President Elon Musk
He probably deserves his own thread at this point, discuss accordingly
Who does that? for the USA the claim that the economy is good is predicated on many things that don't involve the top1%, rather the top 10-25% , but also overall unemployment, median household income and a lot more, all broad society-wide numbers.
Baham and all who claims the top 1% having all the money is the best way to run an economy for all ….
But yes, the lack of emphasis on religion, philosophy and the arts is a problem.
"During the last century, and part of the one before, it was widely held that there was an unreconcilable conflict between knowledge and belief. The opinion prevailed among advanced minds that it was time that belief should be replaced increasingly by knowledge; belief that did not itself rest on knowledge was superstition, and as such had to be opposed. According to this conception, the sole function of education wa
Well when u look at today , u really think we had too much knowledge in school instead of belief ?
Probably why qanon , conspiracy theories , or believing non science stuff is so highly valued and trusted ….
Your point makes no sense at all empirically .
And just look at how people gets screwed economically, because there isn’t religion in school or because there is no simple economic knowledge really thought in school ?
As previously stated, students shouldn't be indoctrinated, but the lack of education on the subject has lead to widespread ignorance in both religious and secular populations. How do we understand the present if we haven't learned about the past? It's arguably the most influential aspect of our history, and religious themes are present throughout culture to this day, but most people are unable to recognize them because they never studied religion.
Also as previously stated, we're talking about Oklahoma here. It would be nice to teach them a bunch of things....but when 2/3 of students don't even have access to calculus or physics, adding a deep dive into the cultural anthropology of religion as a required part of the curriculum seems like being way behind and trying to catch up by going slower.
Fairly sure the Greeks and Romans regarded the Trojan War as historical and recognised the currently known site as 'Troias / Ilion / Ilium'. Legends usually come from somewhere rather than nowhere. Lancelot and the Round Table were invented by a French poet, but the Arthurian legend probably stems from the historical battle of Badon in c.500AD. Homer's characters may be made up, but the Trojan War (or wars, because it could have happened more than once) may not be.
i rest my case ed
Pauperist christianity never had any significant hold over anglo christians, and it disappeared from mainstream catholic circles around the 15th century as well.
Savonarola, an ante litteram marxist, was burnt alive because of his leftism by the church.
You think you are playing a game you invented but the game has been played since the beginning of christianity and pragmatist people won a long ago (which is why christianity is still around, obviously redicolous ideologies that put you at a disadv
What are you talking about ….
We speak about freakn Jesus ( or god or w.e u name it ) not pope or Anglican Church …
Now only one version of Jesus is good and it’s the one u decided to like huh …..
But ok let’s take King James Bible …
https://quod.lib.umich.edu/k/kjv/browse....
proverbs 3[27]
Withhold not good from them to whom it is due, when it is in the power of thine hand to do it.
[28] Say not unto thy neighbour, Go, and come again, and to morrow I will give; when thou hast it by thee.
proverbs 11[25]
The liberal soul shall be made fat: and he that watereth shall be watered also himself.
proverbs 19[17]
He that hath pity upon the poor lendeth unto the LORD; and that which he hath given will he pay him again.
Deuteronomy 15[11]
For the poor shall never cease out of the land: therefore I command thee, saying, Thou shalt open thine hand wide unto thy brother, to thy poor, and to thy needy, in thy land.
Deuteronomy 22[4]
Thou shalt not see thy brother's ass or his ox fall down by the way, and hide thyself from them: thou shalt surely help him to lift them up again.
proverbs 22[9]
[9] He that hath a bountiful eye shall be blessed; for he giveth of his bread to the poor.
proverbs 29[7]
7] The righteous considereth the cause of the poor: but the wicked regardeth not to know it.
Are you a wicked Luciom ?
Leviticus25[25] If thy brother be waxen poor, and hath sold away some of his possession, and if any of his kin come to redeem it, then shall he redeem that which his brother sold.
Leviticus25[35]
And if thy brother be waxen poor, and fallen in decay with thee; then thou shalt relieve him: yea, though he be a stranger, or a sojourner; that he may live with thee.
That must of hurt ….
isaiah 25[4]
For thou hast been a strength to the poor, a strength to the needy in his distress, a refuge from the storm, a shadow from the heat, when the blast of the terrible ones is as a storm against the wall.
Again
isaiah 58[10]
And if thou draw out thy soul to the hungry, and satisfy the afflicted soul; then shall thy light rise in obscurity, and thy darkness be as the noonday:
And again ..
