2024 ELECTION THREAD
The next presidential race will be here soon! Please see current Bovada odds. Thoughts?
Trump largely governed as a standard Republican. There were only a few policy-related things separating Trump and, say, Mittens Romney. Trade war/protectionist stuff is the big one.
On the other hand, there's the Tax Bill/tax cuts for the wealthy, standard MIC positions, including fealty to Israel, not ACTUALLY fighting against Obamacare (despite campaigning on it to rile up the rubes), and however many other things, all of which would be found in a Marco Rubio Presidency.
And, regardless of ho
Yes trump moved far to the left on the Washington consensus package. He did things Sanders asked for , for decades.
The rest was normal American center - right politics.
Mc Cain as a war criminal, politico in 2008 made a list
Romney and McCain were criticized by MSM, especially those outlets with left-leaning editorial pages, but they were not routinely characterized as unfit or as threats to Democratic norms.
Romney and McCain, maybe not, but on a related note, can you remind me which recent Republican POTUS ACTUALLY stole an election? Here I was, thinking that fair elections comprised a large amount of the field of "democratic norms" (your usage should be of the small D as well). I forget the name, it's such ancient history that none of us were alive for, but I've been at the library combing the microfiche and don't recall this mystery President receiving 1/10th of the "he's ending democracy!" panic that Donald Trump has received.
i hate trump but seriously hard lol at this
one bucked the party, completely disrupted it despite all their opposition and eventually took it over
the other was anointed by the party - first chosen as vp despite bringing nothing to the table other than fulfilling biden's openly stated requirement that his vp be a black woman and then was just crowned the candidate despite that everyone and their mother knows there's zero chance she'd have prevailed in an open primary - the party even made gavin ne
i have no idea what any of that has to do with Trump being bought and paid for by foreign governments and oligarchs. you can just look at the people and governments that are paying him legalized bribe money for his real estate to see that.
the Biden/Harris ticket overwhelmingly won the primary. everyone that voted fully knew it was a Biden/Harris ticket and that Harris would be the one to step up in the event that Biden couldn't continue for whatever reason. it was perfectly democratic. every candidate in that same open primary that you think she would have lost didn't have the guts to challenge her. the idea that she is some how not the democratically elected candidate is some dumb maga talking point.
Robert Reich (one of the stereotypical bad faith poisonous and toxic democrats that make tens of millions of people hate democrats from the bottom of their hearts) in 2012
Secretary for Bill Clinton, economic advisers to Obama. Can't claim he wasn't at the deep core of the democratic party, a pillar of it.
You and Tuma are both wrong imo. The MSM is comprised of individual human beings, a majority of whom want Trump to lose. But if he wins, they of course will enjoy the clicks that a Trump presidency inevitably generates through chaos and buffoonery.
no one is talking about individual reporters.. of course individual human beings have thoughts, why would that even be considered a talking point?
FOX, ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN, even MSNBC relish the idea of another trump presidency.
Mc Cain as a war criminal, politico in 2008 made a list
LOL. This is the best you came up with? The article is simply describing the chatter on the far left, not endorsing it. If I were McCain, and I read this article, I wouldn't even be upset. Do you also think that articles in the MSM that describe QANON are endorsing QANON?
i have no idea what any of that has to do with Trump being bought and paid for by foreign governments and oligarchs. you can just look at the people and governments that are paying him legalized bribe money for his real estate to see that.
the Biden/Harris ticket overwhelmingly won the primary. everyone that voted fully knew it was a Biden/Harris ticket and that Harris would be the one to step up in the event that Biden couldn't continue for whatever reason. it was perfectly democratic. every
I got told in this forum by "real experts" that Biden run in the primary without the Harris name on its side, and he could have chosen a different running mate if he so had wished.
That was when months ago I claimed that no other name other than Harris was a legitimate choice if Biden stepped down, given the votes in the primaries.
no one is talking about individual reporters.. of course individual human beings have thoughts, why would that even be considered a talking point?
FOX, ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN, even MSNBC relish the idea of another trump presidency.
I wasn't talking solely about the reporters. I would bet a lot of money that a majority of the management at all those outlets (except Fox, of course) voted against Trump in the last two presidential elections.
LOL. This is the best you came up with? The article is simply describing the chatter on the far left, not endorsing it. If I were McCain, and I read this article, I wouldn't even be upset. Do you also think that articles in the MSM that describe QANON are endorsing QANON?
Ofc politico isn't endorsing it.
But lol at you protecting behind "far left". If someone is pro Obama and says that mc Cain is a war criminal, that's the democratic party saying that he is a war criminal, not "the far left".
If someone who calls Obama a warmonger also calls mc Cain a war criminal, that would qualify under your exception. But that's not what happened.
If 30 millions of Obama voters are very leftists, the democratic party was very leftist in 2008.
They always demonized the candidate. Always. There is no legitimate rightwing politician in the eyes of a growing number of democratic voters. They are truly antidemocratic, they think being rightwing is illegal and should be criminalized.
LOL. This is the best you came up with? The article is simply describing the chatter on the far left, not endorsing it. If I were McCain, and I read this article, I wouldn't even be upset. Do you also think that articles in the MSM that describe QANON are endorsing QANON?
