation, all players equal, all 100% confident that it is random.... but you would rather argue for another 3600 pages. Makes complete sense, well done!

PS Slugant, you can question peoples personal life all you like...... i mean we could suggest the fact you claim your a successful poker player is 'lies', as there is zero proof of this either ... a word you like to use without knowing anything about people....

Sometimes i wonder how so many people like TheWaddy exist. Then i remember..... most people lose at poker.

Slugant just loves a mammoth post repeating himself with every word, asking questions that have been answered sooooooo many times! And then the 'games based on poker players' pull ME up for having a screw loose.... funny!!!

Love the fact Slugant says first line; First off, there isnt such a thing as a poker regulator.....

That should have really been the end of the post, as this is the only thing online poker needs to have 50% of interested parties on board..... then we had an essay of repeated ****

Yeah, it's always about maximizing that sweet rake and those sweet entry fees but they got to do it sneaky down in the micros where they make at least $10k (maybe even 20) more a month lol.

I can stop asking when one riggie delivers data, but for some strange reason they never do
Even when its their mission to protect new players from "magical decks" they never show data of this rigged deck.
Even though avalanches of 1-4 outers isnt particularly hard to show in numbers. A child could do this. But riggies somehow cant.
So no, we havent seen answers.

Yes we have never discussed to why i wouldnt spend months getting data together at all. You are right (god bless him, hes ill).

vVLADv said; (I'm not a losing player, in case anyone's planning to gaslight me.)

LOL i will get you a fire blanket my friend.... be prepared to be announced as a big liar, they will simply not accept a winning player can question the decks.

What are you talking about spending months to get data together?
Sky poker stores hand histories on your PC as so almost all other major networks.
Its just a case of downloading a tracker, importing those hand histories and show the result.
It literally takes minutes.

But for the newcomers and beginners in poker it must be good to hear that their savior whose mission it is to warn them about the magical deck doesnt feel like putting in a little effort himself.

This is such a blinkered and poor response ive seen a hundred times.... they always quote a small game... the decks run the same in every game, at all levels, across the whole sites.

Just because someone notices and plays in a game you find as low stakes, of course they are not claiming its just their game being targeted.... nor does it make it not valid....decks running with a percentage against normal variance is completely site-wide, therefore massively benefitting the site in its need to retain customers, increase rake and provide their biggest volume player 'bonuses'.

As others have said, completely licence risk-free as regulation stands. Even Slugant has admitted there 'is no poker regulator', there is absolutely no-one looking at decks in a poker-related way (testing houses simply check for how often each card comes out in an acceptable manner, NOT how it affects the hand and the odds involved). Even someone with the most conclusive hand proof the RNG was rigged, would find that there is no Regulatory body that operates that has any software, or even know how to decipher that information to take any action.

What you are believing is that companies with track records of mutil million pound fines in their rule breaking in other aspects of online poker, would not take advantage of the lack of deck regulation for their own gain.... even though the stuff regulation is clear on, they endlessly break those rules fully knowing the consequences. Its quite some naive trust.

It's not true, they don't allow you to download hand histories... see Coin Poker. They told me on March 13th. Now they don't even respond anymore... see Poker Dom etc etc. H2Note and other poker software must have been idiots to put their program in beta testing for free for such a long time... These people at Coin Poker, on the other hand, are rushing to do what? Maybe they're cheating and then disappearing??
And in any case, no company is so idiotic as to allow you to cheat, if they simply have to allow whales to play with absurd hands and situations where he is the king, then they target accounts with high EVs to allow these fish to continue playing!! And I remember that many rooms openly say that they protect the fish!! Obviously they don't say that they can influence by bypassing the RNG. Without excluding the RNG function... I remember that Full Tilt was a huge company... and even small companies like Lock Poker were going in the same direction... but who is left? Only Poker Stars, spotless clean... it will happen again!! Rigged, no! Controlled, well, there are companies that should be carefully examined by us players... and not dismissed as nonsense!!

Obviously I'm fomenting the rumor that online poker is rigged for newbies... at least that's what I understood from your post.
I don't understand who you're talking about. I use H2Note 4 and Holden Manager 3. I'm an amateur, I admit it! I'm trying to build my own game. Let's forget about senseless things like how they make you load your hands! It depends on the room. I can't show other stats because my 2025 database was screwed by a virus. However, I'm starting to have an almost decent sample for 2 months of play. I won't be as good as you! I admit it! But maybe I know a little what I'm doing!! Not in words, numbers!! The incompetent savior shows the reports!!I'm posting a graph with only the all in pre flop... to help you understand when you put yourself in the server's hand and don't bring your hand post flop!!

Im going to do this one last time, although its the same question x 45 ....as i feel its wrong to mock the afflicted.

I dont use a poker tracker, have no need for one. Ive told you this numerous times alzheimers boy. Again, you are asking a recreational player to prove something (via a modest tracker), something Pokerstars are not able to prove.... and thats why this thread rumbles on.

If i play in a MTT and i see a hand AK v 66 all in preflop and i fold 8 5.... the flop comes AK4.... turn 6 ....river 7..... AK flops big, 66 turns set, i would have rivered straight.... Which in the case of Skys nightly freeroll (which ive invited you to watch) will be just about every few minutes.... what does your eyes and the deck tell you is happening, which a tracker doesnt?

Does the tracker tell you the odds of seeing 20 similar played out hands out of each 50 dealt? No. Does your eyes tell you its complete rubbish? Yes. Does the maths of it say its rubbish? Yes. A tracker will just anaylse this hand very black and white, without identifying it as an unusual hand all round.

So your tracker does not tell you the real picture or offer any odds to how unlikely seeing so many of these hands is. This is just ONE EXAMPLE of why a tracker is no proof of anything. As we have already determined, there is no software that exists that will take into account all factors.

25yrs has passed, Pokerstars and the likes argue its random but can not offer anything as proof other than 'a certificate from a testing house that refuses to disclose what tests they do'.

Slugant, a player that name does not exist, has some kind of memory disability and is barely 16 though.... says its very easy to prove. History says not. This is a fact and you like facts.