I absolutely refuse to waste a second of my time explaining or defending the following statement so spare yourself if you’re gonna @ me:
The idea that the Bible must be taught in American public schools because (insert literally any rationalization) is without question the stupidest **** I have ever heard
You want me to @ you, and you know it... Must? No. But it's a good idea unless you want an ignorant population that gets all of their information from social media and YouTube debates. And while I do think the Bible and Christianity should be the main focus in the US given our history, other religions should be explored as well.
Well when u look at today , u really think we had too much knowledge in school instead of belief ?
Probably why qanon , conspiracy theories , or believing non science stuff is so highly valued and trusted ….
Your point makes no sense at all empirically .
And just look at how people gets screwed economically, because there isn’t religion in school or because there is no simple economic knowledge really thought in school ?
Doesn't it? Maybe the reason unscientific beliefs and nonsensical theories are so widespread is because we haven't spent enough energy teaching kids how to think or letting them develop as individuals. It would be good to expose them to different ideas, challenge those, and allow them to explore the ideas and thought processes for themselves and come to their own conclusions. They'd get some things wrong, as we all do, but at least they'd have been given the tools. Once you paint someone into a corner, it's hard from them to get out.
Einstein's famous quote about imagination being more important than knowledge, since knowledge is limited and imagination encompasses the world, is lost on us. There's a lot we don't know, and we have to take chances and appreciate our intuitions if we want grow. Take a a piece of art. If you don't think the question "What does this mean to you?" is important, then you're dismissing half of who we are. We have rational minds as well as imaginative ones. Don't assume one is more important than the other.
Also as previously stated, we're talking about Oklahoma here. It would be nice to teach them a bunch of things....but when 2/3 of students don't even have access to calculus or physics, adding a deep dive into the cultural anthropology of religion as a required part of the curriculum seems like being way behind and trying to catch up by going slower.
Calculus itself is a deep dive, and its methods extend beyond the subject itself, just like everything else. An introductory class on Plato or Hume would be more beneficial than teaching every student calculus.
Well when u look at today , u really think we had too much knowledge in school instead of belief ?
Probably why qanon , conspiracy theories , or believing non science stuff is so highly valued and trusted ….
Your point makes no sense at all empirically .
And just look at how people gets screwed economically, because there isn’t religion in school or because there is no simple economic knowledge really thought in school ?
Here's the rest of the Einstein quote:
"It is true that convictions can best be supported with experience and clear thinking. On this point one must agree unreservedly with the extreme rationalist. The weak point of his conception is, however, this, that those convictions which are necessary and determinant for our conduct and judgments cannot be found solely along this solid scientific way.
For the scientific method can teach us nothing else beyond how facts are related to, and conditioned by, each other. The aspiration toward such objective knowledge belongs to the highest of which man is capable, and you will certainly not suspect me of wishing to belittle the achievements and the heroic efforts of man in this sphere. Yet it is equally clear that knowledge of what is does not open the door directly to what should be. One can have the clearest and most complete knowledge of what is, and yet not be able to deduct from that what should be the goal of our human aspirations. Objective knowledge provides us with powerful instruments for the achievements of certain ends, but the ultimate goal itself and the longing to reach it must come from another source. And it is hardly necessary to argue for the view that our existence and our activity acquire meaning only by the setting up of such a goal and of corresponding values. The knowledge of truth as such is wonderful, but it is so little capable of acting as a guide that it cannot prove even the justification and the value of the aspiration toward that very knowledge of truth. Here we face, therefore, the limits of the purely rational conception of our existence.
But it must not be assumed that intelligent thinking can play no part in the formation of the goal and of ethical judgments. When someone realizes that for the achievement of an end certain means would be useful, the means itself becomes thereby an end. Intelligence makes clear to us the interrelation of means and ends. But mere thinking cannot give us a sense of the ultimate and fundamental ends. To make clear these fundamental ends and valuations, and to set them fast in the emotional life of the individual, seems to me precisely the most important function which religion has to perform in the social life of man. And if one asks whence derives the authority of such fundamental ends, since they cannot be stated and justified merely by reason, one can only answer: they exist in a healthy society as powerful traditions, which act upon the conduct and aspirations and judgments of the individuals; they are there, that is, as something living, without its being necessary to find justification for their existence. They come into being not through demonstration but through revelation, through the medium of powerful personalities. One must not attempt to justify them, but rather to sense their nature simply and clearly..."
Calculus itself is a deep dive, and its methods extend beyond the subject itself, just like everything else. An introductory class on Plato or Hume would be more beneficial than teaching every student calculus.