Luciom has been on a desperate mission recently to make out that all criticisms of the right apply equally to the left, as evidenced by his performance in the other thread regarding supposedly fake images of KH crowd size, accusations that "you guys always lie about everything" and general continuing #bothsides brain****ery. It's going about as well as one might imagine.
Mc Cain as a war criminal, politico in 2008 made a list
Thanks, so the answer is exactly zero mainstream media outlets called McCain a war criminal. The closest was a guest blog post on HuffPo (and it's a stretch to call HuffPo mainstream media in the first place) that didn't even call him a war criminal, just questioned whether his full record should be released and that it might look bad for his qualifications if it was.
Luciom has been on a desperate mission recently to make out that all criticisms of the right apply equally to the left, as evidenced by his performance in the other thread regarding supposedly fake images of KH crowd size, accusations that "you guys always lie about everything" and general continuing #bothsides brain****ery. It's going about as well as one might imagine.
For many things the left is infinitely worse than the right has ever been so please don't characterize my take as "both sides are equally bad".
The left is usually a lot worse than the right on many/most things.
Currently the american left is saving itself (in my eyes) basically only on Ukraine (which for me counts a lot to be fair).
But on almost everything else they are similar, and often a lot worse than republicans, for me.
They had tariffs until recently then Biden went crazy with a 100% tariff on Chinese EV, managed to do worse than Trump on that
For many things the left is infinitely worse than the right has ever been so please don't characterize my take as "both sides are equally bad".
The left is usually a lot worse than the right on many/most things.
Currently the american left is saving itself (in my eyes) basically only on Ukraine (which for me counts a lot to be fair).
But on almost everything else they are similar, and often a lot worse than republicans, for me.
They had tariffs until recently then Biden went crazy with a 100% tariff
You're of course entitled to your opinion, but making **** up to prove your point puts you in the Brian James and Playbig category of posters. Is that where you want to be?
Ofc politico isn't endorsing it.
But lol at you protecting behind "far left". If someone is pro Obama and says that mc Cain is a war criminal, that's the democratic party saying that he is a war criminal, not "the far left".
If someone who calls Obama a warmonger also calls mc Cain a war criminal, that would qualify under your exception. But that's not what happened.
If 30 millions of Obama voters are very leftists, the democratic party was very leftist in 2008.
They always demonized the candidate.
I seem to remember George bush was fine ?
But then jfc George w. Bush and trump is the best they could come up with? lol
That is your barometer for generalization ??
Change your rulers or your nominees ffs if u want to generalize
Obviously yes
Edit: @d2
Mc Cain as a war criminal, politico in 2008 made a list
I would dispute that Politico is a main stream media source, but we'll go with it. Here's the headline -
Some on left target McCain’s war record (it's even in your link)
Not exactly the publication calling him a war criminal.
Robert Reich (one of the stereotypical bad faith poisonous and toxic democrats that make tens of millions of people hate democrats from the bottom of their hearts) in 2012
Secretary for Bill Clinton, economic advisers to Obama. Can't claim he wasn't at the deep core of the democratic party, a pillar of it.
The Nation is definitely not MSM. But let's continue to roll with it. An opinion piece from a Democrat? I can find opinion pieces in the Washington Post and New York Times that say things just as bad about Kamala Harris without even trying.
You need to do better.
A far right Italian spending this much time and energy shitposting about American politics on a poker forum is deeply weird
I can’t even imagine spending this much energy debating Italian politics at all much less debating Italian politics on a baking forum
You're of course entitled to your opinion, but making **** up to prove your point puts you in the Brian James and Playbig category of posters. Is that where you want to be?
What did I "make up"? Leftists voters agitated against mc Cain because "he was a war criminal" and against Romney because he was " a robber Baron".
They also demonized bush Jr on all kind of ways.
It has been 20+ years since the left didn't deny a democratic legitimacy of rightwing policy positions.
They have been allin against anything actually rightwing, not just because they disagree, but painting it as a threat to democracy and illegitimate as a proposal, since I was an adult.
They did the same with Berlusconi in Italy btw
A far right Italian spending this much time and energy shitposting about American politics on a poker forum is deeply weird
I can’t even imagine spending this much energy debating Italian politics at all much less debating Italian politics on a baking forum
You gotta wonder how much he's getting paid.
I also wonder how his written english is so good, being an Italian and all.
A far right Italian spending this much time and energy shitposting about American politics on a poker forum is deeply weird
I can’t even imagine spending this much energy debating Italian politics at all much less debating Italian politics on a baking forum
Well, to be fair, American politics is slightly more consequential for the rest of the world than some old pervert banging underage hookers or whatever happens in their politics over there.
Romney and McCain, maybe not, but on a related note, can you remind me which recent Republican POTUS ACTUALLY stole an election? Here I was, thinking that fair elections comprised a large amount of the field of "democratic norms" (your usage should be of the small D as well). I forget the name, it's such ancient history that none of us were alive for, but I've been at the library combing the microfiche and don't recall this mystery President receiving 1/10th of the "he's ending democracy!" pan
As much as I am repulsed by Kathleen Harris, and as dismayed as I was by the SCOTUS decision in Bush v. Gore, you really can't compare Bush's behavior in connection with the 2000 election to Trump's behavior in connection with the 2020 election.
If you wanted to argue that Bush was a more destructive president than Trump because of the Iraq War, I would be more sympathetic.
