Israel/Palestine thread
Think this merits its own thread...
Discuss my fellow 2+2ers..
AM YISRAEL CHAI.
[QUOTE=Crossnerd]
Zionist means Israel has a right to exist
You do not believe Israel has a right to exist so you use the word as a euphemism to mean genocidal occupying power
no Zionist is a person who supports Zionism which is an ideology based on colonizing the land of Palestine and displacing/exterminating the population.
Occupying Power is a state illegally taking over parts of other sovereign states such as in Lebanon, Syria, and Palestine.
I dont think any state has a "right to exist". its a stupid thing to even consider. I think people have a right to exist. the ideology of Zionism disagrees that Palestinians have a right to exist. and later they will say the same about Lebanese, Syrians, Jordans, Egyptians.
the term genocide is an abstraction that doesnt specifically reflect the absolute wickedness and gleeful murderousness of Israel's actions the last year.
I find it disgusting that you are allowed to make false statements like this. But hey whatever helps you sleep at night
when you support a country doing genocide, there is going to be some criticism for that country. just take the win that you will be able to vacation in Gaza at some point soon!
So again
I'll bet you $1000 that there will be ZERO Israeli settlements in Gaza in the next 10 years, and that the gazan population will still live there
no Zionist is a person who supports Zionism which is an ideology based on colonizing the land of Palestine and displacing/exterminating the population.Occupying Power is a state illegally taking over parts of other sovereign states such as in Lebanon, Syria, and Palestine.I dont think any state has a "right to exist". its a stupid thing to even consider. I think people have a
The amusing thing about this is that Putin literally says Ukranians aren't a real thing and dont have a right to exist. And has been waging a horribly destructive war for 2+ years to make this a reality. And you are agnostic about this (at best).
So it doesn't appear you actually believe any of this as a first principle.
The amusing thing about this is that Putin literally says Ukranians aren't a real thing and dont have a right to exist. And has been waging a horribly destructive war for 2+ years to make this a reality. And you are agnostic about this (at best).
So it doesn't appear you actually believe any of this as a first principle.
they arent remotely the same. regardless, I dont support Putin's invasion and want a ceasefire.
Thank you for the ad hominem. See my reply to Dunyain for my views on why we are on the slippery slope to ethnic cleansing.Regarding the tunnels, my point is that engineering ops are not nearly enough to get the job done. Bigger sacrifices are necessary to 'eradicate Hamas,' i.e. sending units into the belly of the beast, getting to a similar level of knowledge of the system as
Not to nitpick but you are misusing the fallacy of ad hominem.
I was not addressing you, only your bat-**** crazy arguments.
You keep repeating how you think we operate regarding the tunnels. Again, you are misinformed and wrong.
You also are stating again what you think is our modus operandi and again you are wrong.
I will state this again and for the last time – we operate in every tunnel, except the ones in the areas the hostages are being held (for obv reasons).
no Zionist is a person who supports Zionism which is an ideology based on colonizing the land of Palestine and displacing/exterminating the population.Occupying Power is a state illegally taking over parts of other sovereign states such as in Lebanon, Syria, and Palestine.I dont think any state has a "right to exist". its a stupid thing to even consider. I think people have a
Hey Vic, just bought your new book. Great read so far
on a brighter side of things, we are heading straight into a constitutional crisis.
If Hamas and Hezbollah were smart, they would have just waited, till we collapse into civil war
on a brighter side of things, we are heading straight into a constitutional crisis.
If Hamas and Hezbollah were smart, they would have just waited, till we collapse into civil war
A few months ago Jordan Peterson did a podcast with former PM Bennett who was making this point. He actually made the point that both of the first 2 kingdoms lasted around as long as modern Israel, and collapsed in large part to internal infighting; so you would think there might be some self awareness and course correction because of this. But apparently not.
A few months ago Jordan Peterson did a podcast with former PM Bennett who was making this point. He actually made the point that both of the first 2 kingdoms lasted around as long as modern Israel, and collapsed in large part to internal infighting; so you would think there might be some self awareness and course correction because of this. But apparently not.
I wouldn’t deduce too much from the old kingdoms, but we are in a pickle, to say the least.
This time, our communication minister has declared he will not obey the ruling of the Supreme court.
Not that this particular government adheres to court rulings and to the principle of law, but most of the time they do it without declaring their intentions out loud.
Bibi is becoming a real-life cartoon villain (but not in the way Vic and company imagine)
no Zionist is a person who supports Zionism which is an ideology based on colonizing the land of Palestine and displacing/exterminating the population.
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That isn't the definition. That's your hateful anti Israel definition. But it is not the definition
The more you lie the more I'll respond
even wikipedia literally classifies it as a colonial movement. colonial movements necessarily involve cleansing and subjugation of populations.
even wikipedia literally classifies it as a colonial movement. colonial movements necessarily involve cleansing and subjugation of populations.
--Wikipedia is very anti-Israel, so finding someone with your same prejudices that comes to the same conclusions you do isn't very persuasive.
--Is Turkish nationalism a colonial movement? By every empirical standard it is more "colonial" and "genocidal" than Israel is. But you would be very hard pressed to get Wikipedia to acknowledge this.
Compare how neutral the wording in this article is compared to their critique of Zionism. Keep in mind "Turkish nationalism" of the 21st century resulted in the extermination and dislocation of literal millions of people belonging to other ethic groups residing in the former Ottoman Empire (exterminations still very much ongoing); and Wikipedia is remarkable sanguine on this point.
--One could also describe the modern day Chinese state as a colonial movement, with a tremendous amount of cleansing and subjugation of millions upon millions of non Han Chinese ; but given their prejudices Wikipedia isn't going to see things this way; and I doubt you do either.
I wouldn’t deduce too much from the old kingdoms, but we are in a pickle, to say the least.
Yeah. I wasn't suggesting reading the history of the old kingdoms would lead someone to any epiphany in how to handle the present, but it is interesting. Hopefully this version of Israel figures things out and lasts a couple hundred more years, and there is no parallels at all.
--Wikipedia is very anti-Israel, so finding someone with your same prejudices that comes to the same conclusions you do isn't very persuasive.
--When defending Trump, if someone says "even Fox News...", it isn't going to move the needle very much.
right...
I mean, just the other day I posted an Israeli article about how they are going to spend 250m on foreign propaganda.
are we really arguing the definition of Zionism through the lens of Wikipedia?
Vic, you are better than that
right... I mean, just the other day I posted an Israeli article about how they are going to spend 250m on foreign propaganda.
That is an old article. If your point is that Wikipedia has been biased against Israel for a very long time, despite efforts to correct this, I wont disagree with you.
are we really arguing the definition of Zionism through the lens of Wikipedia?
Vic, you are better than that
even wikipedia literally classifies it as a colonial movement. colonial movements necessarily involve cleansing and subjugation of populations.
Keeping the debate in where Wikipedia leans to aside, colonial is a negative word only for you guys on the left.
And it doesn't involve cleansing necessarily at all.
Most colonized areas on net gained massively from colonization, including Italy starting with Greek colonies.
The idea that colonization is unadulterated evil and necessarily immoral is a leftist one, it's part of the great scheme under which everything relevant the west did , often with incredibly good outcomes for everyone involved, gets distorted by revisionist attempts to rewrite history to put the west in a bad light.
And it all comes from the same place: Marxism.
Socialists realized long ago that they need to dismantle western culture to dismantle capitalism, because capitalism only works with the underpinning of western culture and moral values.
Their epic journey to defeat capitalism then necessarily passes through attacks to everything and everyone connected to western history.