High School Calculus is an intuition based overview and grab bag of useful techniques required to go further in most sciences and engineering. Sort of the opposite of a deep dive.
I used calculus, specifically Day 1 material, as a tool while battling mental illness. Specifically limits. Not kidding.
Essentially, I visualized my condition as a vector, and the limits both filled in the holes of my graph, and also kept me from getting too scared when things got bad. I always trusted the function would return to normal.
I used calculus, specifically Day 1 material, as a tool while battling mental illness. Specifically limits. Not kidding.
Essentially, I visualized my condition as a vector, and the limits both filled in the holes of my graph, and also kept me from getting too scared when things got bad. I always trusted the function would return to normal.
That's pretty cool.
High School Calculus is an intuition based overview and grab bag of useful techniques required to go further in most sciences and engineering. Sort of the opposite of a deep dive.
ecriture you will understand the world better the day you will be able to admit half of the population is under IQ 100 (and IQ 100 people are already pretty ******ed for your standards).
I know you are old but you can get this. o know you dislike me, but what I say is the actual objective truth.
a ton of people don't have the physical hardware to understand stuff that for you is "obvious". for them it's ancient greek
Here's the rest of the Einstein quote:
"It is true that convictions can best be supported with experience and clear thinking. On this point one must agree unreservedly with the extreme rationalist. The weak point of his conception is, however, this, that those convictions which are necessary and determinant for our conduct and judgments cannot be found solely along this solid scientific way.
For the scientific method can teach us nothing else beyond how facts are related to, and conditioned by, ea
Imagination is great to be used in a pragmatic way , like thinking out of the box to find solutions , artistic goals , etc .
I don’t think Einstein meant to use imagination as a way to manipulate people (with big deficiencies in logic , science literacy , etc) into non science facts , conspiracy theories etc for political and monetary gains ….
I mean maybe for the first time in history (beside Steve O /jacksss) being stupid and becoming rich is a valid career thx to YouTube ……
Imagination is great to be used in a pragmatic way , like thinking out of the box to find solutions , artistic goals , etc .
I don’t think Einstein meant to use imagination as a way to manipulate people (with big deficiencies in logic , science literacy , etc) into non science facts , conspiracy theories etc for political and monetary gains ….
I mostly agree with the first sentence and never argued the second one, but an emphasis on imagination and intuition would lead to less of those beliefs. Generally, education is too rigid and focuses so heavily objectivity (including the arts) that we don't really allow kids to challenge popular beliefs and figure things out for themselves. If we allowed more of that, they'd be better equipped at figuring out where and why they're wrong in future situations, and the unique insights they may have wouldn't be overlooked. When everything is "this is how x works" and "this is why y is true," they don't develop a creative side. Once school is out, it's up to them, but it would be better if they were able to go through more creative and imaginative exercises with teachers and other students. I'm not trying to minimize the importance of knowing, but it should be balanced with belief. For the most part, posters on this forum agree on the facts, but they have different beliefs, and the reason we're so divided is because we can't get past that.
High School Calculus is an intuition based overview and grab bag of useful techniques required to go further in most sciences and engineering. Sort of the opposite of a deep dive.
Yeah, I was conflating "advanced" with "deep dive." What I essentially was trying to say is that introductions to religion and philosophy should be taught around the same time as pre-algebra.
I mostly agree with the first sentence and never argued the second one, but an emphasis on imagination and intuition would lead to less of those beliefs. Generally, education is too rigid and focuses so heavily objectivity (including the arts) that we don't really allow kids to challenge popular beliefs and figure things out for themselves. If we allowed more of that, they'd be better equipped at figuring out where and why they're wrong in future situations, and the unique insights they may have
The problem is many « beliefs » are actually been proven wrong (or has hold very little value compare to the other side ) are still being successfully promoted not by a lack of imagination but through a lack of knowledge .
That’s the problem and religion fit right in that categories with those claim of creationism for example ….
Religion is personal matter solely based beliefs .
FWIW to me education should be made and based on real life and pragmatism.
Maybe we just disagree on what education should actually be ….
Economics, science , math , chemistry , medecine , English , arts , music etc.
No problem .
Even how to use a freak gun and the implications of it I would not mind compare to freakn religion that should be taught at home …like Santa Claus’s and Christmas .
Religion is is arbitrary , how many factions there is just in Christianity?
Just shows you how it should t have much value imo …
Religion and beliefs are two separate things.
Beliefs is what you think "God" is. Some people believe he's a man with a beard walking around in "heaven" holding a staff. Other people know "God" more like a Supreme Divine consciousness of love and Oneness that's a part of everyone and everything in the universe which we're all striving to get closer to (which is the belief of most other intelligent races).
Religion is a control mechanism. This is why the vatican removed a lot of the original books from the bible, to hide things from us so they can further reign control.
You can be spiritual and realize this divinity without being "religious".
Tell us more about these most intelligent races.
President Musk declared war to Labour
Elon Musk
@elonmusk
Starmer was complicit in the RAPE OF BRITAIN when he was head of Crown Prosecution for 6 years.
Starmer must go and he must face charges for his complicity in the worst mass crime in the history of Britain.
President Musk declared war to Labour
Elon Musk
@elonmusk
Starmer was complicit in the RAPE OF BRITAIN when he was head of Crown Prosecution for 6 years.
Starmer must go and he must face charges for his complicity in the worst mass crime in the history of Britain.
He's doing a good job of stopping reform
The problem is many « beliefs » are actually been proven wrong (or has hold very little value compare to the other side ) are still being successfully promoted not by a lack of imagination but through a lack of knowledge .
That’s the problem and religion fit right in that categories with those claim of creationism for example ….
I blame myself for not being clear. I'm not saying schools should teach Young Earth creationism any further than acknowledging that it's a thing. Students should be allowed to discuss its implications and understand why so many people believe in it, but factual information about the origin of Earth shouldn't be dismissed. When I talk about belief, I mean those things that there aren't objective answers to—not treating hard sciences as a matter of opinion. It's why philosophy and the arts were also mentioned.
Encouraging students to challenge teachers and the status quo and make their cases for why they believe what they believe would be a good thing. In most instances (on established objective facts), they'd be proven wrong, but they'd learn why they were wrong and develop thinking processes. If you're allowed to argue something and then be proven wrong, you'll know more about that thing compared to if you were just taught it and didn't really consider it. "Don't write a paper about why Earth is 4.5 billion years old. Write a paper on why it's six thousand years old, and I won't fail you or only focus on that because that's factually wrong..." How much effort did the student put into the paper? Did they make a rational argument? How good was their writing? Did they get most of their facts straight?... Let students rebel.
And then there are questions like: What do you think the author meant? What kind of world do you want to live in? And why? How do you think others feel about that? Why do you think that? Why is this a bad painting? If everyone else likes it, are you wrong? Is there at least something you like about it? Who's your favorite band? Why? Etc.
Religion is personal matter solely based beliefs .
FWIW to me education should be made and based on real life and pragmatism.
Maybe we just disagree on what education should actually be ….
It is a personal matter based on beliefs. There's also collective version. Is it that bad to focus on the personal? And some beliefs are based on knowledge.
Don't be so quick to dismiss it as not based on real life or having pragmatic applications. At the very least, it's real insofar as it has material consequences, and it's not hard to make pro religion arguments for individual and societal well-being.
Economics, science , math , chemistry , medecine , English , arts , music etc.
No problem .
Even how to use a freak gun and the implications of it I would not mind compare to freakn religion that should be taught at home …like Santa Claus’s and Christmas .
Religion is is arbitrary , how many factions there is just in Christianity?
Just shows you how it should t have much value imo …
Some of those categories are largely subjective. And don't forget the literary and historical sides of religion:
Where did these stories come from? What do they mean? Does that idea make sense?
What is the Reformation? And why is it important? Who's the Pope? Was George Washington a Christian?
Not that there isn't value to memorizing every state capital and knowing how many degrees are in a triangle.
What value is there having an opinion about religion ?
What pragmatism is there to be taught this at school ?
I think education should be about teaching stuff that could be useful in life .
Read , write, calculate , learn to think logically , developing skills in arts , music , etc .
U might think there is value in religion at school but I went to school you know , and the worst course i followed that bring absolutely nothing was something related to religion .
Especially when there been so many religions throughout history that end up being nothing .
Me having an opinion about religion at school and write an essay about it won’t help get a job or gaining skill to get a job that is for sure …
Anyway there is been like thousands of religions since the beginning of time without the need of being teach at school .
I’m sure people don’t need school today to learn about it when it’s been existing for thousands of years already shrug
Just proved imo how religion isn’t reliable having so many and failed already to explain anything real .
U believe religion is great for school thats fine, me I personally find it absolutely non productive at all shrug .
Lets leave it at that .
Santa Claus is real.
Um, is it okay to teach religion in a religion class, and not as a science?
